I usually agree with most of your posts but since you publicly went to a 9mm, posting multiple times about it......... I can’t even look at you man
Viability of *Real* Pocket (And Micro) Handguns in Today’s World
- Thread starter Mr. Mosin
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I usually agree with most of your posts but since you publicly went to a 9mm, posting multiple times about it......... I can’t even look at you man
Pocket-sized guns are, indeed, viable. Finding one that I could sufficiently brace against important contact points, in my hand, to enable a repeatable grip, took some trial and error. Finding one that allowed a “natural” trigger finger placement, and a trigger stroke conducive to a smooth, steady movement, was also part of that trial and error. Actually, one of the first pocket autos I tried, the Seecamp LWS-25, was an excellent fit, but, I wanted more than .25 ACP, and, I worked for a PD that specifically excluded the carry of .25 ACP weapons, on or off the clock. The advent of the Seecamp LWS-32, and, later the .380 version, enabled Seecamp pistols being viable options.
A pocket gun need not be tiny. Careful selection of trousers may enable one to pocket carry a Ruger SP101, or Glock G19. Yes, I typed “Glock G19.” One type of uniform trousers, issued to me, in the past, enabled pocketing a G19. It was more a case of temporary storage, of a spare weapon, than carry, as my duty holster blocked access to the right pocket, and my radio blocked access to the left pocket, but, yes, I could tote a G19, on each side, if I wanted.
For a while, Wrangler Riata slacks enabled front pocket carry of Ruger SP101 revolvers. I believe that the front pockets have, however, become smaller, in newer-production Riata slacks.
Pocket carry can present some challenges, to achieving an unimpeded draw, ff seated, and/or if bent at the hips or waist. This is a reason that I tend to carry two weapons, for accessibility options, if one of the weapons is pocketed. Others may choose to move the pocketed gun to a more-accessible position, while, for example, seated inside a vehicle.
A pocket gun need not be tiny. Careful selection of trousers may enable one to pocket carry a Ruger SP101, or Glock G19. Yes, I typed “Glock G19.” One type of uniform trousers, issued to me, in the past, enabled pocketing a G19. It was more a case of temporary storage, of a spare weapon, than carry, as my duty holster blocked access to the right pocket, and my radio blocked access to the left pocket, but, yes, I could tote a G19, on each side, if I wanted.
For a while, Wrangler Riata slacks enabled front pocket carry of Ruger SP101 revolvers. I believe that the front pockets have, however, become smaller, in newer-production Riata slacks.
Pocket carry can present some challenges, to achieving an unimpeded draw, ff seated, and/or if bent at the hips or waist. This is a reason that I tend to carry two weapons, for accessibility options, if one of the weapons is pocketed. Others may choose to move the pocketed gun to a more-accessible position, while, for example, seated inside a vehicle.
MedWheeler
Member
Old Dog writes:
If you have to access any firearm you're carrying, the same could be said.
If you have to access any firearm you're carrying, the same could be said.
MedWheeler
Member
Kleanbore writes:
(to my)
That still doesn't answer the question. If I can be harassed because my "risk assessment" tells me I'm fine with, say, a pocket-.380, how is that not a "different risk assessment" than the one made by the guy who won't leave home without a G17, three magazines, and a G26 for backup?
I'm certain that at least a few non-carrying owners face the same "actual" risk of becoming a crime victim as many of us.
CDW4ME actually answered the question, on his own behalf, at least.
(to my)
That still doesn't answer the question. If I can be harassed because my "risk assessment" tells me I'm fine with, say, a pocket-.380, how is that not a "different risk assessment" than the one made by the guy who won't leave home without a G17, three magazines, and a G26 for backup?
I'm certain that at least a few non-carrying owners face the same "actual" risk of becoming a crime victim as many of us.
CDW4ME actually answered the question, on his own behalf, at least.
Targa
Member
As long as you know your limitations, mine was a J frame S&W, I was not at all accurate with that thing. What ever your choice, accountability for the lead your slinging has to be a major factor if God forbid it ever came down to that.
trackskippy
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The pocket carried pistols are considerably slower to get into action, than a gun in a holster on your belt. The pockets hinder access, and the guns are smaller and harder to get a hold of and shoot.
If Tueller is a basis, you have a lot better chance at getting your full size gun into action in time, you most likely wont with a pocket gun.
243winxb
Member
The M60 was to heavy. The Regina 25
was better, till i seen the 10 oz 337PD. Love the 337PD carried in Uncle Mikes #3 pocket holster.
was better, till i seen the 10 oz 337PD. Love the 337PD carried in Uncle Mikes #3 pocket holster.MedWheeler
Member
trackskippy writes:
Yes, but the post I was addressing was itself addressing situational awareness, something that we should be striving to use to avoid needing whatever we're carrying.
Yes, but the post I was addressing was itself addressing situational awareness, something that we should be striving to use to avoid needing whatever we're carrying.
Actually, the opposite... The eco version!
I’m Glad some here want to Drive a Prius for efficiency. Some feel the need for a full size Suburban. I drive a short bed reg cab truck. It does what I need.
Lets remember we are all on the 2ndAmendment avenue, and No One should be told what to drive… and no need for driving Instructors- in a thread.
Carry as big as you can- Be aware and stay safe out there.
Ps- If some want to take public transportation- So be it
Lets remember we are all on the 2ndAmendment avenue, and No One should be told what to drive… and no need for driving Instructors- in a thread.
Carry as big as you can- Be aware and stay safe out there.
Ps- If some want to take public transportation- So be it
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trackskippy
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As I said before, the guy not carrying the gun has nothing in it.
If youre gong to carry a gun, why wouldnt you carry the one you shoot best with, and gives you the best chance at prevailing? Thats the question.
This isnt about fashion and being cool because you carry a gun, which for many, seems to be the case, its about being realistic with yourself as to why you carry it, and choosing something that will allow you the best chance, should you need it.
It seems like "statistics" is more of a base for gun selection for a lot of people than anything else. Just like why youre told that the statistics say a 5 shooter is more than sufficient in "most cases" because youll only need 3 rounds, youre often told that a small gun is better for the same reason. The chances of needing them is slim, so why bother trying to carry/hide a larger gun?
Are you carrying the gun because you plan on needing it, or what? If chances are that slim, why bother? If you think you might need it, dont you want the gun that will give you the best chance?
This afternoon, you will be in a gunfight of someone elses choosing. You have a pick of two guns, A SIG P226, or a Ruger LCP. What do you choose?
Careful, its a trick question.
trackskippy
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Situational awareness is just part of the whole package. Avoiding the fight is always the goal.
As much as we might like to think we are always situationally aware, we are usually far from it. Thats just living life. You try your best to be, but anyone being the least bit realistic with themselves knows, its not possible to live your life and be completely aware. Just not possible, gun or not.
One would not normally choose a firearm for civilian self defense on the basis of risk assessment. Rather, one chooses the gun to mitigate a risk that will have already occurred.
My comment was about those who elect to not carry at all--to accept unmitigated the risk of being victimized in a violent criminal attack. They constitute the majority of handgun owners. Those whom I know believe that the effort required to train, practice and carry outweighs the benefit of mitigating the risk of attack.
So am I.
I usually agree with most of your posts but since you publicly went to a 9mm, posting multiple times about it......... I can’t even look at you man
I've carried Glock 19 quite a bit, but Glock 32 (357 Sig) is more likely than the 19.
I usually just say a Glock 19 is the minimum I carry wherever because most are familiar with a 19 not a 32.
I seldom mention Kahr PM9 in weak hand pocket that's 2nd option to the Glock IWB, don't want to seem over the top to those who struggle to carry 1 decent gun.
I do risk assessment.
I assess that if I have to defend my life against a threat (risk) I want at least a Glock 19 in hand regardless of if I'm in a nice spot.
trackskippy
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Ive carried in NPE's most of my life with the risk of termination and/or arrest. And most of that was with a full sized hand gun.
I also started doing that back in the 70's, where there was not a whole lot of choices when it came to holsters. Whats available today is really amazing in comparison, and if you cant find a holster to accommodate you, you really arent trying too hard.
The only person limiting you from carrying what you want, is you.
I also started doing that back in the 70's, where there was not a whole lot of choices when it came to holsters. Whats available today is really amazing in comparison, and if you cant find a holster to accommodate you, you really arent trying too hard.
The only person limiting you from carrying what you want, is you.
The other choice is to not carry, and if I have agreed to comply with that tule, that is what I'll do.
crstrode
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ojibweindian
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No.
trackskippy
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NPE= Non-Permissive Environment
Next time, that'll cost you a buck.
Next time, that'll cost you a buck.
Limited by work clothes is literally a "best you can do" situation.
I try to say "If not limited by work attire" in my replies.
For years I worked where carry was a felony and discontentedly the best I could do was a pocket 380 after work in crappy work clothes (tucked shirt).
Best I could do and best I was willing to do were completely different, on non-work days I did not limit myself to the pocket 380.
So, do the best you can whether at work (if that is no gun then its no gun) or not at work (what handgun would I prefer to defend myself with).
Hypothetically lets say someone works in a NPE (prohibited but not illegal) and they are willing to risk termination to carry - Smartcarry PM9 or LCP pocket 380.
On non-work days to they content themself with pocket 380 for a trip to the store in "good area" or do they carry a 9mm? Which would be preferred to defend self?
Tallball
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In the summer I carry an LCR in the cargo pocket of shorts. I have long arms and my hands are practically touching the grip when I'm standing. I can draw it at least as fast as from a belt holster.
In the winter I sometimes carry an LCPII in a breast pocket. Again, it is easy and quick to draw. I don't think I can draw any faster from a belt holster under a cover garment.
For a good draw, the handgun and (especially) holster have to fit your pocket just right. Mine are flap pockets left open. It's amazing that no one ever sees that I'm carrying, but they don't. My daughter knows that I carry and has mentioned how difficult it is to see that I am. I carried my LCR in cargo pants on a two-day car trip with a friend and he didn't know.
And sort of back on topic....
I am a friendly acquaintance of the man who owns the LGS. He was showing an LCP to a customer, who was asking how easy it might be to conceal. I asked the customer if he could see mine. He said no. I thought it would be poor etiquette to touch it, but I looked down pointedly and dropped my shoulder so that my pocket opened a bit. He saw a corner of the butt showing and understood. I believe that my friend made the sale.
I have really liked my P3AT and LCP handguns. They are easy to carry, I can shoot them decently, and I am okay with 380acp.
I don't carry my P32. It's even more convenient, but no sights and I don't prefer to carry 32acp.
I've never even considered carrying a 22 or a 25.
To each his own. I think it's interesting when we share our carry methods and maybe learn something from each other.
In the winter I sometimes carry an LCPII in a breast pocket. Again, it is easy and quick to draw. I don't think I can draw any faster from a belt holster under a cover garment.
For a good draw, the handgun and (especially) holster have to fit your pocket just right. Mine are flap pockets left open. It's amazing that no one ever sees that I'm carrying, but they don't. My daughter knows that I carry and has mentioned how difficult it is to see that I am. I carried my LCR in cargo pants on a two-day car trip with a friend and he didn't know.
And sort of back on topic....
I am a friendly acquaintance of the man who owns the LGS. He was showing an LCP to a customer, who was asking how easy it might be to conceal. I asked the customer if he could see mine. He said no. I thought it would be poor etiquette to touch it, but I looked down pointedly and dropped my shoulder so that my pocket opened a bit. He saw a corner of the butt showing and understood. I believe that my friend made the sale.
I have really liked my P3AT and LCP handguns. They are easy to carry, I can shoot them decently, and I am okay with 380acp.
I don't carry my P32. It's even more convenient, but no sights and I don't prefer to carry 32acp.
I've never even considered carrying a 22 or a 25.
To each his own. I think it's interesting when we share our carry methods and maybe learn something from each other.
Armored farmer
Member
I get a vision of some people who constantly live in fear. Johnny two guns roll stepping through the mall with his duty size gun at the low ready with a stern look on his face. Head on a swivel.
Is that how we're supposed to live?
I guess Im doing it wrong.
Is that how we're supposed to live?
I guess Im doing it wrong.
trackskippy
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Youre already carrying a gun. Are you living in fear?
Whats it matter what you carry, as long as youre realistic about it and what your skills are with it. Just because you have a gun, doesnt really mean a whole lot, it just means you have a gun. I think a lot of people seem to think, thats good enough, I got a gun. The question is, is it the right or enough gun, and are good with it?
If youre going to bother carrying one, why wouldnt it be the one you shoot the best with, and all the time? Or is this about something else?
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