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Went to my first gun show yesterday and scored some IMI .357 Magnum +P. Questions!

Discussion in 'Handguns: Revolvers' started by intercooler, Apr 3, 2011.

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  1. intercooler

    intercooler member

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    I mainly got it due to the +P.... I like the hot stuff!! I have a Ruger GP100 and Ruger members say I better not shoot it. It is 170gr +P and also says Match Grade on the box. Distributed by Samson. I really want to shoot it but not at risking injury or destruction. I can't find any info and even sent IMI an e-mail.

    Anyone have Chrony or info on what to expect from this ammo?

    Is the +P more of a marketing gimmick?
     
  2. The Lone Haranguer

    The Lone Haranguer Member

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    It would have to be, because AFAIK there is no SAAMI standard for a +P .357 Magnum. :scrutiny: In fact, that would be oxymoronic. In any event, your hand will probably give out before a Ruger GP100 will. :cool:
     
  3. Drail

    Drail Member

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    While Ruger's GP 100 is indeed a very fine and strong revolver if fed enough of the "hot" stuff you most certainly can wear one out. I have one that if I put it on a table for sale, one good look at the forcing cone and the ratchet peened breech face you would set it down and walk away. +P loads in a 357. Mag are totally unnecessary and a steady diet is hard on any revolver. I used to think they were "fun" also but I finally learned.
     
  4. intercooler

    intercooler member

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    I may get a chance to pop one of today to see. I wouldn't feed it a steady diet of these but a couple everytime out.
     
  5. SaxonPig

    SaxonPig Member

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    +P Magnums? Never heard of it. I bet it is simply loaded to max pressure and they call it +P. Most ammo has been down-loaded in recent years on advice of legal counsel.

    I load my 357 ammo to 1725 FPS with a 125 JHP (clocked from a 5" barrel). I wonder how this compares to this +P offering?
     
  6. 9mmforMe

    9mmforMe Member

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    I too had never heard of +P .357 magnum ammo. hmmm?
     
  7. DWFan

    DWFan Member

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    +P in a Magnum is a marketting label; not a SAAMI standard. It refers to Magnum ammo loaded to the Magnum's original 43-46 cup levels instead of the current castrating 35 kpsi SAAMI standard. Norma, IMI and Super-Vel used to be at these levels. The GP-100 can handle these loads. SaxonPig, your 125gr loading would be considered +P if it exceeds 35 kpsi, which I have no doubt that it does since most SAAMI ammo generates approx. 1450 fps. If I'm not mistaken, IMI ammo was made with Accurate Arms powders and I believe the 170gr bullet they used for the .357 was the Sierra JHC.
    The IMI ammo might have collector value though and you might not want to shoot it because of that. There is data available from Accurate Arms to duplicate these kinds of rounds if you handload. The 170gr Sierra JHC is no longer available though.
     
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2011
  8. harmon rabb

    harmon rabb Member

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    lol. if a GP100 can't take it, then no 357 revolver can.
     
  9. Drail

    Drail Member

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    I think we should maybe roughly define the term "take it". Does "take it" mean that the firearm won't blow parts or does it mean it won't be damaged or reduced to less than perfect condition (loosened up or undergo top strap flame cutting/forcing cone erosion) by shooting "hotter than factory spec" ammunition.:scrutiny: Kuhnhausen's Ruger revolver manual has quite a few photos of Ruger DA revolvers that, maybe did not undergo rapid disassembly, but were obviously damaged by using very hot ammo. And I have seen abused Rugers personally. They are very hell for stout firearms but the idea that they are indestructable is just not realistic.
     
  10. 32 Magnum

    32 Magnum Member

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    The IMI SAMSON brand was made in Israel and could very well excede SAAMI standards.
     
  11. glocking26

    glocking26 Member

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    That ammo was made to shoot in the open bolt full auto IMI UZI. The Uzi runs better on hot ammo because of the heavy bolt.
     
  12. intercooler

    intercooler member

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  13. CraigC
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    CraigC Member

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    That's not necessarily true. There are stronger .357's on the market than the GP. The Colt SAA, its replicas and the mid-frame Blackhawk come to mind, not to even mention the large frame Blackhawk, S&W N-frames and Freedom Arms guns.
     
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2011
  14. equalizer

    equalizer Member

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    Dan Wesson MMMMM
     
  15. glocking26

    glocking26 Member

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    My bad I read it wrong I was thinking 9mm
     
  16. 19&41

    19&41 Member

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    Would these be intended for a Desert Eagle?
     
  17. dagger dog

    dagger dog Member

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    I.M.I. ammunition is constructed to C.I.P standards (Commision Internantional Permanente) which is the European counter part to S.A.A.M.I. They both adhere to strict standards in ammunition manufacture, to help keep the fingers on our hands.
    I beleive it is a marketing ploy.
     
  18. roaddog28

    roaddog28 Member

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    There are stronger 357 magnums than the GP100. The new model Ruger Blackhawk, Redhawk in 357 magnum and finally the Freedom Arms. Even in these stroud revolvers I would limit my use of +P "357" magnums?

    Regards,
    Howard
     
  19. intercooler

    intercooler member

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    It looks pretty decent out so I'm going to pop one off and see. I will do this after shooting Winchester 125gr to see if it is much hotter.
     
  20. DWFan

    DWFan Member

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    The C.I.P standard for the .357 Magnum is 44 kpsi.
     
  21. intercooler

    intercooler member

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    I'm back! I had full protection on... ear plugs, ear muffs, gloves and prescription safety glasses. I was gearing up for a big blast... Big let down! I started off shooting some .45 ACP to warm things up. I went from that to the Ruger shooting Fiocchi 142gr. FMJTC, Winchester WinClean 125gr JSP, Wolf 158gr SP and finally put one Samson 170gr +P FMJ in all by itself. I would say falsely advertised and more suited to the second lable on the box "Match Grade".
    The Samson/IMI +P shot really accurate but bang and recoil was the lowest of the bunch. After shooting more of the WinClean 125gr this is quickly becoming my favorite to shoot ammo due to biggest pop and leaving the gun clean. My next favorite so far is Wolf which is dirty but has a good pop and cheap. I really didn't want to shoot this much ammo today but when you start hard to stop! Ranking of most pop to least:

    - WinClean 125gr JSP WC3571 1290 FPS
    - Wolf 158gr SJHP G357HP1 1219 FPS
    - Fiocchi 142gr FMJTC 357F 1160 FPS
    - Samson/IMI 170gr FMJ+P 357-34A probably 1050 FPS??
     
  22. DWFan

    DWFan Member

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    Very interesting. So all the warnings were for naught. I have to admit to being surprised at this and wonder if you didn't purchase a box of reloads.
     
  23. Cosmoline

    Cosmoline Member

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    I'm not surprised. The whole thing sounds bogus.

    As far as strength, the strongest .357 I know of would be the rare REDHAWKS that were made in that chambering.
     
  24. intercooler

    intercooler member

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    Naa. It has +p marked in the brass and they put a red mark on the primer/brass that a reloader couldn't do. Just weak
     
  25. Lucky Derby

    Lucky Derby Member

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    There was an UZI made in .357 Magnum?!

    I suspect it was made for the Desert Eagle Semi Auto pistol.
     
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