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What are the Pro's and Con's of a 5.56 Nato AK?

Discussion in 'Rifle Country' started by Click Click Boom, Dec 2, 2008.

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Good or Bad: Ak47 in 5.56 Nato

  1. Yes, Its a great Idea

    50 vote(s)
    59.5%
  2. No! Whats a 5.56 AK?

    34 vote(s)
    40.5%
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  1. Click Click Boom

    Click Click Boom Member

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    What are some of the advantages of a AK47 type rifle chambered in 5.56x45 for a US civillian? Are there any for Plinking, Trunk gun, ATV saddle, SHTF, EOTWAWKI and whatever other uses there may be? (I know that the SHTF & EOTWAWKI are kinda silly and overdone) What are some of the disadvantages in the same areas?

    I am asking because I have seen many 5.56 Aks at Shops, shows and shooting ranges recently.
     
  2. taliv

    taliv Moderator

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    pro: it uses 5.56
    Con: it is an AK

    Glad I could be of help here :)
     
  3. longdayjake

    longdayjake Member

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    con--- weight
    pro--- easy to maintain
    con--- ammo more money
    pro--- easier to bump fire
    con--- easier to bump fire and costs too much to do too often.
     
  4. ByAnyMeans

    ByAnyMeans Member

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    Sorry taliv, you got that backwards.

    PRO : it's an AK
    Con : it uses 5.56
     
  5. Deer Hunter

    Deer Hunter Member

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    I own a Saiga in .223.

    I'm about to order an AR-mag adaptor for it. Rocks in like an AK mag, but it lets me use the same mag in both my .223 rifles.

    It's a great rifle, solid and dependable. It has a 4x POSP scope that's mounted high enough so I can still use the irons. It's my favorite .223, bar none.
     
  6. Click Click Boom

    Click Click Boom Member

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    I was thinking that a AK in 5.56 for a US Civilian would offer AK reliability, a little more accuracy and no worries about banning foreign military calibers or a better supply of ammo in the SHTF/EOTWAWKI video game script situations.
     
  7. natural marksman

    natural marksman Member

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    The AK-101 is a 5.56x45mm version of the AK-74M. The AK-102 being the carbine version, slightly resembling an AKS-74U.

    For a military group operating in a country which uses the 5.56mm cartridge as standard, the AK-101 is a good idea, because it retains the good features of an AK, and you will have logistic compatability with the country you're in.

    For anybody else, you'd probably want to stay with the old AK-47. Cheaper ammo, and the .30cal ammo is more powerful than 5.56mm (which is good if you want it for hunting).

    Then again, the 5.56 AK would have better recoil control with the lighter 5.56mm bullet. Less recoil = more accuracy (if you want it for target shooting).

    So, depending on what you want it for, they're both good.
     
  8. Trempel

    Trempel Member

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    One of the contributing factors to AK legendary reliability is the fact that both the 7.62x39 and the 5.45x39 cartridges feature tapered cases. I don't know the 5.56 versions to be specifically un-reliable, but that round finds more potential in the AR platform, or others originally designed for its use. Just IMHO.
     
  9. Girodin

    Girodin Member

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    I have AKs in 5.56 and 7.62x39.

    Things I like about my 5.56 saiga.

    I too am buying the mag adapter and the use or AR mags is a plus for me because they match other fire arms are inexpensive and I have a fair number of them.

    The 5.56 has less muzzle jump and is faster in terms of target reacquisition. The difference between it and the x39 is notable.

    The 5.56 round is more suited for certain tasks.

    The cons:

    The biggest one for me is the the ammo is significantly more expensive than 7.62x39. I shoot 5.56 much less often for this reason and this reason alone. The 5.56 would be a better plinker if ammo was the same price but its not.

    Mags can be a draw back. 7.62x39 mags are cheaper and easier to find in my experience. If you go with a saiga (which I would recomend) you can get the AR mag adapter which solves thsoe problems and gives you drop free mags but it tacks another $100+ on to the price tag.

    The 7.62x39 round is superior for certain tasks

    Really it comes down to ammo and mag prices. They give the edge to the 7.62x39 AKs for me right now. Nothing at all wrong with a 5.56 AK though and I'm glad I have mine. If I could only keep one it would be the x39.

    What kind of cheek weld does that allow for with use of the scope. The higher mounts have been problematic for me on this front, ie it is impossible for me to get a good cheek weld and use the optics. Is this an issue for you?
     
  10. Click Click Boom

    Click Click Boom Member

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    People have a good opinion of the original IMI Galils in 5.56. They are just a milled AK with better sights/chargeing handle.

    Can the Arsenals use a AR15 mag adapter?
     
  11. Kurt_D

    Kurt_D Member

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    Pro: 5.56/.223 with it's huge selection of loads
    Pro: AK durablity/reliablity
    Pro: domestic ammo
    Pro: should typically be more accurate than other AKM/AK74

    Con: it's an AK pattern - crappy sight, clunky controls
    Con: cost of ammo
    Con: not standardized like AKM/AK74/AR15
    Con: won't match an AR for accuracy
     
  12. jackdanson

    jackdanson Member

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    Hah, awesome!
     
  13. Click Click Boom

    Click Click Boom Member

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    Isnt there some amount of 5.56mm mag standardization?

    I thought there were three common mag types.
    1.Eastern Europe mags (Bulgarian, Romanian ect...) most common?
    2.Asian Mags (Norinco, polyteck)
    3.Galil/Valmet mags.

    I dont see that much differense in ammo prices. Brass cased 7.62x39 is as exspensive as brass 5.56 Nato. Wolf .223 is only a little more than wolf 7.62x39. There was some wolf Military classic .223 for $79.99 for 500 rounds at a local dealer. (sold out as of today)
     
  14. Kurt_D

    Kurt_D Member

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    Not really. You have ones that fit in `74 style well and those that fit in a AKM style.

    Bulgy circle 10s fit in a `74 style such as a SAR-3, SLR-106, Saiga* and those .223 Chinese AKs.

    Weiger (sp?) fit in a `74 style such SAR-3 and Saiga* but not the 106 or Chinese.

    Chinese only fit Chinese guns.

    Galil only for Galil unless you mod the mags.

    Russian AK-101 uses their own mags design, Polish Beryl uses their own mags; I don't know what else they'll fit b/c there's hardly any here.

    Don't forget the Yugo .223 mags that only Yugos use, but they look like German/Romy ones.

    An AK74 mag is an AK74 mag and will fit ALL AK74: Bulgy, Romy, Polish, German, Russian, etc.

    I don't need to go into AKM/AK47 mags.

    * after doing the required mods to the rifle
     
  15. Click Click Boom

    Click Click Boom Member

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    Is it safe to say that the Bulgy Circle 10 are the most common 5.56 mags in the US?
     
  16. expvideo

    expvideo Member

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    Pro:
    -Absolute reliability under almost any condition, short of a supernova
    -Cleaning is entirely optional, and can be done by tieing knots in a shoe string, dipping it in gasoline, and pulling it through the barrel
    -It is deadly accurate. A 5.56 AK is almost as accurate as a 5.56 AR. Not quite, but almost. Much more accurate than a 7.62x39
    -Low recoil
    -Available caliber in mass production domestically
    -Lighter ammo than 7.62x39
    -Less overpenetration than 7.62x39
    -Cheaper than an AR
    -Easier to operate all controls with thick gloves than an AR

    Con:
    -Not quite as accurate as an AR, although it is close
    -More expensive ammo than 7.62x39
    -Mags are fairly available, but not as much so as the 7.62x39
    -Less aftermarket parts than AR
    -Harder to stay compliant with 922r than an AR, since it's main components are manufactured overseas
    -Not as ergonomic as an AR
    -Heavier than an AR
    -Not as many gunsmiths are familiar with AKs as they are with ARs. I know this sounds stupid, but I've had this issue
     
  17. Float Pilot

    Float Pilot Member

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    I used to have a VALMET M-76FS. A Finnish AK type in 5.56mm.


    I used it for a few years as a patrol car rifle. IT WAS GREAT!!!!

    It was almost as accurate as my AR carbines, and much, much much, more reliable. It would shoot 2 inch groups at 100 meters, and I once did a demo of shooting it with the dust cover removed as I poured snow into the action. It just kept on shooting!

    The ONLY reason I sold it for an AR carbine was that George Bush the 1st, started his goofy military firearm import ban back in the late 1980s. So my $425 Valmet suddenly became a $1,200 Valmet with $70 magazines.

    So I traded it off and got an AR just like the rest of the guys on the dept. The parts and Magazines being much cheaper at the time. I have missed the Valmet ever since.....

    HUGE MISTAKE....I am such a dumb a$$
     
  18. nwilliams

    nwilliams Member

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    I own two Norinco 84s series AK's, both in 5.56 and I have no complaints. I like the 5.56 round and I like AK's, so I see no problem combining the two. Of course I also have two AK's in 7.62x39 so I'm not too particular.
     
  19. expvideo

    expvideo Member

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    Well don't kick yourself too hard. I probably would have done the same thing. And I would be regretting it just as much. But it was an easy mistake to make. It would be nice if you were able to get another one someday.
     
  20. dscottw88

    dscottw88 Member

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    I dont think rubbing down a firearm with gasoline is a very bright idea. If you mean motor oil, then by all means rock on.

    A 5.56 saiga can be had for $400, convert it yourself for another $150. Makes sense if your serisously in the need of a reliable, effective, combat-proven weapon for a few hundred dollars less then an AR.

    Caliber is preference. I like the compatibility with my AR's. It has a flatter trajectory and maybe a little less recoil. But if I didn't have any ARs, I'd probably get the 7.62 version since the ammo is cheaper right now.

    Bottom line, Its still not going to replace my AR. But it's better then a SKS.
     
  21. VINTAGE-SLOTCARS

    VINTAGE-SLOTCARS Member

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    I also have a Valmet. The gun shoots awsome. Years ago I changed the stock to an underfolder. This made a very compact package thats hard to beat. Yea the $400 dollars was the deal of the decade,wish I had bought another one:banghead:
     
  22. WardenWolf

    WardenWolf member

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    I own a Saiga .223, and I weighed the pro's and con's heavily before choosing it over the 7.62x39 model.

    Pro's:

    As reliable as any other AK
    Ammo is commonly available in the US and reasonably cheap (convenience and availability; a simple import ban won't cut me off)
    All ammo is non-corrosive (convenience and SHTF; you may not be able to regularly clean your rifle in an emergency situation)
    Ability to use US military ammunition (SHTF)
    Tend to be built a bit better than other AK's, and more accurate (newer production in modernized factories)
    Ammo quality varies much less than Combloc production (even the worst Wolf ammo will usually be on par with the best surplus 7.62x39)

    Con's:

    Magazines not as common (US-made magazines ARE available, and wear parts such as magazine springs are universal)
    Ammo is more expensive than Commie surplus (however, you lose most of your savings on cleaning supply costs due to corrosive primers)
    Spare parts are less common (bolt and barrel differ; most other parts can be swapped with an AK-47. It takes a LOT to screw them up)

    The benefits, in my opinion, far outweigh the drawbacks. I look at a 5.56 AK as a better alternative to an AR-15. It's a totally different technology base, but it's one that's more reliable and less flaky. I consider the very real possibility that I may not be able to properly clean my gun for a long time. The fact that it will keep running, and shoots non-corrosive ammo is a huge winning combination for me.

    Now, on the peaceful side of it:

    Plinking and hunting: I equipped my Saiga .223 with a scope, and am consistently hitting 2" patterns at 100 yards. I intend to use it to hunt smaller game such as javelina. I could use it to hunt deer, as well. It's a good shooter and a very solid all-around rifle. It's a lot of fun to shoot, too. It's accurate enough to do whatever I need it to do within the effective range of the .223 or 5.56 round. The people next to me with the low-end AR-15's (that kept malfunctioning) were shocked to see me matching their patterns. Funnier still because they paid easily twice what I did for their guns; their guns were malfunctioning all day, and I have yet to have my Saiga jam once.

    Trunk gun / ATV saddle: Almost invariably, a gun that is practical for compact storage will be less practical in all other uses, and the same is true here. Such compact setups usually have shorter barrels than are optimal, which will reduce the effective range. If you can get by with a 16" or 20" barrel with or without a folding stock, they will certainly work fine for this. Keep in mind, though, that if defense from bears is what you need, you should go for a larger caliber weapon.
     
  23. nathan

    nathan Member

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    The CHinese Type 84 in 5.56 is the way to go in the AK series. Unfortunately they are too pricey now. get u the BWK 92, the one in thumbhole version but just as good.
     
  24. Click Click Boom

    Click Click Boom Member

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    Everyone has a different opinion on what 5.56 AK is the best. Valmet, Galil, Norinco, Arsenal, Vepr, Siaga it seems like most of the AKs in 5.56 are of high quality. They are all exspensive as well. They are all around 1K with the exception of the Siagas. Are the IO "Weiger" look alikes decent?

    It look like a 50/50 split. (a little in favor of 5.56) Are the "no" voters AK traditionalists or just 5.56x45 Nato haters?
     
  25. H2O MAN

    H2O MAN member

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    Agreed, but even the BWK-92 is a chunk of change and the mags are also very expensive.
     
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