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What are/ were your LEAST favorite milsurps and why?

Discussion in 'Rifle Country' started by NIGHTLORD40K, Dec 30, 2019.

  1. 792mauser

    792mauser Member

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    My least favorite is any carbine in 8mm lebel.
    It'll beat the snot outta me.
     
  2. LoonWulf
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    LoonWulf Contributing Member

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    I just thought of one! The low serial 1903 a buddy of mine has and insists on shooting....i bloody hate that gun.
     
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  3. theotherwaldo

    theotherwaldo Member

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    Thanks for the warning, but I'm about to take a Berthier Mle. 16 lightened carbine to the range tomorrow... .
    Hopefully my shoulder will survive.
     
  4. TikkaShooter

    TikkaShooter Member

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    My least favorite "milsurps" were the ones with Cosmoline because literally they stink. :p
     
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  5. 303 hunter

    303 hunter Member

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    Same as you on the M95, because it kicked like a mule! Shot 10 rounds at the range, and had a bruise on my shoulder. Neat looking gun, but I hated the straight pull action.
     
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  6. boom boom
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    boom boom Moderator Staff Member

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    Like you, that particular m95 straight pull I do not like. I did find that cleaning the bolt thoroughly as in detailed disassembly soak, scrub etc. helped along with Slip 2000 that I used to lubricate it. Still, you have to work the action like you hate it. I'd imagine that you were right at the proper hate level in ten rounds. Unfortunately, the older 8x50r Austrian is orphaned ammo which is much gentler on the shoulder. Not too many unaltered 8x50r rifles left either.

    The Ross rifles and the Schmidt Rubin series and K31 are much smoother straight pulls to me.
     
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  7. boom boom
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    boom boom Moderator Staff Member

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    Oh no. you are firing a fully manual m16 Berthier assault rifle? Is it registered?
    I think if you have have the five round clip version, the five round clips might be regarded as assault hi caps in some unfree states.

    In all seriousness, good luck with your shooting, the Lebel round is pretty stout as issued. I have a Berthier m16 that was similarly sportered by shortening the stock and have the rest of the forestock to graft on whenever I have the time and relieved medical issues to do it. But as is, the recoil is brisk from my recollection of firing it a couple of years ago. Personally, I admit to using a kick eez shoulder pad when firing those old milsurps off the bench. The recoil on milsurps in field firing positions never bothered me as much but presently don't want to risk it due to medical issues. Stuck firing low recoil firearms right now.
     
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  8. 303 hunter

    303 hunter Member

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    You’re certainly correct about the bolt being hard to cycle; it never felt like it went fully into battery(even though it did). I kept thinking about the bolt slamming into my face.

    My 20 year old nephew bought a M95 at a gun show a couple months ago, along with some Austrian surplus ammo. I warned him about the recoil, but he shot 30 rounds the next day. He called me and told me that I was right!
     
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  9. boom boom
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    boom boom Moderator Staff Member

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    You know, the m95 is probably one of the last really great deals on milsurps if you don't fire them. JG Sales was blowing them out for about $100 or so less than ten years ago and now they are bringing $300-400 each even in relatively cruddy condition. Personally, I would like to get one of the unaltered long rifles so I could let this one go--I got it because it was cheap and I was interested in the design.

    To learn something about these old warhorses, I thoroughly detail disassemble most of my milsurps and actually restored some as parts guns from bare and barrelled receivers. The m95 had a lot of that turn of the 20th century mechanical complications due to the clip feeding system, the straight pull bolt, a funky trigger system, and stock furniture that was suboptimally fitted (probably during the conversion). The Mannlicher type design was simply not as good as the Mauser system imho and was probably more difficult to manufacture and perhaps to keep running in the trenches.

    FWIW, My m95 came from Steyr originally and was bought by Bulgaria around 1912-3 or so as near as I can tell. Probably altered in the 1930's and left in war reserves post WWII. Grateful that the Bulgarians did not scrub the crest.
     
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  10. carbine85

    carbine85 Member

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    I had a Turkish Mauser in 8MM. It was a worn-out piece of junk and heavy. I had a chance to make a few bucks so I dumped it.
    I had a Spanish Mauser that was converted to .308 and it was a worn-out piece of junk and sold it.
    I bought a Mosin Nagant for $60. It had a really dark black bore, the bolt locked up all the time and it shot 18" groups at 100 yards so I dumped it.
    I picked up a 7mm Argentine Mauser that thumped like a mule. I had too many Mausers in various calibers so I decided to sell that one
    I had an Albanian SKS that was pretty rough and carved up with trench art, Some guy around here collects trench art so he made a nice offer and it home with him
     
  11. fpgt72

    fpgt72 member

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    It can be YOUR least favorite....that is cool....the reasons however while valid to YOU, are not valid. I am not going to bother to go back and look up who posted what, so forgive me if dis aint you.

    But the sight being fixed.....there are reasons for this that I think I brought up.

    These are not target guns but battle rifles....and if you want to put a black mark against an item because it is not good in a role it was not intended to fill....well is that really the guns fault?
     
  12. fpgt72

    fpgt72 member

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    I thought that as well....this specific gun looks unissued.....I really don't ever use that term, but it fits here. It is also a very low number.

    If you are into these things the chilean mauser book is fantastic.....it will go into what SN# ranges came over on what boat. So I can tell you what ship this specific gun came into country on....that is pretty cool.
     
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  13. fpgt72

    fpgt72 member

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    To hyjack a bit....perhaps a new thread idea?

    Back before my last "medical issues" I would take different goofy stuff to CMP matches. It takes a bit of work to run one with a 3 round clip fed french rifle but it can be done....however last time I did it....I think with a type 99 I decided to hell with this....prone just pounded the living snot out of me. I was in real pain for two weeks. Now even shooting standing where you can really "roll with the punches" leaves me hurting. Most of the old guns I do now is shot off the bench in a lead sled type thing.....it works I guess.

    Just last week I dusted off my AR....and ran about 100 rounds through it....it was like shooting a pellet gun....and not a springer......I have 22's that kick more. This is a big OLD AR full length heavy barrel....and it was just so easy and non eventful.

    I learned....or relearned a few things....I can see why they are so popular.....and I can see why all those magazine loading devices are popular.....my least fav "mil surp"....the AR.....loading anything past old metal GI mags really sucks.
     
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  14. fpgt72

    fpgt72 member

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    I think this is another area that gets so many people confused....and a post like this really can confuse people....it is not you but the general "way gun people talk" that is confusing.

    There is a big difference between "7mm argentine" and "7mm mauser".....one is a .311 bullet the other is a .284....(all this shooting from my old man memory)

    IMHO the 7.65 that went into the "argentine" guns (they are not the only ones that used this) is so close to 8mm mauser in terms of how it feels to the shoulder you are splitting hairs. the 7x57 is a different animal all the way around and it to is usually called 7mm.....and again IMHO it is one of the best military cartridges in a bolt gun to ever exist. (another fun thread topic) It is very flat shooting, pretty darn accurate, not as harsh as 3006 or the others from that same era.

    I don't know......just more information that can be taken the wrong way.
     
  15. The Exile

    The Exile Member

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    Hmm... what's that just fitting a stock on? I could be down.
     
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  16. MosinT53Hunter

    MosinT53Hunter Member

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    I believe so. There are lots of pictures of what they have.
     
  17. Comrade Mike

    Comrade Mike Member

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    1903 Springfield believe it or not. I had two with the "scant" stocks on them. Brutal to shoot. Traded them both despite their excellent condition.
     
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  18. silicosys4

    silicosys4 Member

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    M70 stainless classic in .300winmag. I don't think i've put 10 rounds through it. Terrible recoil. I have a .375H&H that I love to shoot, but that .300 sucks.

    Edit: whoops, thought I was on the "least favorite rifles" thread.

    So I'll add that I had a mosin nagant that was exceedingly "Meh" to shoot. Terrible trigger, with 8" pattern at 50 yards. It was the only rifle I've sent down the road and never regretted.
     
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2020
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  19. kozak6

    kozak6 Member

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    Mosin Nagant M91/30.

    The stock is completely saturated through and through with grease and the bolt sticks so hard you just about need a mallet to work it. And then the stock greases up your hands, which then makes the bolt twice as hard to cycle (shoulda brought the mallet) and all of your other guns half as much fun to shoot.

    Garbage bag or blowdryer tricks are dumb. I've got some ideas for degreasers to try, but it looks like 2020 is going to be a busy year and I'm not sure I like the rifle enough to mess with it.
     
  20. fpgt72

    fpgt72 member

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    You should look at it like a 66 mustang or camaro....take your pick.....that needs a little TLC, not real work, but just this or that.

    Is it ever going to be as good (in any way as far as putting holes where you want them) as say a $200 on sale Savage Axis....nope.

    Is it way more cool then a 2015 mustang/camaro in about every way......depends.

    Is the 15 car a better car over the old thin....YUP.

    As the RI auction is today and I am under orders from the wife to NOT SPEND ANY MONEY.....really, why tell me stuff like that when you know it is not going to happen....and everything I am looking at has been out done in every way by more modern gunz.......well there are those things that you get or you don't.

    You are going to have to decide if you want to put that time into that 66 mustang.....perhaps a 54 chevy is more your style.....or perhaps you might go.....just what do all these mustang people see in this hyped up falcon.....lets get it as good as it can be so I can have a real see with a very good example....perhaps I will learn something.

    Now I am off to spend money.....and if I sleep on the couch then I don't have to listen to her snore.......to coin a phrase

    You snore like an Albanian field wench.

    Its ok Mrs. FP knows it.
     
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  21. boom boom
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    boom boom Moderator Staff Member

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    Ok, if you do not want mother nature to take care of it (trashbag in sunlight) then wiping down with degreasing solvents afterwards, the fast way to degrease it is to dismount the action and use whiting powder and acetone on the stock and handguard (or some other nasty solvent). Whiting powder can be found at Brownells and is pretty cheap or you can obtain it from some woodcrafting suppliers.

    You will need to do several applications as the whiting powder soaks up the grease that is softened and dissolved by the solvent. My advice is to leave the inside of the stock inletting alone unless the inletted wood is soggy and mushy but thoroughly wipe out excess cosmolene. Sealing the inletted wood helps prevent wood from shrinking and swelling in reaction to the different humidity levels in the atmosphere. Some folks will simply dunk the stock in boiling water or use other harsh solvents such as oven cleaner but you risk warping and damaging the stock if not done correctly and you must then counteract the effects of water and/or harsh solvents on the wood pronto.

    The fast way to get rid of grease in the barrelled action left is to dunk it in a solvent or use boiling hot water application after removing as much cosmolene as possible by wiping down and disposing of the cruddy rags.

    Heat + Solvent works faster but some solvents are flammable so be careful.
    Solvents alone can do it but you need to use more powerful solvents if you do not use heat in combination.

    The sticky bolt problem is probably caused by dried cosmolene throughout the action. After all, these were in deep war reserve for decades and even cosmolene dries out. You could use an ultrasonic cleaner for the bolt parts after disassembly or simply use something like Brownells DSolve dunking and you will need to clean out the locking recesses of the action as well.
     
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  22. boom boom
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    boom boom Moderator Staff Member

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    This one just appears to need just the stock and handguard.
    https://www.gunbroker.com/item/841067880

    But here is a Type 53 with stock for $20 more starting bid, https://www.gunbroker.com/item/847434877

    The type 53's are around and appear to be a bit cheaper than the Russian Mosins right now. Recoil is probably one of the reasons.
     
  23. BrocLuno

    BrocLuno Member

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    There is a fellow up in Idaho who specializes in Arisaka parts. He has hundreds of barrels, bolts, etc. I suspect he could supply you with an original barrel that would screw right in and cure all those ills :)

    I have shot a number of Arisaka's and I like them. Pop brought one back from WW-II and my niece has it now. It is a last ditch, and in getting it running, I studied it quite closely. It was made fast as in welded safety and lathe marks on the barrel (no time spent polishing stuff), but is no less strong than the others. Do not stand down range and expect one to come apart and save you - it won't.

    I even know about, and have handled, a Carcano-Arisaka. It's an odd beast. Intrigued by the gain rifling. Maybe someday I'll get to shoot it ...
     
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2020
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  24. Gladius

    Gladius Member

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    Thanks, I'll have to consider that when I get the time and money...
     
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