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What If's

Discussion in 'Strategies, Tactics and Training' started by JamisJockey, Jun 19, 2004.

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  1. Heraclitus

    Heraclitus Member

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    'Twas a crack at poetry, GeneC -- not the poetry of crack! :D
     
  2. R.H. Lee

    R.H. Lee Member

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    Not to go OT, Gene, but that Federalist link includes The "Code of Hammurabai" as one of its relevent documents. I don't think we want to govern our modern society by such antiquated elitist nonsense.:p
     
  3. GeneC

    GeneC member

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    Riley, you've got to be kidding me. You must have graduated from the Micheal Moore school of deception. FYI, it happens to be listed under Historic Documents, which include most Colonies' charters, the Magna Carta,etc. and no way implies they want to rule this Country by any of those, it's for historical value only. Fact of the matter is, The Federalist isn't even a political party. Maybe you should just stick to the topic.

    Anybody that wants individual freedom over what's good for the whole are just wrong,IMO. Btw, all parties have good and bad, but right now with the terrorism thing, I trust the Bush admin to take of this far better than anyone else and to me, that's what counts right now.

    Plinkerton, how in the world do you surmise that God isn't a conservative? Have you read the Old Testament Bible? If God wasn't a conservative, why'd He destroy Sodom? Why'd he punish the Egyptians, for enslaving the Jews and then punish the Jews for turning on Him? Shoot man, Conservatism got it's lead from God. You and Heraclitis must be smoking the same stuff, he happens to know that random elements buzz around like insects and swarm in big, dark , clouds and suddenly combine-cartoonlike. He also knows that "what ifs" are disemboweled sketches of the world. Btw, wouldn't that be a picture of a volcano?:D
     
  4. Plinkerton

    Plinkerton Member

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    While I may be smoking something, :D, I don't think it pertains to my ideas...

    I don't want to turn this into a religious argument, as those get bad, and sometimes worse than political arguments.

    I realize that the Christian God is a "vengeful" God, and that we should "fear" God.

    It seems to me though, that Jesus preached UNCONDITIONAL love to EVERYONE, and that was the main focus of his teachings. To love and be loved. Love your enemies, and forgive them, because they do not know what they do. He preached compassion, and did not look at his enemies with anger. He pitied and loved them, just as much as he would love his own brother.

    I figured if Jesus was that way, maybe God was that way also. Jesus' teachings don't really seem to be to Conservative.

    So, maybe I was mistaken. God could be a Conservative, but Jesus surely wasnt.

    And, I don't want to add this to the argument, so you don't have to comment on it, but not everyone takes The Bible as the Truth. To some, it is just another "historical" document. For many people, there is no "proof" that any of what's in The Bible actually happened.
     
  5. R.H. Lee

    R.H. Lee Member

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    Gene said
    Very telling. Very authoritarian. Who gets to decide "what's good for the whole"?

    Edited to add: Stick around, Gene. I want to see what happens when you run into bountyhunter:p
     
  6. Plinkerton

    Plinkerton Member

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    That's my biggest problem. I want my individual freedom. If the people who were deciding what was good for the whole weren't such complete morons, I'd be much more happy with complying.
     
  7. GeneC

    GeneC member

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    Plinkerton, Jesus wasn't all that liberal either, He made it clear that we do it His way or else. Btw, he had all the desciples take up swords and defend themselves and Him.

    Question to you and Riley(et al), how many terrorist bombings and attacks all over the world since 9/11?
     
  8. Plinkerton

    Plinkerton Member

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    How many have there been? Not too many. A few I suppose.

    You're saying, as compared to before 9/11? There were more before 9/11 because we weren't doing anything about it? I agree with you there.

    My mom is actually from Israel, and I still have relatives over there. All I've ever heard about was the bus bombings, and killing over there. When it came here, on 9/11, my mom took the stance of, "Wow, that's horrible, but maybe the Americans will see what we have been dealing with for YEARS."
     
  9. R.H. Lee

    R.H. Lee Member

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    Uh, no. Exactly the opposite. Please see John 18: 1-11.

    Many dozens. What is your point?
     
  10. GeneC

    GeneC member

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    Plinkerton , a few? Where have you been hiding. Get a more accurate number and then come and talk to me.

    Riley, ok, so it was a high Priest's servant(John 18-10), but still. Get Plinkerton up to date onthe number of terrorist bombings and attacks and now how many casualties and I'll tell you both my point.
     
  11. Plinkerton

    Plinkerton Member

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    It doesn't matter. I don't try to make it sound like I don't know the answer, because I don't. I don't pretend to. Just tell me your point. I don't understand what you are trying to "prove" to me. Just do it. Don't play games.

    I would love to have been able to quote The Bible, and say that Jesus did not say to take up swords, but I did not know where it was.

    I highly doubted that "fact".

    Listen, tell us stuff if you want, that is factual. Don't try to tell me something, and BLATANTLY LIE to me, about Jesus taking up swords. You don't need to hurt your credibility.

    We are being straight with you, why don't you have the integrity to do the same?
     
  12. CrudeGT

    CrudeGT Member

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    Gene, I do not recall a thread where my response stated that i disliked the 'false bravado and unrealistic innuendo'. Granted I prefer the what if's to be realistic, but there is nothing wrong with a what is aliens... or a what if zombies.. thread pops up. Those are just fun.

    If you are refering to my post in Sturmrugers thread, where he posts the news article, go re-read that post. I mentioned that I changed the scenario in my head to play it out more to my liking, but i never mentioned that I dislike anything about what if's.

    If i ahve forgotten a recent post of mine (which happens), please remind me which thread.
     
  13. GeneC

    GeneC member

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    Crude, I just did a search of the last 60 days and can't find the post of the news article or where you said that, so, I digress and admit that you DO like false bravado and unrealistic innuendo.
     
  14. LASur5r

    LASur5r Member

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    Reality unbelievable?

    When I was over in TFL and other sites, I was asked by a member to continue writing what if's. Rich L. didn't like them but some of the members kept asking me to write them...in fact that's how I was invited here.

    One day when I was running out of what if's I wrote a couple of real life situations that I was personally involved in where I had to defend my life and other members of my family.

    I was criticized by many members as if I had made up those stories or why didn't I handle the situations better. Doesn't bother me....as those incidents already happened and I survived most of them unscathed. I always am ready to hear your opinions so that I may learn from your thoughts and experience, but unless you have had a gun or guns pointed and cocked at you or your loved one...

    All I can say is that what if's have prevented my now 17 year old daughter survive three attacks (two with weapons), saved my life on many encounters, and saved us as a family unit on two occassions. That's why my user name. I'm 56 now and I certainly like hearing what if's...never know when I might need that info.

    Meanwhile...they do serve a purpose...even for those of us who have been there, done that. Keep 'em coming.
     
  15. CrudeGT

    CrudeGT Member

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    Editted to save bandwidth.
     
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2004
  16. Das Pferd

    Das Pferd Member

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    Devonai

    Forgive for the large font but I just wanted you to know that I agreed. I started preparing for a SHTF scneario a while ago. Collecting all the right supplies, all the right maps, all the right equipment. I was planning on hiking 40 miles in one day to my destination in a exteme SHTF scenario. I figured a person can walk 3 miles per hour so it would take me less then one day of hard walking.

    Then i decided to walk to work one day. Three miles there, three miles back. That night I could hardly walk my feet hurt so bad. I realized that there is so much more then what we think about and spend money on. If I cant even get out of the city and to a safe place, all my equipment and supplies will do me nothing.

    So I just wanted to say that I agreed with you.
     
  17. Heraclitus

    Heraclitus Member

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    GeneC,

    It appears to me that you have a serious perception disorder. Perhaps it is you who are smoking something? No offense, but your various misspellings of my handle indicate some sort of trouble below deck (Herclitus, Heraclitis) as does your tendency to misrepresent what you read (disembodied = disemboweled).

    One can only wonder if you don't misrepresent other things as well. Maybe you need to get that checked.

    Now I'm not trying to start something here. You've already done a good job of that yourself. But you do seem bent on mounting a personal crusade against others on this board with what at best can be referred to as "questionable knowledge"...
    STRIKE ONE!
    STRIKE TWO! And last but not least...
    Sorry, I don't do that s***. Never have. STRIKE THREE! But since you "want some", might I question your integrity? Oh, but then you quote the Bible a lot, so you MUST be on the straight and narrow path. Must be.

    :neener:
     
    Last edited: Jun 25, 2004
  18. JamisJockey

    JamisJockey member

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    Funny, that's basically what Hitler and Stalin said.
     
  19. GeneC

    GeneC member

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    Wow, this is getting way off topic and way out of hand. The topic is 'what ifs' and I posted my opinion that they're only useful if they're based and grounded in reality and could be harmful if not.

    Somehow out came all this 'personality', probably too bored with anything else.

    H, I don't care to try and spell your pseudo name right. My name there, that's really my name. I don't respond well to pseudo names. What's all this 'Strike 1,2,etc'? Are you an umpire or something? Plinkerton accused me of lying when he said Jesus didn't condone taking up swords, when in fact Luke 22:36 is Jesus saying "if you don't have a sword, go sell your coat and buy one." and John 18-10 says" and Simon Peter, who had a sword, drew it and smote the high priest's servant and cut off his right ear. His name was mal'chus" . The second fact is I thought Crude stated that he didn't like false bravado and unrealistic innuendo in another thread, but did a search in the last 60 days and couldn't find it, so I must have been mistaken and admitted it. So what( are you judging me?)? The topic was "what ifs" and had leaned toward reality and validity and you felt the need to post abstract poetry. I took that as strike one. I've been in several reallife situations and can tell you it happens NOTHING like that(strike 2). You probably can't tell me how many terroristic attacks have happened around the world since 9/11, or what my point is there either, huh?

    Act1man, can you provide proof that's what Hitler and Stalin said? Anyway , you're missing the point. Btw, someone else advised me to learn the real platform of the Libertarian Party, but evrything I said, I got right from their own website: http://www.lp.org/issues/


    Crude,no.


    As far as individual freedoms, the Constitution guarantees the individual rights to life,liberty and the persuit of happiness( they did say that all men are created equal, but most signers had slaves, go figure). The 2nd ammendment , with the right to bear arms , was a Nationwide(by States) right- the whole. If those naysayers can't see that , in spite of ALL the bombings and ambushes around the world since 9/11, NOT ONE has occurred here in the States, because of the Border Patrol, INS, Homeland Security, the Patriot Act, et al. Right now in our history we need these things, even if it steps on your precious individual rights and this Administration is doing something right and as an American, I stand behind them. Sorry if you don't, go to Canada or France or Iraq, maybe you can get some individual right there.

    Now, can we get back on topic or else close this thread?
     
  20. R.H. Lee

    R.H. Lee Member

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    Uh, no. John 18:10 says "Then Simon Peter having a sword drew it, and smote the high priest's servant, and cut off his right ear. The servant's name was Malchus. "

    The passage you quoted is Luke 22:36.

    I didn't even read the rest of your post. Sheesh :rolleyes:
     
  21. atk

    atk Member

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    I feel the need to add my $0.02 :)


    Guys, I don't know who started it (since I didn't read the whole thread), but the underhanded insults are not productive.

    I'm not going to sit here and point out "he said this" and "he said that". Either you know who you are, and you meant to be rude, or you don't know and didn't realize what you wrote could be taken rudely (and so don't know who you are). In either case, take a look at the responses you're getting and think, "Is this person being rude to me? Do their hackles seem raised? Are they getting more and more aggressive with every post?" If any of those could be a "yes", I recommend you post or PM to the other guy and try to straighten things out. I doubt you want to be misunderstood, and I expect you don't really want a nasty argument (this is The High Road, after all).



    GeneC,

    I don't know how long you've been posting on bulleting boards. I'm posting this here rather than as a private message so that others who may not know Internet courtesy can read it, so please don't take offense at the publicity of this message:

    You are correct, many people use pseudonyms rather than their real names when communicating via the Internet. That doesn't make it any less of an insult to misspell their pseudonym than it would be for me to misspell your name. In both cases, the misspelling shows a lack of courtesy.



    One last thing: I agree with Devonai about what-if's. If you use something as a tool to improve yourself, you can become better. Some tools are more effective than others, and some are more fun than others. If you don't like it, you don't have to read it - unless someone's got a gun to your head and is making you read aloud :p

    So, I've said my peace, and I doubt I'll have more to say on this thread unless I have a major revalation.

    Later!

    --
    atk
     
  22. Plinkerton

    Plinkerton Member

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    Back on topic.

    I like 'what-ifs' and I think they can be helpful, if they are kept realistic.

    I don't read The Bible.

    I still don't understand your point. :D

    Oh yeah, just because a terrorist attack has not occured in the U.S. since 9/11 doesn't mean it was completely due to the Border Patrol, INS, Homeland Security, the Patriot Act, etc.

    I won't go so far as to say these things are useless, and that we don't need them, but I also won't state it as fact that there is a causal relationship between no attacks, and those things. There could be different variables occuring in different places that contribute to the lack of attacks in the U.S.

    Maybe the terrorists had a change of heart? :rolleyes:

    Well, maybe not, as they're still chopping heads off Americans.
     
  23. GeneC

    GeneC member

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    P, yes, but they're not doing it here in the U.S., which does mean it's due to our Govt efforts. Hey, give credit where it's due.

    I'll not repond to anyone else, as I don't feel I need to respond to every 'character' that posts. Take it how you want.

    Bottom line, 'what ifs' are as good as their realistic solutions. Anything else could get you hurt.
     
  24. Plinkerton

    Plinkerton Member

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    Peace out, GeneC. :p
     
  25. GeneC

    GeneC member

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    Same to ya, Plink.:cool:
     
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