Where do people get these goofy ideas?

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Devon- anecdotes prove nothing. I have been to many GSWs. Most recently, I saw a man shoot himself in the head with a 9mm. He lived. Does that make the 9mm ineffective?
 
I personally have a beretta Mod 21a in .22lr that has a vintage .22cal SIONICS Suppressor on it. It will reduce the db to about 63 which is bel;ow the average ambient sound around you of 72.

The larger suppressors work well on .223 and .308 and .220/.222. They are usually called "Cans," in that size and can bring the noticable sound down to about 103db....

NOW... where do people get bad info, usually made up or from reading 1/5 of an article on some subject and usually from no real life first person experience.
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What meter and microphone did you use to measure the impulse noise levels? Do you have suppressed and unsuppressed data? From what I have read, it takes a meter/microphone combination with no more than a 20 micro second rise time to accurately measure the impulse noise of a gun shot. Thanks.

Ranb
 
A .22 will go threw a deer stomach.
A .22 will go threw the skull of a deer, threw the brains and out the other side of the skull.
A 22 will kill hogs shot in the head.

Shot by a $0.02rnd or a $5 rnd, dead is dead. Have you ever looked up the $'s of people killed worldwide with a .22? Astonsishing seeing how some think it wont.
 
I don't put my faith in the 22lr, but strange things have happened.

I recall a case my dad told me about from the ER. A 22 entered the upper arm, and traveled along the bone, entering into the chest cavity with just enough energy left to tear into the aorta. The patient was dead on arrival from the internal bleeding.
 
Looks like alot of us drink out of the same pitcher of Kool Aid. I might as well be from Iowa cuz you gotta show me. Where is the proof?
 
Devon- anecdotes prove nothing.
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Divemedic, anecdotes? I simply stated what I had seen, the truth without embellishment.

I have been to many GSWs.
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Good for you, I've seen a few myself. That means you're responding to calls.

Most recently, I saw a man shoot himself in the head with a 9mm.
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Did you at least try to stop him? I mean, you really saw him shoot himself in the head? Couldn't you just shoot the gun out of his hand?

He lived.
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He a very fortunate idiot.

Does that make the 9mm ineffective?
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No, that means the guy missed the vitals. Shot placement, seems I heard that somewhere.

I can taste the sarcasm, can't you?
 
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I heard an explaination of why the 5.56mm round tumbles upon entering flesh. When the point makes contact, it immediately starts to decelerate but the back of the bullet is still trying to maintain its speed. This causes a tumbling effect on the bullet. I'm not sure I buy this explaination. Wouldn't this apply to all pointed projectiles? I've dug slugs out of game from .22 in squirells to .30 cals in deer and never seem this happen unless bone was struck Wouldn't this tumbling be obvios in ballistic gel?
 
Devon- I wasn't attacking you personally, I am just saying that so many threads on here make claims, and then the thread degenerates into a war story contest, and we wind up with a thread full of stories. All show and no go.
 
Guys let's keep this high road, we don't need all this mean spirited sarcasm and I don't want to have to lock this.
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I dont see moderator under your username.

Devon- I wasn't attacking you personally
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Really, it seems you called me out with:
Devon- anecdotes prove nothing.
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Ky Larry: I vaguely recall seeing something just like that on TV not long ago. It was on one of the shows on either Wednesday Night at the Range or Thursday Night Shooting. They shot ballistic gel with a 5.56 and you could see the wound channel where the bullet had tumbled.

To sum up my experience with the .22lr, it's a good small game round, but from what I've seen I don't think I'll be using it for self defense as long as I've got anything that's 9mm or larger.
 
Just about everyone knows that a larger caliber is better than a 22LR for self defense. Folks that subscribe to the "I'll use a 22" side of the fence generally shoot a lot of 22's and feel confident that in a crisis they could do what needs to be done defensively better than with many centerfires (that are often hardly shot) due to shooting precision and repeated shots. I don't know how I'd react in a crisis sitution. I'll take whatever loaded firearm is closest and hopefully deal with the crisis. But I would prefer to reach for a centerfire handgun over a 22 handgun if I had a choice.

The older gent reference in the OP was just talking as we all do from time to time and he'd probably take the larger caliber gun too if he had a choice. It also sounds like something a 50 or 60-something person would say to a 18-20 somthing person.
 
People keep spreading the myth about the 5.56mm round being designed to "tumble" so as to cause greater damage. Early on, when the M-16 rifle was first used in combat in Vietnam there was a problem with the bullet tumbling but it was because the rifling twist in the M-16 was too slow to properly stabilize it. After the rate of twist was increased, the tumbling problem was mostly corrected. There was still a problem with the light 55 grain bullet at use then because if it hit any brush or limbs in the jungle, it would be easily upset and would start to tumble. The military then moved to a heavier bullet to help correct that problem. There never was a deliberate effort to "make the bullet tumble" because a tumbling bullet is horribly inaccurate!
 
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The "tumbling" bullet is designed to be marginally stable in flight but to tumble when it hits significant resistance. It is very old idea, and it worked.

One version of the 303 British bullet was made with a standard lead filled base but with a light-weight filler in the nose. To provide a simple explanation, this caused the base to overtake the point when it hit an object, ie it tumbled.
 
It also sounds like something a 50 or 60-something person would say to a 18-20 somthing person
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Are you suggesting us old gun guys tell stories? Whoppers? ;)

I'm not sure I'd bet my life on the .22LR but its better than a stick.

As my eyes get worse the older I get I've come to appreciate the value of a shotgun and multiple pellets.
 
I read somewhere recently that a doc in ER hated to see 22 wound come in, as it was very difficult to know where the bullet would end up. With most bullet wounds, a rod inserted into the wound channel would lead to the bullet. Not with a 22. Sometimes it would take many xrays and might have many pieces of bullet fragmensts scattered about inside.
 
I think that its safe to say that 22 will simply follow the path of least resistance. It might be straight or it might bounce around everywhere. With its light weight, modest velocity, and poor bullet construction, its all it can do.

Is it designed to bounce around and kill people? No.

Is it good for killing people? No.

Will it kill people? Yes.

Will I carry a 22 caliber gun for self defense? No.
 
I'm not "underrating" it. I'm just questioning its ability to ricochet extensively inside a body. Not its effectiveness when it ricochets before hitting a target.-----Cratti
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Well Cratti, respectfully, that don't make no sense. Just because a fellow is "questioning" the facts, don't mean the facts ain't there.

(Sheesh)......
/
 
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