Which are the "good" M1 Carbines?

[silverlance]

I had an opportunity recently to shoot an all-USGI M1 Carbine the guy bought from ODCMP years ago.

I was able to blow off both ends of a yam on a stick at 75 yards, then finish it off right in the middle (yam was fist sized).

This was using wolf gold and iron sights.

Now I realize that CMP is coming out with M1's next year. I plan to be in line. However, I'd also like to get a real nice piece, one not mismatched and rack / field grade as these upcoming M1s likely will be.

Which are the good ones? I know the Inlands are frowned upon a bit, but not sure why. Is it because they are not mil spec?

 

[mustanger98]

Which are the good ones? I know the Inlands are frowned upon a bit, but not sure why. Is it because they are not mil spec?

As I recall, Inland was one of the GI makes. What you want to stay away from is Universal because not only are they not GI, GI parts won't even interchange.

 

[DMK]

There's nothing wrong with any of the USGI manufactures you'll get from CMP. Inland just made most of them so they aren't "special" like a Rockola or IBM.

Anything you get from CMP will probably be rebuilt with parts from various USGI manufacturers anyway. They'll just go by the receiver manufacturer.

Here's a list of all the manufacturers and how many were made:

http://www.fulton-armory.com/M1Carbine.htm

 

[Braith-Wafer]

Probably the Paratroop ones or the Full Auto version.

 

[DMK]

Probably the Paratroop ones or the Full Auto version.

CMP already said on their forum there will be no M1A1s(the para) and there definitely won't be any M2s(the auto).

 

[mustanger98]

IIRC, the only difference between a regular M1 Carbine and the paratrooper version is the stock, the latter having a folder. If that's the case, if somebody wanted to put one in a folder, it's not out of the question... is it?

 

[alamo]

However, I'd also like to get a real nice piece, one not mismatched and rack / field grade as these upcoming M1s likely will be.

If that's what you want and from what I understand about these rifles, you'd better be prepared to pay big bucks. Maybe someone can give you and idea of what they'd cost.

 

[DMK]

IIRC, the only difference between a regular M1 Carbine and the paratrooper version is the stock, the latter having a folder. If that's the case, if somebody wanted to put one in a folder, it's not out of the question... is it?

Sure, you can easily turn a M1 into a faux M1A1. I'm thinking about getting two and doing that very thing to one.

There are repro stocks around. SARCO has 'em. They're kinda pricy though. If you do it, just keep the gun's future in mind. Keep the old stock with the rifle and don't try to pass it off as a real M1A1 on some naive buyer.

I don't even want to know what an original M1A1 stock would go for if you could even find one(although what would be the point unless you had a real M1A1 with a bad stock).

 

[The Real Hawkeye]

I know the Inlands are frowned upon a bit.

Really? I have an Inland. In fact most GI's who had an M1 Carbine in WWII carried an Inland. Who frowns on them? I never heard this in my life.

 

[lionking]

any contract carbine with original military parts even mixed I think would be real.Even it was rearsenaled,it just wont be "original from factory".

The only way a Inland could be "frowned" upon is collector wise they are the most common to be found,functionally they are just fine,some consider the best of made.

rarely do I link to another forum but this one deals with carbines specifically and you'll find good info here from serious carbine collectors.Again,a Scott Duff book would also be a good source.
http://www.ambackforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=43839

 

[DMK]

Cool link lionking. I forgot all about that forum.

To tell you the truth, I wouldn't be surprised if some carbines came right out of the factory as mixmasters. With high demand, subcontractors just barely meeting production, it probably want all that uncommon for parts to be substituted from various makers.

 

[gezzer]

90%+ of all M1 carbines are mis-matched done by the .gov when upgrading them after WWII. Any you find that are all factory original I'll bet were taken home by a GI in a duffle bag.

 

[lionking]

quote;To tell you the truth, I wouldn't be surprised if some carbines came right out of the factory as mixmasters. With high demand, subcontractors just barely meeting production, it probably want all that uncommon for parts to be substituted from various makers

in fact thats right.From what I remember reading,some manufactures cant remember specifically which ones did not produce certain parts (such as barrels) and had other brands used to complete the carbine.

BTW,I have a Inland Bluesky import with a aftermarket M1A1 folding stock.It shoots fine and is a really compact and handy carbine.

I also have a choice condition Inland with National Postmeter stock.

 

[trbon8r]

Has CMP announced the price they will be getting for their carbines?

 

[MAKOwner]

Do the regular M1s have the adjustable, more "modern" rear sight? I was thinking that was the M1A1s, but I didn't think those were just the folding stock models? Are those rear sight assemblies interchangable without tooo much work?

 

[HiroProX]

Heh, I'd love to have a M2 made by Rockola. It'd be... ironic.

 

[U.S.SFC_RET]

The CMP have not announced Prices nor limits. but I am wiling to bet anyone a dime to a dollar that the limit per person is going to be low.

 

[Eightball]

but I am wiling to bet anyone a dime to a dollar that the limit per person is going to be low.

I hope it is; whatever they do, I hope they make it unrealistic for a dealer to come in and buy plenty, then resell them (seen it happen, makes me furious that they're taking advantage of it ). As long as I get one, though, I'm happy.

 

[Father Knows Best]

Do the regular M1s have the adjustable, more "modern" rear sight? I was thinking that was the M1A1s, but I didn't think those were just the folding stock models? Are those rear sight assemblies interchangable without tooo much work?

Early M1 carbines had a "flip" type two-position rear sight. You don't see many of those around, because the vast majority of M1 carbines were "upgraded" after the war with a host of features that were implemented during WWII. That's why even low serial number M1 carbines typically have the later style safety and rear sight, a bayonet lug, etc. If you come across a low number M1 carbine that is still in its original configuration, it's worth a LOT of money.

My bet is that the vast majority of the carbines CMP puts on sale will be "upgraded" models with all of the post-war mods. If they have any that are in their early war configuration still, they will be priced at 3-4 times what the upgraded ones sell for, or they will be auctioned. And don't expect to get bargains at auction. When they auction M1 Garands, the prices soar into the thousands. CMP is auctioning a few dozen M1C's and M1D's right now, and prices are astronomical. One of them was over $8,000 when I looked recently.

 

[DMK]

Speaking of upgrades, does anybody have a list of all of the post-war upgrades? I know there was the windage adjustable, ramped rear sight and the bayonet lug. What else?

 

[Father Knows Best]

Scott Duff's book on the M1 carbine goes into them in detail. I'm at work right now, and the book is at home, but if no one provides the list before today I will try to summarize them tonight or tomorrow. The best thing to do, though, if you're really interested in collecting M1 carbines is to buy Duff's book. You can get it through his website, and it's not expensive.

 

[DMK]

if no one provides the list before today I will try to summarize them tonight or tomorrow

That would be cool. Thanks!

 

[kludge]

gezzer wrote

90%+ of all M1 carbines are mis-matched done by the .gov when upgrading them after WWII. Any you find that are all factory original I'll bet were taken home by a GI in a duffle bag.

Let's just say that this was an IBM version, what would it be worth?

 

[Father Knows Best]

Let's just say that this was an IBM version, what would it be worth?

Not enough info. It would be worth more than an Inland of comparable condition, but actual worth would be largely dependent on what configuration and condition it is in. Top dollar would only be paid for a very early one that has all matching parts correct to the time that the receiver was manufactured, i.e., it is in "as originally issued" configuration, and is in excellent condition without excessive wear, no import marks, etc. Value could be anywhere from $600 to $6000, but most probably at the low end of that range ($600-$1200) assuming very good condition and some post-war upgrades or other mismatched parts.

Keep in mind that I expect M1 carbine prices to decline over the next few months because of the CMP announcement. Collectors are not likely to be willing to pay top dollar for anything other than pristine early M1 carbines in as-issued configuration until they see what CMP will be putting on the market and at what price.

 

[arthurcw]

Quote:

but I am wiling to bet anyone a dime to a dollar that the limit per person is going to be low.

I hope it is; whatever they do, I hope they make it unrealistic for a dealer to come in and buy plenty, then resell them (seen it happen, makes me furious that they're taking advantage of it ). As long as I get one, though, I'm happy.

Bingo... I'm really worried about resellers on this one. I just want one. Mismatched and ugly is fine.

Anybody have a guesstimate on what a run of the mill service or field grade Inland might be from the CMP? I know that's like asking, "Is it going to rain on New Year’s 2007?" But ever since I got the email from CMP, I'm in a mind to speculate.