Which surplus pistol?

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I am looking at surplus pistols in the $200-$300 range. Looking at JG sales and aimsurplus, what i find in this range that I would be most interested in is the Star BM, CZ70, Bulgarian Makarov, and P83 Wanad, Which of these do you think is the better all around pistol? Best value, most reliable, most accurate? Whichever one I choose will probably end up getting a new finish, new springs, upgrades sights, trigger work, and custom grips.

Does anyone know what sort of reliability and accuracy to expect out of any of them?
 
Among that group, having owned only a few P-83s and actual Makarovs, just an idea here.

Although I preferred shooting the P-83 (check P-83 design 'sticky' at Gunboards) , the magazines are not interchangeable with Makarovs, in case you later own both types.
 
Just got a Bulgarian Makarov from Classic for $316 shipped and including hand pick. Happy as can be with it. First surplus purchase for me, I even enjoyed cleaning all that cosmoline off it!
 
So what's wrong with Star BMs? Being the only 9mm on the list I am wondering why no one had recommended it yet. And magazines aside, is the P-83 actually a better pistol than the Makarov? How does it stack up in reliability, and how long is that sheet metal frame really going to hold up?
 
Zastava Tokarev pistols are around that price range, They have a steel frame 9mm about the same size as the Star BM but I don't know much more about them.
 
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So what's wrong with Star BMs? Being the only 9mm on the list I am wondering why no one had recommended it yet. And magazines aside, is the P-83 actually a better pistol than the Makarov? How does it stack up in reliability, and how long is that sheet metal frame really going to hold up?
I'll wholeheartedly recommend the Star. The Modelo B and BM series are excellent pistols for everyone's collection and make fine shooters (if you can adapt to the old-style sights), especially if you're one who came up on 1911s. Well-built and reliable. While the Maks have a cult following, I personally find the Stars much more practical, especially for range use.

And, the Star is a movie star:

Pulp Fiction.jpg
 
Ive never had a Star BM, but if theyre anything like the Modelo B I had, itd be a fine (if a little heavy) pistol.

Im taking a look at Tokarevs lately. for no other reason than I like the 7.62x25.
 
Staked or soldered, I believe. I'll get mine out, but I almost think the front sight is machined as part of the slide ...
 
+1 on a Beretta 92S, JG Sales and Classic Arms among others have them cheap.

Next choice would be the Star.

I'm wary of any of the 9X18s because if Putin gets adventurous again the ammo supply may dry up fast and AFAIK, no domestic ammo companies produce it.
 
Alright, I'd be curious if there was any way to change out the sights, even if I had to modify or reshape existing sights to fit it.
 
+1 on a Beretta 92S, JG Sales and Classic Arms among others have them cheap.

Next choice would be the Star.

I'm wary of any of the 9X18s because if Putin gets adventurous again the ammo supply may dry up fast and AFAIK, no domestic ammo companies produce it.

Actually a few American companies produce it including Hornady. XTP bullets are readily available in .365" and you can bell out 9x19 brass, then run it through a 9x18 full length sizing die and trim down to 18mm, so sourcing brass is extremely easy. Also 9x18 pistols should be convertible to .380 with a barrel swap. But .32acp isn't a bad cartridge either, and prices and availability won't be effected by issues with Russia.
 
I'd get the Star of the ones mentioned, but I'd never even think about doing all those upgrades on any of those guns. If you're going to spend $700 on a gun I'd just find something I want for $700.
 
Alright, I'd be curious if there was any way to change out the sights, even if I had to modify or reshape existing sights to fit it.
Yeah, pretty much the way it was done on all the old Colt 1911s ... get to know a gunsmith, 'cause it's not always a do-it-yourself affair (ask me how I know) ... but as my brother reddog says, no point it doing a sight upgrade on a surplus shooter.

But I've always regarded Star pistols as worthy. Every collection should have a B, BM, a PD, and a Firestar (and the PD was a .45 ACP!).
 
The Star pictured above (from the film "Pulp Fiction") is actually a Super B. They double in film for the 1911 often because they function better with blanks.

I have one, and it's a very slick-feeling gun, and looks unissued. But I've not yet shot it.

I think you'd enjoy the Bulgarian Makarov. Mine is rock-solid and I really like how it handles and fires.

I have no experience with the 83. I do have the P64 and a CZ70, but haven't fired either. I guess I'm just not good at getting around to shooting guns as fast as I acquire them. My Romanian TTC is also waiting...
 
I would like to hear more about the CZ-70, it is a gorgeous pistol and I really like czech made firearms. I know the CZ-82/83 is out there but unfortunately I am in a 10 round limited state currently and 10rd mags for the double stack CZs are very expensive and hard to find.
 
I own a Makarov and a BM. I had a CZ70 but didn't care for it.

The BM has the best trigger of the three and seems well-made. I like it and my Super B very much.

The Makarov seems a little more primitive. Its DA trigger is a bit stiff, but not too bad. I've also had it since the late 1980's, and it's been rock-solid reliable. Like the BM, it's quite accurate.

My CZ70 was reliable, but fit my hand poorly. My couple of other friends who shot it also found it awkward to shoot.

I think I would lean towards the BM over the Makarov, as much because of caliber as anything else. They are both good pistols. I've never handled a P83.
 
And like others have said, upgrading a surplus pistol sort of defeats the purpose, imho. I like surplus pistols because I can get a good shooter that will last well, but is inexpensive. It's also cool to have an old-timey service pistol that's sort of a collectible.

Spending money to upgrade one seems like an odd choice. After it's upgraded, it's no longer inexpensive, nor is it collectible. That's just my two cents.
 
I like my CZ70. A little heavy, but compact, dependable, a nice hard DA pull. Reliable as all get out. Was @260$ OTD. Nice safety.
Very convenient to just throw in a pocket.
 
I am going to have to disagree with people saying it's not worth upgrading and personalizing just because the pistol is cheap. I have seen some absolutely gorgeous Maks, CZ70s, Stars, etc that all they needed was a new finish and some grips to look, feel, and shoot as well as any new pistol which will cost you $500 and still not be set up exactly the way you want it. I see no reason why the cost of any of these pistols should preclude them from being treated like any other.

CZ-70-1.jpg
5962722524_91f4b16799_o-2.jpg

8bf2c0c5cf87c834bde00465cb889b51.jpg
 
I am looking at surplus pistols in the $200-$300 range. Looking at JG sales and aimsurplus, what i find in this range that I would be most interested in is the Star BM, CZ70, Bulgarian Makarov, and P83 Wanad, Which of these do you think is the better all around pistol? Best value, most reliable, most accurate? Whichever one I choose will probably end up getting a new finish, new springs, upgrades sights, trigger work, and custom grips.

Does anyone know what sort of reliability and accuracy to expect out of any of them?

Google for price & parts avalability for what you are considering and go from there. Best from point of gun capability would be European police Betetta M9. Check out Southern Ohio Gun to see what they have.
 
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As far as parts go I can find the most parts available for the Maks, but the Star is getting more attention and I discovered you can modify Sig P225 magazines to fit and work in the pistol. Small parts I can fabricate for any of them if they aren't too complex so I am not too worried about parts.
 
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