Why Doesn't Cabela's Ship BP guns?

Discussion in 'Blackpowder' started by ThomasT, Mar 3, 2021.

  1. SixteenGauge

    SixteenGauge Member

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    Federal law does not prohibit people convicted of state misdemeanors where you could have been imprisoned for 2 years or less. Says so in no uncertain terms on page 4 of the federal form 4473. As to the actual federal law 18 USC 921 A 20
    "(20)The term “crime punishable by imprisonment for a term exceeding one year” does not include—
    State offenses pertaining to antitrust violations, unfair trade practices, restraints of trade, or other similar offenses relating to the regulation of business practices, or
    State offense classified by the laws of the State as a misdemeanor and punishable by a term of imprisonment of two years or less."

    According to Maryland laws, their sentancing for common-law assault is "Shall not exceed 10 years" hence why his firearms were confiscated.
     
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  2. Loyalist Dave

    Loyalist Dave Member

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    Alas,
    Even Law Enforcement doesn't necessarily understand the laws as they are written.

    So "consulting" the local person who is authorized to enforce the law, does not mean that you will get a) accurate information, and b) if you are told something that is incorrect, your breaking of a law because a law enforcement officer, even if it was the local chief of police, does NOT shield you from the consequences of the breaking of that law should you be prosecuted.

    BECAUSE in the case you cite above..., your source is woefully incorrect as cap-n-ball revolvers NOT fall under the Federal definition of "handgun". Because according to the actual wording of the law, the item as defined must FIRST be a "firearm", and remain in that category, and since cap-n-ball revolvers are placed into the subcategory of "antique firearm" , then the rest of the criteria in the definition of "handgun" are moot, and do not apply.
    Your source's rank is irrelevant.


    Title 18 U.S. Code § 921

    (16)The term "antique firearm" means—
    (A) any firearm (including any firearm with a matchlock, flintlock, percussion cap, or similar type of ignition system) manufactured in or before 1898; or

    (B) any replica of any firearm described in subparagraph (A) if such replica—
    (i) is not designed or redesigned for using rimfire or conventional centerfire fixed annumition,

    (29)The term "handgun" means— (A) a firearm which has a short stock and is designed to be held and fired by the use of a single hand;



    LD
     
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  3. Loyalist Dave

    Loyalist Dave Member

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    AH yes I'm sorry, but that is the law today.
    In the 1990's the law was, "Any sentence that is not cruel and unusual", there was no actual cap on incarceration, which could include imprisonment more than 12 months, and...,
    The Feds back then did not separate the state laws from the Federal 12 month requirement. Since that time, the sentencing limit in Maryland has gone from Common Law to Statutory Law and is capped, and the Feds also found that a lot of crimes at the state level were crossing the Federal threshold which the Feds had not intended, and so changed that what the Feds would enforce.

    LD
     
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  4. gtrgy888

    gtrgy888 Member

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    As correct as you likely are, consulting the law enforcement in your area DOES predict how likely you are to face significant legal headaches if you undertake certain actions including incarceration and appealing to the Supreme Court when the ambiguities of your case demand a more definitive and historic resolution.
     
  5. Loyalist Dave

    Loyalist Dave Member

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    Assuming the court hears your case....,
    You are arguing what should happen. I am stating what Has happened.

    LD
     
  6. Ugly Sauce

    Ugly Sauce Member

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    Bow hunters. For a long time, my fellow hunters and I wondered why most of the game dept. rule-breaking and poaching was being done by bow hunters, which always proceeds our muzzle loading season. I always thought they were the most ethical, right? Sometimes I bow hunt...never occurred to me to cheat. One day my friend and I discovered where some bow hunters had driven into a closed/off road/roads closed area, on ATV's no motor vehicles allowed, hauled in a bunch of lumber and built this big blind on national forest land...also very illegal. So we got a hold of the game dept. and they came out, and I'm like "I can't believe bow hunters do this". The warden then informed me that many of the bow hunters are ex-con, and can only archery hunt, so archery season is actually the busy or worst time for infractions and poaching. And just plain stupid stuff like the blind. You know, leave ATV tracks leading into the forest, and build a blind at the end of them...just a trail a blind (!!!) man could follow. !!!! Who would have thought? Fooled me. Never did hear what happened when they caught them. The Warden seemed to have a good idea of who it was. Kind of, "oh yeah...those guys again".
     
  7. DocRock

    DocRock Member

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    The Brady Bunch do not expect to win this case. Their goals are two-fold: 1) secure a settlement with Cabelas that diminishes access to firearms (muzzle-loading or otherwise), a goal that may have been achieved, and/or 2) create litigation fatigue so that Cabelas and other retailers will cease selling muzzle loaders and firearms.

    Bass Pro, owner of Cabela's is not publicly traded, otherwise, coincident with the litigation would be a minority shareholder motion to cease sales of muzzle loaders and firearms to diminish litigation risk and costs. Since Bass Pro is not publicly traded, what they will do instead is go to Bass Pros line of credit holder, their revolver or whatever other mechanisms they have, and outline the substantial risks that the Cabelas firearm business represents, urging them to alter credit terms unfavorably to Bass Pro to offset this risk. They will likely do the same with Bass Pro's insurance companies, and any bond holders that may exist. They don't need to win cases, they just need to bring cases and portray the Cabelas firearms business as a serious risk to investors and creditors. The end game is to hassle and harry anyone selling firearms, to reduce the profit margin in such sales, to secure settlements that diminish firearms sales profitability, and to diminish investor and social acceptability for firearms sales.
     
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  8. Loyalist Dave

    Loyalist Dave Member

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    Exactly correct.
    Bow also make a lot less noise, so tough to find them.
    In fact it's a very very small percentage that do the "damage" to the rest of us... people hear and read about the negative folks, not the positive...

    THEN the People's Republic of Maryland PEOPLES REPUBLIC OF MARYLAND.JPG went to a phone in checking system. So the law is that IF you fill your tag with a buck, you then must fill two more tags with does, before you use your extra buck tag, where the extra buck tag is allowed....,
    ..., SO what these guys do is shoot a buck, and maybe they call it in or maybe they don't..., but if they do because maybe the Warden is on to them and watchin' them..., no worries. They then call in and register two doe that they didn't shoot yet. So their extra buck tag is now valid. Then they hunt the second buck. DNR can't really prove that they didn't shoot the two doe that they checked in. "Where's the two doe you shot yesterday?" "I ate 'em" or "I gave 'em away".... who's to say otherwise?


    You can't really document the guy who passes on a shot because he thought maybe he saw some orange on the other side of the deer? Better to be safe.
    Or the guy who passes on the shot because the other side of the deer is a roadway, or he can clearly see the boundary for the state park is a mere foot in front of the deer that't facing him..., "heck shoot it and then drag it a foot" <says the tiny devil standing on his left shoulder, whispering in his ear>, but NOPE that's wrong and he won't do it.

    We also don't document the guys who share their game of any sort with the folks trying to make ends meet. SURE, they might be on assistance from the state and aren't going to starve, but there's something about preserving somebody's self respect when you share game with somebody fighting to make ends meet, or they just went on assistance and it's taking time for the first check or the food stamp card to arrive....,

    LD
     
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