With the extent of the pitting on the frame and slide in its current state, there isn't any real collector value left to destroy with a refinish. If your willing to spend the money, I'd say get it refinished to protect it from further corrosion. Also send it to a reputable shop that knows what they are doing with a 1903 and knows how to properly refinish the flats of the gun without dishing pin holes or removing the roll marks.
Would you refinish this Colt 1903?
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ApacheCoTodd
member
Yup, I'd parkerize it and carry it just like the one I did 20 years ago in .32.
SharpsDressedMan
member
It CAN be refinshed, even by a reputable shop, but the issue remains that such costs will outweight the result, and the resulting value: the surface pitting, etc, is so bad, it won't all be removed, or the rollmarks will go with it. It is serviceable as-is, and won't cost any more, as-is. You can put makup on an ugly woman, but she will still be ugly. She might be "servicable", but she is never going to be un-ugly.
Good analogy.
And I guess the bottom line is, it's a personal choice. Personally I would shoot it and oil it. But it's up to the OP.
You see a friend of mine has a very ugly wife, who spends a lot on money on clothes and make up, and I keep my thoughts to myself.
SharpsDressedMan
member
Ugly is also in the eyes of the beholder. We might even differ on the appearance of a friend's wife, but the issue of a lot of money for makeup might remain. That was all I wanted to point out; one could spend a lot, but not get much for our money as a result.
Walt Sherrill
Member
I think the owner is content to just keep it as is, and and shoot it -- and it's probably a good shooter. But, I'd argue that the photos of the left side of the gun, seen in message #3 do not show "normal wear, not abuse."
Look again: http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=179996&d=1361232641
What you see in message #3, in the area around the safety and grips, is evidence of severe rust that was heavily buffed and then reblued. Even the marks on the slide are softened, and the serial number is almost worn away by buffing. The rust (pitting) on the frame was so deep that the surface couldn't be kept even.
Rust is not "wear." Rust is evidence of neglect. I've seen this a number of times in guns that were put away in drawers for years (decades, even), wrapped in cloth (meant to protect them, but which somehow got damp -- humidity, a spill, etc.) One side would look pretty good, but the side would be badly rusted. That looks to be the case, here.
None of this keeps it from being a good shooter... If it were mine, I'd probably go over it with "cold blue" to give it a more uniform appearance, and then go to the range. <grin>
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Walt Sherrill
Member
CZguy said:
I suspect your comment was offered tongue-in-cheek... Almost any form of welding can add (or replace lost) metal. But the point was that a badly rusted gun frame's surface can't be made to look right once major damage is done. While metal can be added back to the frame, that large redone surface (for the gun in question) would then have to be machined to restore the desired flatness and, in turn, refinished. To make matters worse, areas like where the serial number and slide markings are almost buffed away, would have to be either be left alone, or redone -- either way, it wouldn't look right. The trademark Colt on the rear of the slide is almost buffed away. This is NOT normal wear.
It would also be very unlikely that the new added metal, when refinished, would match the older (original) metal, and you'd end up with a finish that look mottled or strange. You might even find it necessary to have the frame re-hardened, as welding would would probably disrupt anything previously done.
The best gun RESTORERS can and sometimes will do all of this, but then the owner would end up with a gun that cost him $thousands...
Unless you can show us pictures of a gun once badly rusted over a large area of it's frame that has been restored by TIG or other forms of welding, I think CZGuy's response is, practically speaking, valid.
A careful Duracoat job might cover much of the roughness -- but probably cover a lot of the important marks, like serial number, and rollmarks.
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SharpsDressedMan
member
There you go. Bondo the crap out of it filling all the pits, then sand it smooth, and Duracoat it. Much like a fine auto paint job!
A little bit, yes. Most of what you described as part of the restoration process did occur to me (not sure if heat-treating the slide would be necessary), but I didn't feel like bringing all that up when a simple reply would do. However, you do bring up a good point: the more extensive the restoration, the more $$$$ it will be! Especially if you have to re-roll or re-stamp marks, refinish metal, temper, etc. etc. That would be more of a labor of love to me. My inclination for most beater guns is to refinish it to utilitarian status and shoot it for fun. However, sometimes it's worth it for whatever reason to do an original, extensive restoration. You'll end up with a beautiful gun and lighter pockets
stevekozak
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I would just keep it oiled really well and shoot it. That pitting on the left side is aweful, and I don't think you are going to make it much better. Shoot it for what it is a pretty cool $240 gun and leave it at that.
It sounds like the OP has his mind made up about the refinish. The question I would ask is... what would the refinish cost, and would it improve the value of the gun? If you spent $500 on a refinish, but only had a $300 shooter after the work was done, then what is the point?
Walt Sherrill
Member
I suggested that he do it himself with one of the Brownells products. That won't be very costly, won't hurt the value of a non-collectible gun, and will look better than it does, now.
Sending it away to be reblued would give him a more robust, durable finish (than cold blue), but it really won't look that much different. He won't have to touch up worns spots as frequently is the main difference, and it'll cost a good bit more than a do-it-yourself effort, if he has it hot-blued by a gunsmith or refinisher. The surface is too degraded to do much else, as remaining marks will be lost if it's buffed much.
Sending it away to be reblued would give him a more robust, durable finish (than cold blue), but it really won't look that much different. He won't have to touch up worns spots as frequently is the main difference, and it'll cost a good bit more than a do-it-yourself effort, if he has it hot-blued by a gunsmith or refinisher. The surface is too degraded to do much else, as remaining marks will be lost if it's buffed much.
ryan3465
Member
Hello all!
Just wanted to share with you the results of some touch up work on my Colt 1903:
I just used some ultra fine steel wool lightly to take off some surface rust and grime and then completely degreaser it, put some gloves on and touched up the worn spots with oxpho blue liquid cold blue and lightly buffed to a pretty decent shine. Oiled it and took it to the range. Thank you everyone for your input!
Just wanted to share with you the results of some touch up work on my Colt 1903:
I just used some ultra fine steel wool lightly to take off some surface rust and grime and then completely degreaser it, put some gloves on and touched up the worn spots with oxpho blue liquid cold blue and lightly buffed to a pretty decent shine. Oiled it and took it to the range. Thank you everyone for your input!
SharpsDressedMan
member
Looks quiite good!
toiville2feathers
Member
No matter how bad a curio or relic maybe, no amount of restoration is going to positively increase the value of the gun. In fact its going to take away from the value of the gun.
Kind of like old women who dye there hair and wear tight fitting pants. They still don't get asked to the senior prom.
Kind of like old women who dye there hair and wear tight fitting pants. They still don't get asked to the senior prom.
ryan3465
Member
While I don't disagree with you, this piece is strictly a shooter that was just a little beat up and needed some touch up work, that's all.
Walt Sherrill
Member
You got such good results with the slide and the top of the frame, you should consider spendind a little time on the front- and backstrap.
It turned out looking pretty nice!!
It turned out looking pretty nice!!
ryan3465
Member
Thanks Walt! It took a little time but ultimately was worth it. I'm planning on doing some more work on the backstrap and front strap, I'm thinking ill need to put a bit more time into those, since they are the areas that will see the most contact. Is there any way to make the oxpho blue more resistant in these areas, I.E. doing the touch up in several different layers or applying some sort of protectant after I'm finished?
Walt Sherrill
Member
I don't know if ANYTHING will work with cold blue, but it's very easy to just touch it up, periodically, with a dampened (with bluing liquid) pad. G96 Bluing Creme added to the Ox-Pho Blue (each done in alternating layers) seemed to darken better, and held up well. (But that may have been wishful thinking on my part...)
ryan3465
Member
Thanks for the advice Walt, I will try the alternating method as you described. I am under the impression that oxpho blue doesn't require me to neutralize the bluing action with water after application, is that your understanding as well? The only reason i ask is because I had a Birchwood Casey bluing kit in the past which require me to stop the bluing action when I was finished applying the bluing solution. I just don't want to cause any damage to the gun, that's all.
Walt Sherrill
Member
I don't remember, and the bottle of chemicals is a good distance from this keyboard. But I did multiple applications without applying water between applications.
I do know, however, that if you don't use water to stop the chemical action when you're through for the day, you may be surprised with what you find the next time you look at the gun -- especially if you wait a day or two. <grin>
I do know, however, that if you don't use water to stop the chemical action when you're through for the day, you may be surprised with what you find the next time you look at the gun -- especially if you wait a day or two. <grin>
dhcustomwork
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Nice job on the clean up. Looks quite a bit better.
Like Walt, I usually do a few coats before using water. Also try to do several coats before blending with steel wool. The one issue I run into with blending is it removing way more of the new color than you think it should. Just part of the process I guess, but its a bit irritating when you see all that nice blue come right off. It's actually leaving good dark metal underneath and just needs to be built up again.
Like Walt, I usually do a few coats before using water. Also try to do several coats before blending with steel wool. The one issue I run into with blending is it removing way more of the new color than you think it should. Just part of the process I guess, but its a bit irritating when you see all that nice blue come right off. It's actually leaving good dark metal underneath and just needs to be built up again.
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