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You have them. We want them.

Discussion in 'Legal' started by Tall Man, May 6, 2005.

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  1. Tall Man

    Tall Man Member

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    http://www.clarionledger.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20050502/NEWS01/505020350/1002

    May 2, 2005
    Project sets sights on illegal guns
    By Lora Hines
    lohines@clarionledger.com

    Local law enforcement officials predict a new program to get illegal guns off Jackson streets could begin by the end of the year.

    U.S. Attorney Dunn Lampton wants to start a gun interdiction unit through the Jackson Police Department. Officers would use vans equipped with gun-firing tanks to test weapons taken at the scene of vehicle stops and crime scenes.

    Laboratory technicians would analyze cartridge casings and projectiles to determine whether those weapons had been reported stolen and used in crimes. The test results would be entered into a database linked to a national gun database.

    Lampton said he started thinking about the program long before two Jackson police officers recently were shot by suspects using stolen weapons.

    On March 17, Officer Thomas Catchings died following a shootout with carjacker Omar Hampton, 18. Hampton also was killed.

    Jesse James Powell, 49, of Jackson is accused of selling Hampton the gun he used to kill Catchings.

    Last Monday, convicted felon Marvin Stamps used a gun stolen from a Forest Hills Road home to shoot at Officer Jerry Shoulders during a two-hour standoff. Stamps, 30, shot himself in the head as he hid in a shed.

    Police don't know whether Stamps stole the gun or got it after the burglary.

    "These two shootings really upped the urgency of (the program)," Lampton said.

    Project Safe Neighborhoods, a committee designed to target people using illegal firearms, has about $360,000 from the U.S. Department of Justice to pay for the program, Lampton said. The group, which includes law enforcement officials and residents, could decide this month to approve the idea.

    Committee President Delbert Hosemann said members will favor the plan.

    "One of our main goals is to get people to leave their handguns behind," he said. "Those individuals would leave their guns at home in fear they would be obtained in a legal search of their automobile."

    If fewer people carry guns, fewer violent crimes will happen, Hosemann said.

    Committee members have gone to the Mississippi State Penitentiary at Parchman to ask inmates how they got weapons. Many said they bought them on the streets, Lampton said.

    He envisions interdiction officers developing sources throughout the city to determine where people buy illegal guns. He also is hopeful pawn shop owners and gun show salesmen would allow the unit to test weapons and enter the information into the database.

    "(The unit) has to have a starting place," Lampton said. "If you don't build a database, it's useless."

    He thinks criminals who steal guns or buy stolen guns will be less likely to use them because they won't know whether those guns previously have been tested and are in the database. Felons caught with guns face a maximum three-year state prison sentence. In federal court, they could face as much as 15 years if they are career criminals, Lampton said.

    State law says an individual must be at least 18 to possess a handgun but must be at least 21 to buy a handgun. It requires a permit if a gun is carried anywhere other than a person's home, business or automobile.

    Mississippians who are at least 21 must apply for a four-year concealed weapon permit.

    Jackson Police Chief Robert Moore said his department is working to get equipment ordered and officers and lab analysts trained for the unit.

    "It could make a major difference," he said.
    ===
     
  2. Henry Bowman

    Henry Bowman Senior Member

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    Who are you kidding here? [We need a "shakes head in disbelief" smiley.]

    Illegal guns?
    Why not leave the guns alone and get the criminals off the streets?
     
  3. Vernal45

    Vernal45 member

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    That screams POLICE STATE. Let the LEO's defend this one.
     
  4. dolanp

    dolanp Member

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    I sure don't have a problem with the police enforcing existing laws.
     
  5. armoredman

    armoredman Member

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    Hmm. Terry stop turns up handgun. Handgun is taked by PD under Reasonable Fear precaution. OK. All good under Supreme Court. Where do they get the authority to test fire same firearm, as that is defacto registration through the backdoor of "firearms fingerprinting", never mind how inaccurate that is? I would buy a few barrels for my carry pistol, and swap them regularly...unless that's also illegal in this Gestapo State. Good Lord Above, thank you for letting me be born in AZ!
     
  6. zahc

    zahc Member

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    If that's the case, why are the police still carrying thier guns?

    Or, by 'people', maybe he means 'proles'.
     
  7. centac

    centac member

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    If the weapon is lawfully possessed no probable cause will ignite, so whats the prob? If you are worried about what might happen in the way of abuse, well that's the same logic that people who want to get rid of guns use - they mightbe used for ill.
     
  8. Johnnybgood

    Johnnybgood Member

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    Centac

    The problem is that there is no "maybe" with government. We already know that they want all the power and us disarmed.
     
  9. Aggie1

    Aggie1 Member

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    Or it could be a major waste of tax dollars. Which do you think is more likely? :banghead:
     
  10. SMMAssociates

    SMMAssociates Member

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    Sheesh....

    And this guy's in a position of trust? :fire: Forty states, give or take, and nearly that many years now, with various forms of concealed carry, have pretty well shown precisely the opposite. :banghead:

    May the fleas of 10,000 camels nest in his underware drawer.... :neener:
     
  11. jefnvk

    jefnvk Member

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    So, then why don't they just arrest the person for illegal gun possession, send them away for many years to a federal prison, and there won't be a problem.
     
  12. P95Carry

    P95Carry Moderator Emeritus

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    Now - with that small but vital addition - I doubt there would be any controversy!!!
     
  13. beerslurpy

    beerslurpy member

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    I think by "illegal guns" they mean "guns carried by people who are known for doing illegal things and have felony convictions to that effect"

    Actually a Terry Stop specifically involves searching the immediate area if the officer beleives he may be at risk. If someone has a violent felony record, that could be construed as probably cause to perhaps frisk them for weapons. If any are discovered, oh noes!
     
  14. Standing Wolf

    Standing Wolf Member in memoriam

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    Oh, fine! Go ahead and be reasonable! See if anybody in government cares!
     
  15. Vernal45

    Vernal45 member

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    The statement above is not targeting criminals, its targeting guns.



    Vehicle Stops. Hmmm, sounds a lot like Traffic Stops to me.
     
  16. Coronach

    Coronach Moderator Emeritus

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    They are talking about guns seized incident to lawful arrests, or guns discovered via lawful searches of motor vehicles that are being transported illegally (read: owner did not have a CCW permit, and/or was under disability and unable to own the gun). IOW, the weapons would be taken anyway, and the owners arrested for felonies.

    OK. If that's the case...why does this lab need to be mobile? What am I missing here? How is this any different from turning the guns in at the property room and having them sent to the lab and tested? I cannot decide if this is just a dumb idea, or if the journalists and/or PR people left a bunch of stuff out, or both.

    As is, this seems like a great big rolling boondoggle to me. I agree that this will do nothing. What would be far more efficient would be to have the criminals locked up when they are caught. One must realize, however, that this is not something the police can control. Ask any line officer which he would prefer, an actual honest-to-God 10-year sentence for a thug (as in, he actually spends 3,650 days with his arse in a cell), or a brand new state of the art rolling crime lab to test captured guns, and he'll opt for the jail time. The problem is that the prosecutors cut deals, the judges grant probation, the politicians won't fund the jails...and the police are left to try creative means to actually put/keep the people they catch in jail. This sounds like one of those "bright ideas", and I don't think its gonna do anything but burn money.

    Mike
     
  17. R.H. Lee

    R.H. Lee Member

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    Yeah. In your dreams.
     
  18. XLMiguel

    XLMiguel Member

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    Stupid beyond words. There is no rational cost/benefit analysis that could make sense without a lot of scotch or crack consumed in the process. :banghead:
     
  19. Vernal45

    Vernal45 member

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    Where in the article does it say weapons seized in lawful arrests?
     
  20. Cool Hand Luke 22:36

    Cool Hand Luke 22:36 member

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    Standing the truth on it's head.
     
  21. Cool Hand Luke 22:36

    Cool Hand Luke 22:36 member

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    Make sure it's not a Makarov. The Feds were still rousting anyone who's bought a new barrel for one looking for the murderer of a Federal prosecutor last I heard.
     
  22. benEzra

    benEzra Moderator Emeritus

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    They seem to be speaking of everyone here, not just criminals.

    Does this mean that if you as a law-abiding citizen are stopped and have a gun legally in the car, and they find out about it, they are going to have you wait while they do ballistic testing on it at the site of the stop? The ONLY reason I can think of for a mobile lab would be to build a database of guns that they are NOT going to bring back to the station.
     
  23. Old Fuff

    Old Fuff Member

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    I also wonder why an expensive "mobile lab" is necessary for "on-site" testing. Perhaps this is the answer:

    "He also is hopeful pawn shop owners and gun show salesmen would allow the unit to test weapons and enter the information into the database."

    It would also seem that the word "people" is used interchangeably with "criminal."

    I think the point of this program is to test any and every firearm the police may come across and enter the information - regardless of how inaccurate it may be - into a database. What we have here is "mobile bullet fingerprinting," and as a crime-fighting tool it is likely to be an expensive bust. If they have grounds to confiscate a firearm it can be tested in the usual manner.
     
  24. gc70

    gc70 Member

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    Mandatory CCW :D
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2005
  25. Desertdog

    Desertdog Member

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    Is he talking about the honest citizen who is afraid the cops will confiscate their legal firearms?

    Less armed honest citizens means more gun crime as demonstrated by Washington DC, New York City and New Jersey.
     
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