38spl conundrum

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I found about 100 Remington 38spl cases at my club the other night and thought i hit the jackpot but I've hit a conundrum.

Several months ago i purchased startline brass from midway and noticed the case lengths were all over the place so i trimmed each one to the shortest I had but still within SAMMI spec. I can feel the size die and the flare die with the starline but when I ran the 38spl Remington's in the size die i didn't feel the resistance i usually do. I then noticed that when I would size the Remington's they would grow about 3k and all over the place in OAL by about 2-3k. I double checked the calipers with a known length and they are spot on.

Now comes the good one-seeing how i had to trim about 7k off the starline to get uniform brass i did so with about 10 of the Remington's and when i put them in the flare die there is no resistance whatsoever. they are being flare because i made a dummy round with one and i could seat the bullet a few thousandths. This brass also feels very soft when i was trimming the 10 pieces the trimmer would just eat right through it like a hot knife through butter. i found about 3 Winchesters also and you could feel the resistance in the trimmer and then die.

could this just be very, very soft brass and I'm not feeling it? A few of them looked a little off so they got the pliers and scrap bucket treatment and even when smashing them they felt very soft.

what would cause this?
 
Check case thickness it's either thinner or softer brass. I have experienced this with loading random case .38 plinkers some just feel like almost no drag in sizer but they all worked.
 
Sounds like some nice, malleable brass. As long as it will hold the bullets and not jump the crimp or telescope you are good to go. Brass will work harden slowly from reloading and shooting. Soft, malleable brass is good for complete case obturation, makes for a cleaner gun and cleaner fired brass.

Lafitte
 
I remember shooting WW 9mm back in the 90s that had softer brass. It would leave more shavings in the gun than other makes. If the Remington is brass from factory wadcutters it is most likely thinner. That would account for the ease in sizing and trimming. Wadcutters brass is usually thinner as the entire bullet gets seated in the case. You can verify this by weighing the brass and/or cutting it in half lengthwise.

I've never trimmed a handgun caliber case in my life. I do keep my brass in lots and I might have to make some adjustment to seating and crimping going from lot to lot. This is a lot easier to do than trim 1000s of cases.

Revolver brass usually gets split necks at some time if you reload it enough. Semiautomatic brass gets that and mutilated extractor grooves. Brass is brass. It won't last forever.
 
Rem is know to have thinner wall and softer than any other brass. So what you experience is normal. Be sure to check neck tension because the thinner wall normally requires the expander to be adjusted, backed off. After a few cycles it get harder but your still dealing with the thin wall. Rem brass is good if your shooting lead for it gives you a little extra room.
 
Seen it plenty myself. As long as the bullets stay put okay then you should be fine!

I shoot a lot of plinking level loads in 38, so it would not bother me. Honestly I would use other brass if you are loading anything HOT.
 
I experienced this as well last week loading .38 spec. Loaded a batch (90) and several were "different". Several were tougher that most, but, every one that seemed too easy...had the RP head stamp. I was loading moderate 158 swc so it was "carry on"...I've seen this before.

Mark
 
You said you found the brass?? I would be concerned about whether the previous owner had tried to anneal those cases and over did it. For me, using them would be a judgement call for sure.
 
homatok said:
You said you found the brass?? I would be concerned about whether the previous owner had tried to anneal those cases and over did it. For me, using them would be a judgement call for sure.
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Yes my private club has buckets we put brass into. someone has been repeatedly shooting 38/357, 357 sig, 44mag, and some other oddball calibers and leaving all the brass in the buckets. either they are rich or its old brass from reloads. we found 30 carbine in the bucket last week. I tossed all the Remington brass because of it growing and not sizing right. i actually had some grow about 3-4k.
 
Almost all of my 38 Special brass is new, nickel-plated Remington purchased in 1992. What I found is that if I trim them to the same length (most came at a length slightly longer than the SAAMI trim length and I settled on that), size them and apply a moderate crimp to my 158 grain JHP loads, they do just fine.

I don't find any material "growth" in the length of the cases after each firing so I stopped trimming them after the first trim.
 
The advantage to trimming brass comes when crimping. The crimp dies work on the case length, and the crimp varies if the brass is of varying lengths. Roll crimps are affected more than taper.

Starline brass is known for being thicker than others. I haven't had a problem with varying length. What I have purchased has been on the short side, but not enough to matter. If it happens again, call and ask why.
 
Slamfire said:
Keep on shooting and reloading. In time, you will determine that trimming 38 Special brass is a waste of time.
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reason I trimmed them is the starline was all over the place so instead of adjusting dies for starline shorter than Remington brass I trimmed the Remington to the starline brass so all uniform.
 
My RP brass is always softer and yes you can feel it. Some brass like PMC 38's offer more resistance to forming. I pretty much ignore it, but also give the brass a good visual inspection because split cases feel like RP cases!
 
I trim .38 Spl, because various brands of .38 brass picked up at the range is all over the place on lengths, and I like consistent crimps, even if it is a very light taper crimp, and even though I have proven to myself that I cannot shoot the difference between new/used/crimped/uncrimped/trimmed/untrimmed .38 Spl loads. :)
 
Blue68f100 said:
Rem is know to have thinner wall and softer than any other brass. So what you experience is normal. Be sure to check neck tension because the thinner wall normally requires the expander to be adjusted, backed off. After a few cycles it get harder but your still dealing with the thin wall. Rem brass is good if your shooting lead for it gives you a little extra room.
Click to expand...
Had a few boxes of Rem. 45 Colt new-bought brass similar to yours. Started using 45 ACP dies and it was just the difference that made them work.
 
The only handgun brass I trim is my .38 Special Wadcutter brass. And the reason for that is simply to make this precious brass last longer by eliminating any incipient neck splits.

Don
 
Walkalong said:
I trim .38 Spl, because various brands of .38 brass picked up at the range is all over the place on lengths, and I like consistent crimps, even if it is a very light taper crimp, and even though I have proven to myself that I cannot shoot the difference between new/used/crimped/uncrimped/trimmed/untrimmed .38 Spl loads. :)
Click to expand...

Thank you for this post. My sentiments exactly.
 
Slamfire said:
Keep on shooting and reloading. In time, you will determine that trimming 38 Special brass is a waste of time.
Click to expand...


True. When I started reloading I was all about case length. Never check pistol cases anymore. The Lee factory crimp die is best I found for cases with different lengths
 
JONWILL said:
The Lee factory crimp die is best I found for cases with different lengths
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The standard Lee FCD for pistol won't help with varying case lengths for pistol calibers. It crimps like any other pistol caliber crimp die. It's claim to fame is the carbide ring in it that "post sizes" and "fixes" problems like fat cases, bulges from poor crimps, too large diameters due to fat bullets, etc, etc. Irons out errors. It does have a little flex from the o-ring on the crimp adjustment, unlike others that have the crimp ledge in the die body, but will still give varying crimps with shorter/longer cases.

The rifle FCD is a "stab" or "collet" type crimp and it doesn't care about case length. It would be true for this FCD.

You can special order a Lee rifle type crimp die for some revolver calibers. It doesn't matter what the case length variance is with those. It would be true with those as well.
 
From the Lee advertising for the standard pistol FCD on the page Iinked to:
Revolver dies roll crimp with no limit as to the amount.
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Any die can do this, but too much will damage the round. Sure, I can adjust it down too far, but why would I want to damage the round?

A perfect taper crimp is applied to auto-loader rounds.
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If you adjust it properly, it sure will, just like other taper crimp seaters or stand alone crimp dies.

The crimper cannot be misadjusted to make a case mouth too small to properly head-space.
Click to expand...
Nonsense, it sure can, just like any other straight walled auto caliber crimp die.

Gotta love Lee's over the top advertising. :)
 
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