All around big game rifle / cartridge combo ??

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stuffisgood

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I've been kicking this idea around for quite a while and I think I've finally talked myself into making some changes in the safe...

I've started to accumulate more medium to large caliber hunting rifles than I have a use for, and I would like to thin them down and buy something new. I live in the Missouri Ozarks so my larger sized game is pretty limited (whitetail deer at biggest).

This is not something that I will be using around home, I have my whitetail rifles covered, and am very pleased with what I have... I'm looking to get something for that always talked about "trip out west". It's becoming much closer to a reality, as well as a trip to Alaska to hunt Caribou with one of my dads friends. Right now what I keep coming back to is a Winchester M70 Classic in .338 Win mag.

For those of you with experience hunting our larger creatures. Would you be ok with my selection? If there is something that you would suggest instead, what I am really interested in is WHY.
 
Oh boy, here we go. Just went through this here myself, ended up settling on that .338 you mentioned. One fella brought up the 9.3x62, that was interesting and I still may pick one up, but .338 win mag seemed the most sensible. My decision was based on elk, moose, and brown bears. What you plan on huntin, bud?
 
I will say that depending on what you already use to hunt whitetails, you may not "need" another rifle for Out West.

Elk are big, tenacious critters, but they aren't bullet proof. If you already use a .270 Win, .308 Win, .30-06, or similar to hunt whitetail, you could be set with simply a better load selection. Any of these or similar cartridges loaded with a medium/heavy for caliber controlled expansion bullet has plenty of "umph" for elk at most commonly encountered hunting distances. If you are expecting maybe a little longer shots, you may want to go with one of the short magnums or a tried and proven belted mag like the 7mm Rem Mag or .300 Win, as well as the .338 Win you already are considering. The .30 and .338 caliber magnums dish out a little more recoil than you may be used to, so make sure you practice with it before going into the field.

For sure if Alaska is on the menu and you may find yourself facing down a large bruin or 1500 pound moose, the .338 Win may be the way to go, but be aware such power isn't necessary for the majority of our hunting here, and will require some dedication to master.
 
stuffisgood said:
I've been kicking this idea around for quite a while and I think I've finally talked myself into making some changes in the safe...

I've started to accumulate more medium to large caliber hunting rifles than I have a use for, and I would like to thin them down and buy something new. I live in the Missouri Ozarks so my larger sized game is pretty limited (whitetail deer at biggest).

This is not something that I will be using around home, I have my whitetail rifles covered, and am very pleased with what I have... I'm looking to get something for that always talked about "trip out west". It's becoming much closer to a reality, as well as a trip to Alaska to hunt Caribou with one of my dads friends. Right now what I keep coming back to is a Winchester M70 Classic in .338 Win mag.

For those of you with experience hunting our larger creatures. Would you be ok with my selection? If there is something that you would suggest instead, what I am really interested in is WHY.
Click to expand...
Hey neighbor. I'd be calling guides or Alaskas version of DNR, and have them make a recommendation.

Hopefully Float Pilot chimes in.
 
I know I don't NEED another rifle, what I already have will more than cover my hunting needs in North America.

What's currently in the safe that would be suitable for whitetail and larger...

Winchester 94 30-30
Winchester 86 45-70
Ruger #1 375 H&H
Remington 700 .243
Winchester M70 Featherweight .257 Roberts
Winchester 100 .308
Tikka M695 7mm Rem Mag
Mauser K98 .270

The 30-30 is what I killed my first handful of deer with and I won't be parting with, even if it hasn't shot a deer in well over a decade. The 86 is a repro that I picked up for a swingin deal. I'd like to hunt with it at some point, maybe take it as a backup. The 375 I also got for a great deal to keep on that chance that I get to go to Africa or hunt some of the really dangerous stuff at some point in life. The .243 is my wifes deer rifle. The 257 is my deer rifle that I absolutely love :D The .308 I got cheap with the intention of keeping around as a loaner/backup rifle. The 7mm is what I killed deer with for about 12 years before switching over to the Bob. Shoots 140/150 gr bullets well under MOA, heavier loads look like a shotgun pattern. The 270 was another good deal purchase. I've kept the 270 and 7mm around the past few years for hunting the big fields, but I haven't and don't suppose I will.

Anyhow... Here's what I'm thinking 1.) Sell the 270 and 7mm and get the 338 2.) Sell the 308 and EITHER the 7mm or 270, or all of the above...

I hand load, so factory availability isn't an issue
 
I like the choice in a rifle, but the 338 is a specalized tool, not an all around choice. There is nothing you cannot successfly hunt in N. America with a 30-06. One of the 300 mags do the same thing at greater range. If I were buying 1 rifle for anything in NA from coyote to brown bear,it would be a Winchester 70 EW in 300 WSM.

With heavy 200-220 gr bullets it will actually out perform a 338 on the big bears.

http://www.fs.fed.us/pnw/pubs/gtr152

Study done by the Alaska game and fish dept. concluding that you have to move all the way up to 375 mag to see any gains in performance over 30-06 or 300 mags. on large bears.



With lighter bullets you have the trajectory and energy for deer or elk at 500+ yards. And do it with a lighter rifle for carrying up the mountains, less expense, and with less recoil.
 
All-around rifle?

A .30/06 is a good choice for all thin-skinned, non-dangerous game worldwide with the possible exceptions of giraffe and eland . . . and with good shot placement, it will do for those as well. I've used mine on game from deer on up through leopard, zebra, gemsbok, and kudu with excellent results; for larger game, I skip over the .338 - which is a good cartridge, by the way - and go right to a .375 H&H. (If I knew I was going to face a big bear at short range, I'd use the .375 with a handloaded 300 grain Swift A-Frame bullet.)

Your 7mm mag will work fine "out west" or for that caribou hunt you're talking about . . . I'll go so far as to say with good loads in each rifle and identical shot placement, no big game animal will be able to tell if it's hit with a 7mm Mag or a .30/06.

So if you decide on a .338, just understand it's because you want one, not because you need one.

And there's nothing wrong with that. ;)
 
Hmmm

I knew I would get my fair share of people recommending the 30-06 or to keep the 7mm. If I could get my 7mm to shoot anything over 150 gr I would more seriously consider it.

I bought my dad a pre-64 featherweight M70 earlier this year in 30-06 that he will be using for white tail and the other hunts I have mentioned. For the sake of variety I want to get something different for myself. It will be odd seeing him carry something other than his trusty old Savage in .270 that has been his go to gun since I was old enough to start hunting over 20 years ago. I bet that gun hasn't had 100 rounds through it ever. A couple to check it's sighted in every year, then one shot a season, one deer a season, every year, period...
 
I had heard that I would want to be 170 gr or heavier when dealing with elk or larger sized critters if possible, regardless of caliber. Is that not the case?
 
Consider that those sayings about bullet weights etc were made before the recent improvements in bullet strength. Shot my last black bear and mule deer with 80 gr. bullets, one shot each and though I'll never find an elk this year, wouldn't be shy with the 85 gr. bullets I "stepped up" to. Your 7mm is plenty powerful.

And by that rule you stated, you'd use 170 gr. out of a .30-30 for elk? I would...but you might not...anyway, just use a good bullet
 
I spent a good part of this afternoon in the Sidney, NE Gun Library pondering another rifle purchase (as I admitted to my wife this morning as I was leaving, "It's not about need...that was covered with my first hunting rifle...it's about want. I expect to be home for dinner."

I looked and thought about:

1. a Limited Edition Win M70 in .264 Win Mag (nostalgia for 1962)
2. a limited edition Win M70 in .375 H&H (I might get charged by a deranged prairie poodle)
3. a 50th anniversary Win M70 in .458 WM (you can load them down to about a .45-70 if you're a hand loader, which I am)
4. a Ruger No. 1 50th anniversary in .300 H&H (great cartridge for a hand loader)
5. a Ruger No. 1 in .38-55 (nostalgia for sometime past)
6. a Ruger No. 1 in .375 H&H (if I hit said prairie poodle, it ain't gonna need a second tap)
7. a CZ550 American, either in 9.3x62 or .375 H&H (just because...)

I just missed a Rem 700 Sendero in .264 WM with a NightForce 5.5-22x50 NXS bought by a Texan about 3" taller than me. Good guy...I wished him good hunting.

In the end, i heard the siren voices of 8 rifles calling my name. Like Odysseus, I was tied to the mast of my ship, er, car...so I left after picking up a few things and vowed to return soon.

As to North American game, I saw 2 Savage 116 Bear Hunters in .338 WM on the used shelf...I imagine that a couple of folks in search of a "big game" rifle overestimated their recoil tolerance. I personally don't care for the .338 WM or LM but am ok with the .375 H&H...a good round out to about 275 yards for me with about 28 lbs of free recoil using a 270 gr bullet.

YMMV,

good hunting,

FH, rifle junkie
 
I must have been the guy with th 9.3x62. I own the CZ 550FS and it is as deadly as it is beautiful. The caliber came out in Germany in 1905 for African and large European game. I hand load so the high cost of ammo is not a real problem. What a sleeper........ it may be slow but when it hits! Shoot one and fall in love...........
Popular the world over for a reason, it drops them if you do your part.
 
I suspect that you'd do OK at "normal" ranges with a .308 or .30-06...with the proper bullet selection (& I don't mean just the weight).

The choices of bullets are so great now that, as either of the above calibers has plenty of energy to put the game down, you may see a bigger difference in a particular bullet/loading.
 
If I were to buy a medium-large bore rifle for ANY big game it would be a 77 Hawkeye in 375 Ruger. Mauser style action for the utmost reliability on dangerous game, legal to hunt any game in Africa, and a pretty darn good trajectory for hunting in open country. If hunting the big five in Africa were legal with the 338 Lapua it would get my vote because of it's astounding external ballistics but you run into that darn 9.5mm minimum rule. 416s and 458s are great "stoppers" but lack medium-long range performance, they are like a shotgun slug on steroids.
If we are talking large North American game only I would have to go with the 338 win mag in the Browning BAR, medium bore, semi auto whoop@$$ :)
 
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