Bias in schools? Nah, couldn't happen.

[Monkeyleg]

Group wants war forum in schools

MPS students would hear pros and cons on Iraq

By DAN BENSON
[email protected]

Last Updated: March 2, 2003

A group called Teachers Against the War and some Milwaukee Public Schools students are asking the School Board to set aside at least one hour of class time to deliver a "diversity of opinion" to MPS students on the nation's conflict with Iraq.

The resolution, which was introduced last week by Milwaukee School Board member Jennifer Morales, would require all MPS middle schools and high schools to commit one hour to the discussions. It also would require at least one after-school event for the same purpose and the distribution of "age-appropriate" materials to students on the pros and cons of war with Iraq.

Following the resolution would be optional for elementary schools.

The resolution was referred to the board's Innovation and School Reform Committee, which next meets March 11.

But one member of that committee and two key legislators say they are troubled by such a resolution.

"I vigorously oppose the war. And I oppose with equal vigor this proposal," School Board member John Gardner said.

He said the School Board shouldn't mandate to local schools "what to do and how to do it. I just think we have to be attentive to the fact that schools are already over-mandated and over-scheduled."

Districtwide mandates "are always done for good reasons, and in this case it's one I would agree with, but it's the wrong forum, and it's the wrong way to do it," he said.

The resolution has not so far been put on the committee's agenda, Morales said.

Teachers Against the War will meet at 4 p.m. today at the Peace Action Center, 1001 E. Keefe Ave., to plot strategy to support the resolution, said Bob Peterson, a fifth-grade teacher at Fratney Street School and an organizer of Teachers Against the War.

It will be the second meeting for the group, which first met on Feb. 17, Peterson said. About 25 teachers attended that meeting.

He said he had no idea how many would attend today's meeting.

Forum sought

"Teachers told us (at the first meeting) the general atmosphere in schools is that we shouldn't talk about this," he said. "They felt very isolated and perplexed that educators would have that attitude."

As a result, "teachers decided to work with high school students who also are concerned and approach the Milwaukee School Board," he said.

Morales said the resolution is patterned after a similar proposal made in Oakland, Calif., that she read about in Rethinking Schools, an education reform newspaper with a circulation of 17,000 that Peterson helps edit.

Peterson said his group also is encouraging the Milwaukee Education Association, the teachers union, to take a stand against a war with Iraq.

Morales said she wrote the resolution in response to high school students' "desire for honest and open dialogue about the conflict."

One student who approached Morales was Lauren Adams, a sophomore at Rufus King High School.

"I think this impending war is the most important issue confronting students, and it hurts to see them all so apathetic. If they knew more, they'd care more," said Adams, a member of High Schools for Peace, a group of 30 to 40 high school students from MPS and other school districts.

She said the idea for the resolution came from organizers at the Peace Action Center, who told students the School Board wouldn't entertain such a proposal unless "students got behind it."

Adams said she believes the anti-war activists' point of view will win over students if all points of view are presented.

Concerns expressed

State Rep. Luther Olsen (R-Berlin), chairman of the Assembly Committee on Education, expressed concerns about the objectivity of the information that would distributed to students.

"It all depends on who decides who the pros and cons are," he said. "If you have people who are against something deciding what the pro people will say, that makes me real nervous."

Rep. Leah Vukmir (R-Wauwatosa) said she would be "very leery any time a group called Teachers Against the War wants to explain the Iraqi conflict to our children."

She is vice chairman of the Assembly's Education Reform Committee and past president of Parents Raising Educational Standards in Schools.

Morales and Peterson said their goal was not to indoctrinate children.

"I have a personal opinion on the war, but I don't intend that to define what I would like to see happen" in the classroom, Morales said.


A version of this story appeared in the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel on March 3, 2003.

 

[Zander]

What a shame that "teachers" are more interested in furthering their political agenda than doing what they are hired to do:

Help their students develop the skills to read, write, perform basic arithmetic calculations and think logically.

Instead, their basic "curriculum" is to indoctrinate those in their charge for the majority of their waking hours every week that "school" is in session.

It's no wonder that so many high-school "graduates" are functionally illiterate.

 

[jmbg29]

The local Komrades wanted to have a pro/anti-war session for our high school kiddies, I was supposed to be one of the participants in the charade. The "forum" was subsequently postponed.

Reason? The "antis" are currently in Iraq as human shields.

 

[Blackhawk]

The "antis" are currently in Iraq as human shields.

Hmmmm.... I smell an opportunity.

Any chance we can get them ALL to go there...?

 

[Beorn]

What a shame that "teachers" are more interested in furthering their political agenda than doing what they are hired to do: Help their students develop the skills to read, write, perform basic arithmetic calculations and think logically.

Hold on a minute there... These "teachers" that you refer to aren't usually the ones with political agendas. That would be the administrators (Principals, Superintendents, School Board Members, etc.) of the school systems. Teachers have very little power in the curriculum my friend.

We "teachers" (like myself) do try to get students to read, write, utilize proper syntax and grammar, perform arithmetical computation, solve problems in logical progression and/or with the scientific method, remember and comprehend our history, and relate to others in acceptable interpersonal social settings.

But we can only do so much.

I am a high school teacher. And if I may say so, there is a little theory I have about education. There are 5 sides to the educational "house." Each side is a member of the student's scholastic experience (what we in edu-speak refer to as "stakeholders"). These sides are: 1) Teachers, 2) Administrators and Counsellors, 3) the Community, 4) Parents, and 5) the Students themselves. Each one of these groups is held in some way accountable for a student's failure but one.
Teachers may be fired, Administrators and Counsellors reassigned, the Community suffers from increased Crime Rate and decreased Property values, and the Students themselves suffer failure by not reaching their potential. But parents have little or no accountability when their students do not achieve.
You have to have a liscense to go carry a concealed weapon, drive a car, even to fish. But any sperm donor/sperm recepticle can be a parent.

To put it bluntly, the 55 minutes I spend with a teen a day can in no way compete with the several hours a parent is supposed to spend with their child.:banghead:

So, what do we do? Sterilize people? Do the China thing and allow 1 child per family? Or do we start holding parents accountable for their child's actions (or lack thereof)? Sounds like a no-brainer to me...

Frankly, I do not have the answers, but I'll tell you one thing. I have teaching friends who have been activated, and the students weren't happy about it. And not because they didn't want a substitute. It was because they feared for my colleagues' health and well-being. I do not want them to get hurt, but I understand that they are fighting for the safety and security of our sovereign nation (and, let's be honest, some oil and a lot of sandy real estate).

Could we have done better? You betcha! We should have finished the job with Bush Sr. Then this wouldn't have to happen.

Just don't lump all teachers in with these people. I do not serve in any branch of the service because I destroyed my knee playing football as a teenager and could never pass the physical or I would be in the reserves as well. I am respectful of the people serving for us, and I would never say that I disagree with our Commander-in-Chief (even if he is somewhat dense) because those kids with parents in the military need support and comfort, not a rewind to the "your dad's a baby-killer" crap that was going on 30 years ago.

Those educators are not doing their job. That much is true. But many more of us are. And we shall continue to do so.

Marcus Barber,
Department Chair- Visual and Performing Arts
S.J. High School
California

God Bless our men and women in the Armed Services. May they be kept safe from harm and may they swiftly carry out their duties and return home soon. Amen.

 

[Khornet]

Marcus,

I appreciate your points, and your point of view. But the fact is that there is rampant indoctrination imbedded in every aspect of public education. Case in point:

My 6th grader comes home and tells me about a really cool exercise they did in class. The "teacher" divided the class into one large and one small group. She assigned the groups the same task, but the small group was at the front of the room, each with his own paper, ruler, dictionary, etc. The large group in the back had to share one dictionary, ruler, etc. "Teacher" circulated, giving encouragement to the small group and criticism to the large. Afterward she explained this is what it's like in a society with discrimination and social injustice.

The class? GEOGRAPHY. I have plenty more stories; I have 5 kids. The impression that teachers are leftists didn't come from thin air. If you're not one, bravo. I'm grateful. If you are one, but you teach geography in geography class, and math in math class, bravo again. But if you teach socialism in all your classes, you are ripping me off. There is no way that Teachers Against The War are keeping their ideology out of the classroom. Not that one must pretend to have no beliefs when teaching:just that the teacher shouldn't be using the subject matter as a tool to transmit his beliefs. Just my 0.02.

 

[priv8ter]

Great Points!

Marcus, that was an excellent post, and you made some outstanding points! That whole 'education house' theory puts me in mind of the 'fire triangle' that I had to learn in the Navy.

But, as Khornet pointed, out not all teachers are like yourself. It's kind of like police officers I guess. I'm sure the majority of them are great...but all it takes are a few bad apples to ruin the batch, and get loads of negative press out there.

To take your theory one step further, I bet you could even apply it to the public vs. private school debate. Let's face it...a parent that cares enough to pay the cash to send a child to a private school is probably going to be more involved in their childs progress than some(not all...we had good parents, didn't we?) of the public school parents.

 

[Monkeyleg]

Beorn, I didn't intend to paint all teachers with the same broad brush when I posted the article. It just upset me that a few leftist activists can game the system.

And, BTW, whatever your opinion of GW, please do not repeat the mantra that he is "dense." Politically he's very shrewd, perhaps as much so as WJC. You don't get a Masters in Business from Harvard and a bachelors degree in history from Yale by being "dense," (or, for that matter, get to fly fighter jets).

 

[Beorn]

And, BTW, whatever your opinion of GW, please do not repeat the mantra that he is "dense." Politically he's very shrewd, perhaps as much so as WJC. You don't get a Masters in Business from Harvard and a bachelors degree in history from Yale by being "dense," (or, for that matter, get to fly fighter jets).

Point taken, though it must be noted that he generated more "C"s in his academic career than a Hispanic couple achieving simultaneous orgasm.

Far be it from me to criticize anyone who did such a fine Ivy League turn about, but Senior had a lot to do with where Junior is (and I know that any loving Father would try to help his child, that's not the point). And just because he went to an Ivy League school, that doesn't make his educational choices tip top. He is my president, and I support him, but he should really delegate authority to those who actually work "in the trenches" in education. Cheney is the more shrewd of the two, IMO.

The older I get, the more conservative I get, but I still don't like people telling other people what to do. Keep religion out of school [as a preacher's son, I am not against religion, but I teach ethics, not morals (see above)], or at least attempt to be objective (as I must do in my Music Appreciation Classes). Stop the school vouchers, and instead put that money towards important things in our current schools (do any of you know how much Federally sponsored companies charge for textbooks?!?). Don't tell a woman what to do with her body. If it's a sin, guess what, she'll pay for it at the big register in the sky. Keep my guns in my hands, but out of the hands of violent criminals. And to combine a few points from above, stop spending 4 times as much on an inmate as one does on a student in public schools.

Am I a Liberal Republican? A Conservative Democrat? Am I not politically correct? Am I not paraphrasing Shylock's speech? Or am I just someone who believes that this country is at its best when we take care of our own and mind our business.

Now if only everyone else would do the same...

 

[priv8ter]

Wow

Well Beorn...I can't believe you have opinions like that and they actually let you live in Southern California!!!!!!!! Keep on fighting the good fight!

 

[Monkeyleg]

Beorn: "Keep religion out of school [as a preacher's son, I am not against religion, but I teach ethics, not morals (see above)], or at least attempt to be objective (as I must do in my Music Appreciation Classes). Stop the school vouchers, and instead put that money towards important things in our current schools (do any of you know how much Federally sponsored companies charge for textbooks?!?)."

I don't even have kids! Why should I have to pay to send somebody else's kids to school with my tax dollars?

And, for that matter, my in-laws sent all their kids to a Catholic school and at the same time paid taxes to send others' kids to public schools. They paid twice. And my in-laws were then and are now at the lowest rung of the economic scale, so class warfare is not an issue here.

If federally-sponsored textbooks cost so much, farm the work out to the private sector. I'll bet you could buy the books for 50% of what you're paying now.

There's probably only two or three states that aren't theatened by massive budget deficits. With all respect, isn't there another job function for you other than Music Appreciation?

Here in WI, every budget director from every level of government is screaming about budget cuts. The local/county/state employees unions are threatening strikes because they're not getting their promised 3% raise.

My pay (I'm self-employed), since 9/11/01, has been cut by 60%. That's not a typo, that's a fact: 60%. And the blasted government employees are kvetching about not getting a raise.

Last year our county announced that the retirement fund for employees would fall short by $20 million, and we taxpayers would have to pick up the tab. You see, the county's "retirement planner" was expecting a 9% annual return. So was Jimmy the Greek!

I called my county supervisor, and he promised to call me back in three months to show that the $20 million retirement "problem" would disappear when all the senior employees took early retirement.

It's been over a year, and he hasn't called me. Tail-between-the-legs, I guess.

Meanwhile, my taxes have gone through the roof (assuming I'll still have a roof when I'm done paying taxes). And, as I look down my block, all the county and city retirees seem to be doing just fine. I'm so happy to be paying for their landscaping! I'm 52, and many of them are younger than me. I'll be paying for their retirement until I die.

This isn't personal, Beorn. I've read many of your posts and you certainly seem like a fine person and a conscientious gunowner. But the anti-war teachers should be working on doing the job I'm paying them for: teaching. And the kids who get out of school early should get their pimply faces back to class and learn how to pay taxes (or, better yet, eliminate them).

But, it's going on 11 pm here. Do you think I should call that county supervisor at home and ask where the "big savings" in the retirement plan went?

 

[CZ-75]

But, it's going on 11 pm here. Do you think I should call that county supervisor at home and ask where the "big savings" in the retirement plan went?

Why, Yes.

 

[Viking6]

I agree with an earlier post that basically said that teachers should teach their subject and also teach their students to think. If the students are thinking and oppose the war, I'm fine with that. If they are just parroting some indoctrination from a charismatic teacher, then I'm not so fine with it. Finally, if teachers and students want to have a debate about or even a demonstration against a war, I'm fine with that as long as it happens as an extra-curricular activity, not on our collective dime.

 

[Beorn]

Monkeyleg, you also provide some awesome insights to the current idiocy facing all of our states. But, teachers are not Federal or State employees. We don't get the same pay raises (as a matter of fact, pay increases in Education are laughingly referred to as COLAS [cost of living adjustments], and if they occur are about one quarter of the actual cost of living increase according to Alan Greenspan and his home-boys), insurance (our HMOs are truly abysmal), holidays (though that summer off thing would be better if we all didn't have to go back to school ourselves to keep our credentials), retirement plans, or state assistance.

There's probably only two or three states that aren't theatened by massive budget deficits. With all respect, isn't there another job function for you other than Music Appreciation?

In point of fact there is (are rather). I am also a Department Chair, State Fine Arts Project coordinator, and a Western Association of Schools and Colleges Director for my school. I make certain that my school remains in compliance with all (read ALL) of the recommendations made by the state (which really aren't recommendations at all now are they?). But I am a Fine Arts teacher, and with all due respect to those not in the know, Arts are far more valuable than people realize.

You see, you don't need music to hunt, fish, breathe, eat, or sleep. With very few exceptions, it will not clothe you, provide food or shelter for your family. As a matter of fact, music isn't necessary to sustain a human being's existence at all...

But, without art or beauty in one's life, you often don't WANT to live. You do not live, you merely continue to suck viable oxygen from the planet. You cease to be human and degenerate into something less than human.

Admittedly, there have been things that others have referred to as "art" in my presence that I call "crap," but one man's Taj Mahal is another man's low cost housing...

As I read these posts to my wife she said to me, "Marcus, there are too socialist teachers! Those touchy-feely I-want-to-change-the-world-types. They don't become teachers to teach, the want to 'shape' a child's mind."

My wife is smarter than me... And, monkeyleg, you are too.

Class dismissed, I learned my lesson.

 

[Don Gwinn]

We don't really need art. We got tee vee.

 

[Monkeyleg]

Beorn, in reading your last post I realized I was being at least a bit provincial when discussing teacher pay.

If you were a teacher here in WI, you'd think you had died and gone to heaven. WEAC, the state teachers union, has formed its own health care insurance company. There's no employer--private, state or federal--that has the health care benefits that WI teachers do.

And the retirement benefits are much better than what many, if not most, employers provide.

WEAC is the largest and most powerful lobby in the state, and the teachers do extremely well. (My neighbor's a teacher, my age, and he just retired. He and his wife will split their time between the house here and their vacation home up north).

There's a topic on one of the forums here about the gun climate in Wisconsin. Maybe you should consider moving here. You'd be better off financially, and 1,000% freer with regard to guns.

 

[Zander]

Stop the school vouchers, and instead put that money towards important things in our current schools (do any of you know how much Federally sponsored companies charge for textbooks?!?). -- Beorn

This presumes that "putting" more money towards "important things" in schools will somehow result in a better education for our kids. It if would, the schools in DC wouldn't be graduating a majority of their students as functional illiterates.

What will work is forcing schools like yours to compete for students. The socialists who dominate depts. of ed. and school adminstrations want desperately to avoid accountability. To them, vouchers are a threat of nightmare proportion.

That's good enough for me...

Class dismissed, I learned my lesson.

Seems to me that you've already learned one of life's biggest lessons...you listen to your wife.

 

[Soap]

"We live in a Republic, not a Sheepleocracy." -KS Freeman

Maybe they should teach kids in school that they should work on developing intelligence, wisdom, and sound ethics. Then, we can talk about foreign policy. This forum will probably remind us of that anti-gun drawing by that 6-year old kid.