Dillon press advice

[BigJakeJ1s]

Either you never used one, only read about them on the Internet, or used one as your first press, boogered it up and when you got a second press marveled at how easy it was... not realizing that all the knowledge and expierience was gained at the expense of the first press.

I have NO idea why people bash the Lee presses. Either they are trying to justify the fact that they had to spend 4x the money before they figure out how a press worked, or that they bought $800 worth of gear, only to find out that the same gear is available at 1/4th price.

The plain fact is that a cartridge made from a Dillon is no better than a cartridge made from a Lee.

If you have any of that 'crappy' Lee gear that sucks so much, send it my way. I'll take it off your hands for the cost of mailing it to me. No need to throw it away, toss it in the swamp or do what people in thier Lee bashing posts 'say' they do to all that Lee junk that they have.

It all comes down to how smart the monkey pulling the lever is.

You're right, I have never used a lee progressive press. However, I have used, and still use, a lee hand press, perfect pm, safety scale, case trimmers, autoprime, and some of their dies. Some of it I love (for the way it works and the price: trimmers and collet-type FCDs). Some of it works only if I fiddle with it. On the other hand, I have other equipment from Hornady, RCBS and others (nothing dillon yet) that works flawlessly, repeatedly, and without mucking with it. I still use the lee hand press, for depriming with a universal depriming die, because that operation does not require a lot of precision, and it catches all the primer debris very efficiently. I now use a Huntington hand press which is much more accurately aligned, and has practically zero flex. It rivals some of the best bench presses I have tried. Based on the way the autoprime works and the quality of their hand press, I would surmise that their progressive equipment works similarly (if you fiddle with it periodically, it works ok). This seems to match a lot of what is written on the web about it. I don't mind a little fiddling when I am building ammo one cartidge at a time, one step at a time. But when you go progressive, there's a lot more going on, and having equipment problems becomes much less acceptable.

I never said that ammo produced on lee equipment was of any less quality than that produced on dillon/hornady, or anything else. What I tried to say was that you can produce the same quality ammo on a dillon/hornady with a lot less fuss, granted at 2-4x the price.

Andy

 

[MarshallDodge]

YellowLab must work for Lee, any chance he gets, he waives the Lee flag. An issue that I have no problem with except the level of craftsmanship that goes in to the Lee does not compare to the Dillon.

From this post I stated how I feel about Lee:
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?p=2131449#post2131449

You can wave the Lee flag all you want but I would back it with "You get what you pay for". I started out with a Lee Anniversary kit that came with the Challenger press. It is a good starter press and I have made some accurate ammo with it, but it is nowhere near the press the RCBS Rockcrusher I bought used a few years later. I have broke the Challenger twice and both times it was a $2.00 part + $5.00 shipping. If it was a Dillon or RCBS it would have cost me $0.

I am just trying to help prevent this.

Second post in response to YellowLab accusing me of not knowing what I was doing:
HMMM, I must not be doing things right

You guys make it sound like I am bashing Lee products. I am not, and I agree that RCBS and Dillon are expensive but they perform.

Funny, I have never broke anything on the RCBS or Dillon to have to use the warranty. I will repeat myself - you get what you pay for. In other words, if you pay half the price, you usually get half the product.

You are correct, maybe I shouldn't compare the Challenger to the Rockcrusher for strength but it drove home my price/performance point.
Lee just came out with the Classic Cast press. There must be some market out there for a better performing product than what the Challenger offers.
I guess I would consider RCBS and Dillon to be "professional grade".

I did not bring Hornady presses into the discussion because I have not used one. I have used their new dimension dies with very good success. Maybe it's because I lubed them

I have had experience with the Lee Loadmaster. It was one of the earlier models that a friend of mine purchased. He and I spent a whole evening setting the thing up and getting the bugs out of it. He sold it and bought a Dillon 650 after I bought the 550. He now owns two 650's and I own two 550's. Nuff said.

 

[YellowLab]

The Lee Perfect Powder Measure has no place on a progressive press... the actuating mechanism will leak powder all day long.

The Pro Auto Disk is an absolute PERFECT measure. Add in the double disk and the adjustsable charge you can lad just about any cartridge availalbe (unless you get into really, really small or really, really large cases... but no press will do them all).

Most people don't really have a firm grasp on what a volume measure actaully does, and wonder why it will vary from throw to throw.... ALL volume measures will vary... depening on what kind of pwder you use (ball, long/short extruded, flake). To say measure X never varies is total BS, you will NEVER get the exact same weight from throw to throw with a volumetric measure.

If you have primer feeding issues on a loadmaster then you are not doing it right. I had TONS of problems... till I realized that I had assembled part of the press wrong.... one I fixed that I have gone through 2000+ primers with not a problem. The key is a CLEAN press. You actually do have to lube a point or to.

Every 200 or so primers I run a Q tip down the primer chute, I also clean out the primer 'hole' where the lever is. You can tell when the chute is dirty cause there is a yellowish residue. Takes 30 seconds tops. I also have a brush handy to clean any stray powder grains off the press and the shell holder. If I have not reloaded in a few weeks I will take some parts off, clean them in alchohol and oil up what needs oiled.

I will admit that initially I had some very aggravating problems.... but it was all my fault. I had never used a progressive press and there is A LOT going on when you pull that handle. A few calls to Lee, a few questions on some boards and I am a HAPPY CAMPER.

If you do have any 'Lee trash' send it my way.... really. Don't throw it out (I don't read much about people tossing out $200+ Lee setups anymore... maybe is was the thing to do last year). I'll pay for shipping to get that Lee crap out of your life.

 

[Kevatc]

The Lee Perfect Powder Measure has no place on a progressive press... the actuating mechanism will leak powder all day long.

The Pro Auto Disk is an absolute PERFECT measure. Add in the double disk and the adjustsable charge you can lad just about any cartridge availalbe (unless you get into really, really small or really, really large cases... but no press will do them all).

Most people don't really have a firm grasp on what a volume measure actaully does, and wonder why it will vary from throw to throw.... ALL volume measures will vary... depening on what kind of pwder you use (ball, long/short extruded, flake). To say measure X never varies is total BS, you will NEVER get the exact same weight from throw to throw with a volumetric measure.

If you have primer feeding issues on a loadmaster then you are not doing it right. I had TONS of problems... till I realized that I had assembled part of the press wrong.... one I fixed that I have gone through 2000+ primers with not a problem. The key is a CLEAN press. You actually do have to lube a point or to.

Every 200 or so primers I run a Q tip down the primer chute, I also clean out the primer 'hole' where the lever is. You can tell when the chute is dirty cause there is a yellowish residue. Takes 30 seconds tops. I also have a brush handy to clean any stray powder grains off the press and the shell holder. If I have not reloaded in a few weeks I will take some parts off, clean them in alchohol and oil up what needs oiled.

I will admit that initially I had some very aggravating problems.... but it was all my fault. I had never used a progressive press and there is A LOT going on when you pull that handle. A few calls to Lee, a few questions on some boards and I am a HAPPY CAMPER.

If you do have any 'Lee trash' send it my way.... really. Don't throw it out (I don't read much about people tossing out $200+ Lee setups anymore... maybe is was the thing to do last year). I'll pay for shipping to get that Lee crap out of your life.

I started this wole conversation asking about Dillon presses precisely because I was so doggone fed up with my Lee Pro 1000 being so inconsistent in it's primer feeding. I keep it clean ... especially the primer feeding areas. Lee has asked me to send it back and they will look it over and replace any parts that might need it. If I get it back and it still doesn't work then I am going to save up my money and get a Dillon. You can fish it out of my city landfill if you like if it comes down to that.

 

[YellowLab]

You can fish it out of my city landfill if you like if it comes down to that.

If you are gonna throw it away, I'll pay shipping to take it off your hands.

I doubt that it will go in the trash, or that you will mail it to me.. but the offer is there. E-mail me at [email protected] for my address. I'll reimburse you shipping costs.

Even when Lee offers to fix your press for FREE (as would Dillon, RCBS, etc etc) you still take the stance that 'it sucks, it not my fault, I'm throwing it away. Of course you will.

I really don't care to change your mind.. as its made up.. and I have better things to do... I have 550 .45acp shells to process and put through my Loadmaster this afternoon. Should take about 2 hours.. I'll let you know how many primer problems I have (a good guess will be ZERO).

 

[JMusic]

Kevatc you should try to find the thread I started about a week prior to Xmas. 3 times the replies with alot of knowledge on all presses. Don't mistake the Lee 1000 for the LoadMaster. I had sent in my order for a Hornady LNL and it was backordered, so I figured what the hell I'll try this Loadmaster people are talking about. Look at the prices for change overs from one caliber to another and easy of change. Buy what you want. After all the comments I read along with reading all the OEM web sites I decided for the first time "progressive" I would try the Loadmaster. Now I have been involved with reloading for 25 years with a Rockchucker but wanted more automation. 550B did not meet the bill for me. It came down to the 650 with assecories or the Honady LNL. I would still probably go with the Hornady but I thought for the money I will try the Lee and at least get in the game. Even if you dedicate this press you have lost nothing. Good luck with whatever you purchase.
Jim

 

[Kevatc]

thanks JMusic

I did a little search and read all the posts from your thread that you had started. Now I am as confused as I have ever been on this subject.

This is what I have taken from what I have read from numerous places: there are loads of people who love Dillon's. There are numerous people who suggest that the problem with Lee presses are the people using them. That is to say that if there is an issue with press reliability it is usually (if not all the time) the user. I won't lie .... my issues could very well be my fault.

As I have read all the stuff I've come across I am wondering if my issue with my Lee Pro 1000 is how I have it mounted. To raise my press up to a more ergonomical position for me I bolted two 1 inch pieces of particle board shelving to my work bench and mounted the press on them. I am wondering if there is just enough flex in these boards that it is throwing off the "timing" of my press?

I am speculating of course and I have learned along time ago that more often then not when it comes to me or the machine .... it's usually me that is the issue . Just the same my Lee Pro 1000 press that I have now just doesn't feed primers consistently. I have read and re-read instructions, and checked and re-checked things on the press and for the life of me I can't figure out what is going on. Thus my frustration. The thing is I have a Lee turret press that I like to use for my 5.56 reloading and although a bit slow it really works well. The common denominator is the primer issue. I prime my 5.56 as a seperate step whereas with my .40 it is part of the progressive reloading process. There just has to be a better way to prime than the way Lee has it set up now. I guess I could go back to my old days and just do all my ammo on the turret press .... reliable but slow.

Anyways, thanks to everyone who has offered up their thoughts on this subject. By the way, I read a number of posts where members have said "this has been discussed ad nauseum". Well, get used to it. There will always be new members (like me) who look to forums like this to learn new information. Be good resources like you have been because there is lots to learn .

 

[Kevatc]

I realized as I re-read my post that the mounting of my press would likely raise many a question if not an eyebrow. Let me explain a bit before I get hounded ....

My work bench is a very sturdy former kitchen cabinet/counter top. I bolted two one inch pieces of particle board shelving to the counter top. These boards needed to stick out over the edge of the counter top by about 3-4 inches. Then I made a triangular cut out of them so the ram could run up and down unimpeded.

That is one thing I like about the Dillon 550 .... the mounting can occur right to my counter top and would be even higher than my current set up which will save on my neck and upper back!

 

[HSMITH]

Kevatc, ditch the Pro1000. It really is junk, and you can mount it to a battleship without solving the problems.

The Loadmaster is a lot better, but it still needs some tweaks here and there to keep going. I've not used the Pro2000 but lots have and like them, Peter Eick has written some great posts with detail and substance about them on this site. A friend just picked up the L&L AP about 6 months ago, it looks like a really nice press and so far is flawless. I own Dillons and they are rock solid performers. One of my 550's has over 250,000 rounds across it, I have replaced a few parts (free) to keep it running perfectly but nothing that took more than 5 minutes to do. I literally load several thousand rounds at a time without cleaning anything, adjusting anything, or anything else other than re-filling components.

If Lee would put a good powder measure on the Loadmaster and iron out the primer feed I would have 5 or 6 of them on my bench, the press has great potential and fantastic production rates when it is running well. The price for one last time I looked was under $180 for a re-furb direct from Lee. It is 'almost there', if they ever finish it they will put a real hurt on the other progressive press makers.