Is milsurp cheaper than reloading?

[heypete]

I just ordered 960 rounds of 30.06 from CMP for $192 ($38 shiping)

Just for the powder and primers to hand load 960 30.06 it would cost $184.

I was about to question your pricing on reloads, but I did the math myself and was somewhat surprised at the cost. Your math is pretty much dead on.

My local dealer stocks IMR 4064 for $23/lb. Primers are about $18/1000 for CCI 200 Large Rifle Primers (and I have about 800 left).

My pet load for .30-06 is 49.5 grains of powder pushing a 150gr bullet. Loading 1,000 rounds requires 49,500 grains of powder, or 7.07 pounds. Powder costs alone, assuming I buy in one-pound increments and excluding taxes, are $162.61. Primers would bring the cost to about $180, excluding taxes.

Yikes. That's more than I thought, but far cheaper than commercial loadings. (About $3.60 per box of 20, not including bullets or taxes.)

I should buy some of that milsurp while it's available and cheap. My Garand and Remington 700 love it, and I hoard brass, so it works out.

 

[Davo]

I wish i could find powder 8lbs shipped. I know midway has TAC on sale 10/lb, dont know its load data for .308 though.

 

[Dr. Dickie]

Go to powdervalley:
http://www.powdervalleyinc.com/

 

[USSR]

My local dealer stocks IMR 4064 for $23/lb. Primers are about $18/1000 for CCI 200 Large Rifle Primers (and I have about 800 left).

That's a REAL good price on the primers, but the price for the powder is way out of line. I've seen RL15 (similar burn rate) going for about $18 at a recent gun show. I'm using surplus IMR4895 that I paid about $10 per pound for.

Don

 

[heypete]

That's a REAL good price on the primers, but the price for the powder is way out of line. I've seen RL15 (similar burn rate) going for about $18 at a recent gun show. I'm using surplus IMR4895 that I paid about $10 per pound for.

I may have to look around at different shops here (fortunately, Tucson has a large variety of gun shops) to examine what their powder costs.

When I was in California, IMR 4064 cost about $21/pound, and that was a few years ago. I'd imagine that inflation would take its toll. Either way, it doesn't really break the bank, and it'd probably cost me more in gasoline and time to drive to a more distant shop just for cheaper powder -- this guy's about a mile away, friendly, with good prices on guns and ammo.

Forgive my question, but who makes RL15 powder? If I can get cheap powder, I'm definitely going to be happy, but ordering stuff directly has a $20 UPS hazmat fee, which nullifies any savings for the quantity of powder I'd reasonably buy.

 

[Wayne02]

It depends.

I just ordered 960 rounds of 30.06 from CMP for $192 ($38 shiping)

Just for the powder and primers to hand load 960 30.06 it would cost $184.

I should order more of that cmp stuff. I've got case around here somewhere that I ordered from them when I ordered the M1 four years ago or so.

That's the stuff that has LC brass, yes?

 

[heypete]

I should order more of that cmp stuff. I've got case around here somewhere that I ordered from them when I ordered the M1 four years ago or so.

That's the stuff that has LC brass, yes?

The CMP has Lake City and Pyrkal (Greek, commonly considered better than LC because the ammo was not de-linked like the LC was). Both are excellent.

 

[Elza]

heypete: better than LC because the ammo was not de-linked like the LC was

The M2 (CMP) I got wasn’t de-linked. It was removed from enbloc clips!!!! You can easily tell by looking at the cases. And I spent hours putting 2,000 rounds back into enblocs!

 

[heypete]

The M2 (CMP) I got wasn’t de-linked. It was removed from enbloc clips!!!! You can easily tell by looking at the cases. And I spent hours putting 2,000 rounds back into enblocs!

I stand corrected then. I was told by others that it had been de-linked, which may well have happened with some lots of the ammo.

I wish there was a faster was of putting ammo back into en-bloc clips, some sort of mechanism or something into which one puts the clip and a hopper of of ammo and turns a crank, and voila! Sadly, I know of no such machine.

 

[Geno]

In some cases yes, and in other cases no. Take 7.62X54R at 1,200 rounds for $140.00 ($0.1166/per). I doubt you could reload it for that cost. On the other hand, 200 rounds of Winchester 7.62X51 at $159.00 ($.7905/per), I assure you, you can save significant money.

Doc2005

 

[USSR]

Forgive my question, but who makes RL15 powder?

Alliant. It's the same powder (only a noncannister grade) that's used in the LC M118 LR ammo that our snipers use. It's great powder, and not as long grained as 4064, so it meters better.

Don

 

[heypete]

Ah, thanks. Much appreciated.

 

[Elza]

I stand corrected then. I was told by others that it had been de-linked

heypete: I stand corrected then. I was told by others that it had been de-linked

Your statement is correct according to CMP. Their site claims that it was de-linked. I suspect that there are both and I got a batch that was clipped.

 

[Sam Adams]

USSR

Alliant. It's the same powder (only a noncannister grade) that's used in the LC M118 LR ammo that our snipers use. It's great powder, and not as long grained as 4064, so it meters better.

I'd sure like to know the exact parameters of that load - 'cuz if its good enough for our snipers, its got to be extremely accurate. Of course, I am aware that such a standard load would be only a starting place for finding an ideal load for any unique rifle.

What is the difference between cannister grade and a non-cannister grade? Is it simply a quality control issue?

 

[MilsurpShooter]

All depends on what type of ammo you're reloading vs. what's available in surplus. Major thing to think about, if you reload you're always safe as long as you have brass, proper diameter bullets, powder and primers... Milsurp ammo isn't going to be around forever in the caliber you need

 

[Sam Adams]

Milsurp vs. reloading - I'd have to come down where most others have, which is that there are certain calibers that are still in such plentiful supply that they'll be cheap for the next 20-30 years (or so it seems). 7.62 x 39 falls into that category for sure. The milsurp, cheap as it may be, is usually quite bad quality-wise, because you're dealing with extremely mass produced (i.e. lowest bidder) stuff that is quite old (and so you almost certainly have some powder deterioration). Still, if you have a rifle that shoots minute of barn door at 200 yards, who really cares - i.e. the cheapest stuff wins.

However, most bolties can do quite well with decent ammo, and this is a major reason for me to be a reloader. Get that right bullet & powder combo (the primer, IMHO, is not terribly important as long as it fires reliably - but I'm not in competitions or sniping for a living), and even a 100-year-old rifle that was used and abused by 2 or 3 generations of Russian peasants will fire 2-2.5 MOA, maybe better. Better results can, of course, be obtained for rifles that were inherently more accurate to begin with, are less used/abused, or both.

Cost-wise, though, I was really shocked when I walked into a Wallyworld this morning. The cheapest 9mm was the WWB 100 pack for $15. I know that I can make 9s for about $0.09 each (with bulk powder & bullets). .45s are out of sight - the 100 round WWB was $26!!! - and that's a round that I can make for about $0.12. The didn't have any .223 or .308 in WWB today, but the rounds with hunting bullets cost in the area of $0.40 and $0.60, respectively. I can duplicate these rounds for roughly 1/3-40% of the price, even using match bullets. This trip reinforced in my mind that thought that reloading is far superior to buying loaded ammo - provided that you've got the time and patience to reload. Fortunately, I do - and my new Lee Classic Turret Press is giving a very good return on its cost in terms of speed.