M1/M1A bolt

[osan]

Are the botls from M1 Garands identical or otherwise compatible with those of the M1A?


I ask because I am playing with an idea for an M1A bolt I am modeling. The M1A bolt is not the easiest to CAD up and the prints I have are fuzzy-at-best. Someone sent me a partially completed model but it suffered two problems, one being there were slight errors in the model and the other being that it had no history attached, making changes very cumbersome. Over on GrabCAD there is a very promising looking Garand that is complete, meaning I should be able to work with it, but am not quite sure if it is compatible with the 1A. I don't want to make a prototype, put it in my Loaded and blow my face up real good. Sadly, my best ffriend who has both Garands and a Supermatch passed away this past June 13, so my source of sure and fast information on this subject is no longer among us. I believe he was also a member here as well. I sure do miss him, but I digress.

Any help would be very much appreciated.

 

[Slamfire]

The M14 used a shorter cartridge and had a roller on one lug.

I am sure, when you get into the details, there are more differences between M14 bolts and Garand bolts.

It used to be that surplus Garand bolts were cheap. (and for that matter M14 bolts). You could reverse engineer an old bolt, but you would not know the dimensional tolerances.

From what I have found, both the M14 and Garand bolts were made from 8620. This material was the minimum that met requirements, in fact, Watertown Arsenal conducted research into finding a better steel that made for longer lasting bolts.

 

[osan]

The M14 used a shorter cartridge and had a roller on one lug.

I am sure, when you get into the details, there are more differences between M14 bolts and Garand bolts.

It used to be that surplus Garand bolts were cheap. (and for that matter M14 bolts). You could reverse engineer an old bolt, but you would not know the dimensional tolerances.

From what I have found, both the M14 and Garand bolts were made from 8620. This material was the minimum that met requirements, in fact, Watertown Arsenal conducted research into finding a better steel that made for longer lasting bolts.

Good grief... talk about a brain fart... I'd not even considered the difference in cartridges. DUH. Thanks very much for the gentle smack in the head in which I was in apparent and sore need.

Looks like I will be CADing from the ground up.

 

[Slamfire]

Good grief... talk about a brain fart... I'd not even considered the difference in cartridges. DUH. Thanks very much for the gentle smack in the head in which I was in apparent and sore need.

Looks like I will be CADing from the ground up.

I wish I could tell you where the drawing package was for the M14. I have no idea if the Army still has a copy, and why should it? Springfield Armory was shut down around 1968, the M14 was superseded by the M16 by the middle 1960's.

 

[Charlie98]

The M14 used a shorter cartridge and had a roller on one lug.

Hey, Slam... what's with the Black Sheep TRW M14 bolt? Has that been parkerized or something?

 

[Slamfire]

Hey, Slam... what's with the Black Sheep TRW M14 bolt? Has that been parkerized or something?

These are all M14 takeoff bolts that the CMP was able to acquire from Anniston Army Depot. This was in the period when the Clinton Administration shoveled every M14 it could find into Captain Krunch at the Depot. Someone was saving operating rods, trigger housings, bolts, (maybe a few more pieces) before tossing the rest of the rifle into the shredder. These bolts have the original finish on them that was on the like new rifles that were destroyed. I don't know if a particular parkerization color was required in the TRW contract, there is a Army Green color that is required on Army equipment, just look at an Ammo Box.

The Democrats destroyed over 1 million M14's. When we got into Iraq, and the M4 was not enough gun, the Army pulled back from Police Department all the loaner M14's they were holding on to. In time, these probably went into another shredder.

You would not believe the waste and callousness of Ordnance Bureau employees. A shooting bud of mine worked at Anniston. During the Iraq War he was removing plastic grips (housings?) from new old stock M60 machine guns. After the grips had been removed the new old stock M60 was then shredded. These M60's were pulled out of warehouses and had never been fired. The reason was, the National Guard troops were using M60 machine guns, and the M60's they were using were worn out, grips being a particular need. Bud asked, "if their M60's are worn out, why aren't we shipping these new M60's to Iraq"? What he was told, transferring a weapon would require filling out forms and moving inventory from one property book to another. It was just easier to pull the grips off, destroy the M60's, then send new M60's to the troops in the field. And the guys in the field did not know what was stored in the igloos on bases, and no one was going to tell them.

I should have purchased more bolts, these were $35.00 at the time. Never thought they would ever be worth $200.00 The four I used to build up match rifles around SA receivers are not in the picture.

 

[Mk-211]

You might have to buy a book with a diagram of the bolt. Every pic I've seen online is a potato pic!

For example...

 

[Dave DeLaurant]

BTW, when Jim Sullivan was designing the Mini-14 for Ruger, he tried the M14's bolt roller and eventually went with a solid round projection on the Mini-14's bolt that was simpler and worked equally well at this smaller scale.