Primer seating

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bmitchell

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I'm new to reloading and am currently set up for reloading small quantities of 9mm Parabellum.
For some reason my Lee Auto Prime tool does not seem to be seating the primers (CCI small pistol) deep enough.
At the very best they are flush with the case. It seems most of my brass does not seat in the shell holder without some vertical play.
Most of my brass is Winchester but it varies greatly.
I've also got a little primer pocket cleaner that I twist a few times per case but the smaller 'blade' is not flat like the larger 'blade'. It looks like it's got three raised bumps instead of being flat across.
All my tools are used (mostly Dad's spare stuff).

Now for some guesses as to what my problems might be:
-Is it possible the shaft or shell holder of the priming tool is worn or out of spec?
-Is my pocket cleaning tool worn or broken?
-Are CCI primers unusually hard?
-Does Win make their pockets smaller than standard?
-Any other suggestions?
 
imho;
yes,the primer seater rod sounds a mite short,
yes,the pocket cleaner has had it's day,
CCI's are harder to lightoff,but no harder to seat than others.
Not sure about pocket sizes of various cartridges

Is it the Auto Prime that takes special shell holders,and is that what isin the unit,or did somebody maybe modify something else and that could be not working right?
 
Here is what SAAMI says in their compendium.
PRIMER SEATING
The insertion of a centerfire primer or battery cup in the head of a cartridge case or shotshell. Properly seated, it should be flush or below the face of the head.
Click to expand...
I have loaded flush and just below (the feel of iust bottoming out) for 48 years.
 
Sounds like you have some defective equipment. Now as far as the primer pocket cleaner. Its no big thing if one side is flat the other has bumps. Take out the file and fix it. I know a bunch of guys who use old credit cards, or similar plastic. just cut it down to fit into the primer pocket and give it a spin. the ideal is to remove the burnt residue and uniform the pocket. some people dont even clean the pockets and just reload. Look at the progressive presses. one deprimes and sizes, the next prime the case. the next powder charge. the next seat a bullet. No where does it say there is a little guy in there that is cleaning the primer pockets. (by the way this is why i dont use progressives). So one thing you can do is measure the new primer to an old one. then check the depth with an old one. Some times the primers may be .001 or .002 taller than the originals. if so then i would not worry about it. Now if they are not being fully seated then yes call up the manufacture and get another primer. I doubt its the rod itself as they probably are made on an assembly line and are all the same. I would replace teh whole unit.
 
I never clean primer pockets on handgun rounds and never have issues with primer seating. I'm not saying it's not a good idea to clean them, it probably is, I just don't think that is the problem.

If you have another shellholder, try it. The first one may have too much play. Of course, it could be as simple as the primer seating rod being a bit too short and then Lee should send you one for free.

Not likely, but it could be the primer pockets are real tight at the bottom and not letting the primers seat all the way. A primer pocket uniformer would take care of that, but try the other things first. If you have another way to prime, your press for instance, try it. If it will seat them below flush, the primer pockets are OK.
 
I'll try another priming tool. The primers that sat flush required a lot of 'help' as far as shimming the tool up a couple thousandths to get them that far, and I only did a couple of those to see if the primers would seat any deeper. All 25 of the first batch were just above flush and required double strikes to ignite.
The tools are cheap so I'll probably just get another one.
I'll also straighten the pocket cleaner while I'm at it.
I don't have another shellholder but I can get one. They're specific to the Auto Prime tool.
I'd be very surprised if Dad modified any of the tools without telling me so, especially a priming tool.
 
My guess is that the cam on the link, or the pivot on the link that pushes the primer seating punch is worn. Wear at those points results in the primer punch to not extend fully. Take the tool apart and look at the parts for wear. Those parts need to be lubricated, if not they WILL wear causing the primers to NOT be seated fully.
 
excuse me rcmodel:evil:, but I have never seen any "pot metal" in my Lee Auto Prime II (even the press I use is cast iron) and I have no problems seating primers with it. Ya'll need to get away from them hand primer tools.:D Too much room for human error...:neener:
 
Ya'll need to get away from them hand primer tools. :DToo much room for human error...:neener:
Click to expand...
:eek:

I would MUCH rather use a hand priming tool, and my Lee, which I don't use any more since I got the RCBS, definitely has pot metal in it. :)
 
I got half a cigar box full of worn-out Lee hand priming tool pot-metal parts.

My old RCBS tool is still going strong on it's first set of parts after probably 20 years use!

It's just got to be a higher class of pot-metal, or a better design, or both! :D

rcmodel
 
Hand priming tools are not the best choice as they tire quickly and don't seat the primers completely. Invest a few dollars in a press mounted tool (Lee Auto Prime 2) or the RCBS model. Both are easy to use and they are consistent in the seating. I have a basic Lee press which I have setup with a Lee Auto Prime 2 just to prime cases and never have problems with primers being not fully seated.
 
Maybe I fuss over my brass a bit too much? I do use a progressive, and first pass through the loadmaster is to deprime and size. The case feeder sends them through at a good rate. Each loaded batch of 84 cases takes about 2 minutes to de-cap and size. Then every case is inpected for cracks, pockets, stretches, or any other anomoly. I bought a Lee pocket cleaner, 2 or 3 bucks I think, and any pockets that are crusted or show deposits get a quick spin, and are clean. Second pass through the loadmaster gets them loaded. Once set up and properly tuned (a pain but not bad if you READ THE INSTRUCTIONS) the primer seating is perfect on every round. I have never had a failure to light off from a primer seating issue. I have never used the hand prime, so I can't comment on the material or construction, but the lever (Stamped steel) and pin (machined it looks like) on the loadmaster is steel. (A magnet will stick to it) and after 10K + rounds, shows no signs of wear at all. With any press or any piece of machine at all for that fact, lubrication is essential. If parts are wearing out too fast, then the culprit may be poor maintenence. If it is a defective part, send it back to Lee, they will replace it.
 
If you like a hand priming tool and want a good one, Sinclair sells a really nice one that is almost indestructible. Unfortunately it costs over $100, but it should outlast any other hand priming tool. Just FYI. I have been using a ram-prime on a press and while it's slow, it works fine for me.
 
Want a quality hand priming tool? Try this one...

http://www.sinclairintl.com/cgi-bin/category.cgi?category=search&item=PT-2000&type=store

Note that you still have to handle the primers one at a time by hand. Of all the threads on here that we have had about how it is almost impossible to "kill" a primer, there are still those that think touching a primer is a no-no.

If water, WD-40, penetrating oil, bat guano, ect. will not kill a primer, why do so many worry about a few seconds of hand contact?

Personally, I've never found a better primer seating tool than my 40 year old RCBS Jr. press with the primer arm.

If anyone has one of the $115.00 Sinclair tools, let us know how it works.
 
My experience with Winchester 9mm brass has been that the primer pockets in the Win brass are not quite as deep as some brass. I use CCI in Win brass and to avoid high primers I use an EJS Possom Hollow primer pocket uniforming tool on all Win 9mm cases. Set properly it will square the bottom of the primer pocket removing the slight radius in the bottom corners of the primer pocket. Again, Win 9mm cases I've used have minimal depth primer pockets and CCI primers on many cases will only be flush or even left high. The tool is well worth the money and can be used for large or small primer pockets and is great to remove primer pocket residue. There are other pocket uniformers but this one works well.
http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=445053
 
Hand priming tools are not the best choice as they tire quickly and don't seat the primers completely
Click to expand...
:uhoh:

Mine gets tired after about 1000 primers, but it is good to go the next day. :D
 
I've used the Sinclar tool myself - a friend was showing me some stuff and I seated about 60 primers using one. It works well, and precisely, and is really tiring to use after about 10 or 20 primers. At least as tiring as a Lee ram-prime in a Lee hand press, probably worse. I think the benchrest types really like it because of the feel and precision. It would be fine if you only load 20-40 rounds in one sitting. For greater quantities than that, it's tiring.
 
Z-Michagin is right about the Sinlcair tool. It's awesome, but not made for volume.
 
Thanks for the advice. I'll look into getting another tool at least; the one I have looks a little worn on the cam, so that may be the only issue.
 
I'll also jump on the bandwagon to berate Lee's auto-prime quality. It's a first rate piece of crap compared to my RCBS hand primer.

The Sinclair hand primer looks like it is made from a small wire sheathing tool, which does not look very ergonomically sound.
 
I never clean primer pockets on pistol cases, especially 9mm, which gets lost before it wears out usualy.
I load progressive.

Tumble all cases, hand inspect as I sort from the primer into my brass stash, load em.

Some WIN brass has shallow pockets, you can see that some have been obviously polished at the factory and the primer and the head of the case have marks from where it was sanded flush.
 
I have had problems with a Lee Auto Prime as well. I acquired it used so I don't know how many rounds have been through it. But, it will not seat primers flush in several pistol calibers. It may be worn parts or the primer holder section may have stretched; it would not have taken much.

You can buy parts for the Auto Prime but at around $10 for the whole thing, why bother.

I use the RCBS. I do not like to have to disassemble to change calibers so I may get their universal priming tool. I have never had a problem with the RCBS seating the primer all the way to the bottom of the primer pocket.

I have a Redding Boss. I had the same problem getting below-flush seating with it as well. The primer is seated with the handle all the way up. Even grabbing the 'O' frame and squeezing has not reliably seated the primers properly. That is why I purchased the RCBS.
 
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