Romak 3 Owners talk to me.

[TC66]

I have a chance to get a New Romak 3 at a really good price. Under $600 with scope, hardcase and accessories. I shoot Mosin Nagant M38 so I already have a lot of 7.62x54R around it has some really good power and seems pretty accurate. What are your thoughts on the Romak 3 should I jump on this one since it will not cause me to buy new ammunition or should I pass. I am aware it is not as accurate as an AR but is it accurate and reliable enough to have some serious fun at distance?

 

[armoredman]

I'd love a Romak 3, preferrably the 16 inch barreled one without scope....Everyone I have talked to says they are great fun, and good rifles.

 

[TC66]

Why would you want a Romak 3 (squad sniper rifle) with a 16 inch barrel?

 

[armoredman]

Sounds goofy, doesn't it? I like the cartridge a lot, and the thought of a battle rifle sized package, with the AK reliabilty, (RomaK is AK, not Dragnunov), in that caliber is pretty neat. Also, I don't really think it's accurate enough to use as a "sniper style" rfle, and the Designated Sqaud marksman role doesn't "do it" for me. It would also be a very interesting brush hunting gun out here.
Last, "just 'cause"!

 

[TC66]

I like the caliber too. It would be an interesting brush gun. Ammo is cheap enough that you can stock up with a bunch.

I got this from Dragunov.net

The Romak-3/PSL is the military version of a Romanian sniper rifle that is now available in the U.S. The commercial version is just called the Romak-3, and it looks to be an interesting foreign offering.

 

[jobu07]

I love mine. I love my friends. I have nothing negative at all I could tell you about them. They are a hoot to shoot and, despite what some will say, quite accurate (in my opinion) for what they are and what i'll ever use them for. It's fairly inexpensive gun that shoots even less expensive ammo. You can't lose!

 

[5x5]

The PSL should only digest 148gr light ball such as the Wolf or czech silver tip. If you want to go up to the 175-180 range get an M14 recoil spring. They work in the PSL and have a heavier rate. Really fun rifle. In a moment of weakness I sold mine. And of course I miss it now and will me getting another. -Ian

 

[TC66]

Thanks for all of your input. It is greatly appreciated. I plan to only shoot the Czech 147 grain ammo as I get it for $54 a case from AIM. I live close enough (5 miles) so I go pick it up instead of getting it shipped. I guess I will have to get one. Sounds like there is no downside.

 

[MudPuppy]

I still plan on acquiring one myself--I hear the complaints about accuracy are largely due to milsurplus ammo. I can't recall the specifics, but it works better with specific grain bullets.

 

[5x5]

Black hills made a match round for it. They should have some left at Keislers online. Also, Sellier and Bellot make a match round that can be found at Cabelas. Both are in the 175gr range. -Ian

 

[Ash]

Mine was accurate. I sold it because it wasn't as accurate as my Savage and I couldn't take it on Client hunts. I suppose I just got to where I didn't use it any more and I had the need for cash.

Ash

 

[The Grand Inquisitor]

To the claim that a PSL is an AK, I would just like to throw my hat in and let you guys know that the Romak III/PSL is not an AK, and also not a Dragunov. And actually, to seperate the Dragunov's and Tigr's from the Kalashnikov design and philosophy isn't entirely correct as they are modifications on the Kalashnikov system. I would say that only the Chinese NDM (which CDNN still has left in stock...these will *never* be re-imported again...anyone want to buy me one?) is not as much like a Kalashnikov rifle because of some internal changes (small) and that it is chambered in .308.

I've posted this a bunch of times, but I still keep mentioning it because I think it is interesting, but my ex-ladyfriends parents came here from Romania in the 80's and her father was a CCCP soldier in Romania, and what he told me was that the soldiers issued Romak's (and the myth that Soviet soldiers were somehow less capable and dull is VERY untrue) were to provide support for the infantry troops with AK-74's at ranges from 250 yards out to about 500 or 600 yards (troops with 5.45 74's were expected to be able to hit a man out to 200 yards consitantly). I was suprised when he told me that most of the marksmen had to train especially hard shooting from standing and sitting positions rather than from primarily prone positions like US desinated marksmen or "snipers".

All in all...buy the Romak and shoot it until you can take the winning shot for mother Russia.

 

[saltydog]

And actually, to seperate the Dragunov's and Tigr's from the Kalashnikov design and philosophy isn't entirely correct as they are modifications on the Kalashnikov system.

That maybe true if you want to say that the Kalashnikov system and the Dragunov system "both shoot projectiles"

Both are completely different designs and neither weapon will interchange parts with each other. Not even in the same family.

 

[Catshooter]

I don't know if I could agree that the PSL ins't an AK. I mean no, it's not the same as a 47, but if you take one apart and compare, they may not be twins but they're sure brothers!

I love mine. Some say they suffer from a thin barrel, but it only looks that way 'cause it's so long. Measure one, it ain't that light.

Chrome-lined bore, cheap ammo and accurate to boot! I'd like it if the mags were cheaper, but the Red Star Arms adjustable trigger drops right in and gives it a wonderful trigger. I also put an RPK rear sight on mine.

Can't say enough good about mine!


Cat

 

[Dionysusigma]

The RSA trigger works in the ROMAK? If the shepherd's hook replacement plate thingy they have fits as well (or is easy enough to make a custom one for the ROMAK), then y'all mighta just sold me on it.

Add in one of these, and I'm set:
http://www.dragunov.net/stocksets.htm

Man... I just got shivers. 'Course, PTR-91s are cheaper than ROMAK-3s these days...

but not as cool!

 

[Sippenhaft]

I picked one up from SOG (stamped "FPK Dragunov") about a month and a half or so back, and like it. I haven't been able to take it to an outdoor range yet (stupid finals and Cleveland weather), but putting a few rounds through it at an indoor range impressed me (as much as such a test could, anyway). The recoil is far lighter than from firing the same ammo through my MN 91/30, seemed to operate fine, and it got some very interested (and much appreciated) looks from the other people at the range.

The only problem I've had with mine is I think the scope is screwed up; the crosshair seems to be on a slight diagonal (like, when I line it up with a right angle and have the gun resting on a flat surface, the crosshair is skewed about five degrees or so). Not a big deal unless I wanted to adjust for windage I guess (I honestly don't know that much about scopes), but still it was a little dissapointing. If possible, I would say check out the scope before you buy.

 

[telewinz]

Quote from finnish sniper

You may be surprised to learn that the main sniper weapon in Finnish military battlefield missions is the SVD. Our Special Forces snipers are mainly employed as rear security element in LRRP missions and assigned sniper duties within a given mission. The other main function is counterterrorist/urban assault sniping missions including hostage rescue and fire support. Besides the SVD we have access to any available sniper weapon in the world, depending on the mission/target configuration. We have suppressed and silenced weapons of all kinds as well as .50 Barretts, Sako TRG 21 & 41's, and H&K PSG-1's to name a few. Normal Infantry sharpshooters use old modified Mosin-Nagant M39's (free floating barrels, wood stocks) also in 7.62 x 53R with German Kahles scopes. They also have some TRG's with Leupolds. Their training is quite different, as more battlefield support fire oriented with some countersniper abilities. We put a little more emphasis in to camouflage, movement, communications etc...
By the way, originally SVD stood for Semipolarnya Vintovka Dragunova, (NOT Snayperskaya Vintovka Dragunova), which means Semi-automatic Rifle Dragunov, indicating that the rifle was not meant to be a truly sniper' s weapon. It was designed to shoot accurate supportive fire beyond the range of the original AK-47 in the battlefield.

On the ROMAK-3:
I also own privately a Romanian military PSL made in 1994 and I wanted to bring out some opinions of my own into that seemingly never ending debate about SVD vs. PSL. Regarding accuracy: even though you can find the ROMAK-3 for about a fraction of the price of the genuine Russian SVD, you should buy it. Mine has a Russian military PSO-1 on it and 1PN58 with IR illuminator for night use. I have modified the grip a little and did a trigger job (easy because our service weapons are Sako and Kalashnikov assault rifles which have the same kind of action and trigger assembly).
Now both of these weapons are equally accurate!!! About 3/4 MOA groups constantly. PERIOD.
The world of difference is the ammo. Believe me we have tried it all, everything available. And what we use is the Lapua 7,62 x 53R with 148gr D- 47 bullet, which is the thicker version of the D-46 (also 148gr). It is boat-tail MATCH ammo for the old Mosin-Nagant and Finnish equivalents from the WWII- era.
I don't want you to think I'm biased because the ammo is Finnish too, its simply the most accurate for these weapons. A second choice is the Swedish Norma. The Russian silvertips to my knowledge (and our special forces sniper school's) were never intended to be accurate ammo for SVD and neither is it a match grade ammo for any 7,62 x 54R. Russians simply don't make match ammo for that caliber. It is just better quality normal ammo. (More consistent manufacturing tolerances, better powder and so on). It is somewhat accurate in SVD but not great. Russians have adopted those silvertips for their use because manufacturing match-grade ammo for the SVD would only give marginal results. Big country, big tolerances, you know. The tip is painted silver to recognize it from the other same caliber rounds, especially from WWII- era mass- production ammo.

When asked to clarify what "Silver tips" are:
I've been doing some research on your question about Russian Silvertips / 7N14. The following is not the "ultimate" truth about this yet, but to my understanding Russian silvertips are those civilian soft cast metal bullets with a little milder powder charge as I mentioned before. Those 7N14's you mentioned are probably new "Snaiperskaya" cartridges made especially for SVD, but there is no such 7N14 marking in the cartridge case, so I'm still working on this.

Anyway that new snaiperskaya is still not yet even boat-tail ammo, so the accuracy is more consistent, but generally over 1 MOA. The "thing" in those cartridges is the powder and charge, which in Russia is said to be "the most suitable used for the SVD", which is probably right, because itÕs ballistics are somewhat identical to Lapua and Norma, and it stabilizes the bullet properly. The lack in accuracy depends still on bullet construction. By the way Sako and Lapua have also manufactured 7,62 x 53R ammo in boxer cases for competition purposes and I happen to have about 100 of them. They are accurate!

The reason why it is hard to obtain Match-grade ammo for the caliber is mainly bullet construction. The bullet is a bit thicker than average boat-tail match .308, which makes it a lower volume manufacturing product for any bigger ammunition factory. If you mean to reload your ammo, you can easily obtain powder and bullets, but Berdan primers are hard to get items. If you can get Berdan primers for the cartridge, you first have to invent a method of getting those used primers off from the two- priming hole case without harming it. We have most commonly used water pressure. You can use boxer primers in Berdan cases but it leads to primer pressure leaks and primer off-center problems which causes uneven burning and leads to fatal loss of accuracy ( "flys" [a.k.a. flyers], which means one single bullet tens of centimeters off target). Also the boxer primer sits a little bit too deep into berdan primer hole, which can cause a dud or an uneven pressure curve in powder burning. In Finland if a person can get his hands onto boxer primed cases you can definetly consider yourself as a lottery winner!

I also have an M39 in mint shooting condition. I use Lapua match ammo with D-46 bullet and that rifle is truly accurate and pleasant to shoot. I also own a Suomi submachine-pistol with 14 new barrels and shim-sets.

I was asked to add:
Everything I have stated is of my own responsibility and my own opinion and experience, not Finnish Army's or Government's official claim.

 

[Catshooter]

The Red Star adjustable trigger fell right into my PSL.

The resulting pull isnt what you'd expect from a fine match bolt, but for a semi-auto it is supereb, just supereb.

I've found nothing better to replace it with, especially for the money.


Cat

 

[RevDisk]

Normal Infantry sharpshooters use old modified Mosin-Nagant M39's (free floating barrels, wood stocks) also in 7.62 x 53R with German Kahles scopes.

Rather nice and accurate weapon, actually.