Siezed cylinder 1851 Colt

[medic1204]

I recently inherited an 1851 Colt. The cylinder is seized. I am by far no expert in firearms, and would appreciate any suggestions on how to free the cylinder. Thanks in advance for any help.

 

[arcticap]

Is the cylinder seized because it's rusted or stuck onto the arbor on which it spins or because the bolt (or cylinder lock) located underneath the cylinder is stuck in the up position?

 

[medic1204]

I don't know. As I said I am certainly no expert here. I suspect the problem is rust but I don't know how to check the bolt.

 

[arcticap]

This is reposted about one possible problem not having to do with a rusty cylinder or a cap fragment in the works.
I will post about those solutions next.

If you look thru the space between the frame and the bottom of the cylinder you can probably see the cylinder locking bolt sticking up into the cylinders slot.

If you can cock the hammer part way you should see this bolt retract into the frame. If it doesn't retract the problem is either with the bolt or the cam on the hammer.

To find out which you will have to remove the rear grip strap and wood grip and then loosen the screw that holds the mainspring to the front grip strap/trigger guard.
With the screw loosened (but not removed) rotate the mainspring out from under the hammer. Then remove the three screws that hold the triggerguard/front grip strap and remove it.

Removing the trigger/bolt spring is a matter of removing the screw. Make a sketch of how that spring was installed so you don't put it in backwards when you reassemble the gun.

Removing the bolt screw should allow the bolt to drop free of the cylinder. That should free it so that it can rotate freely.

The cylinder locking bolt that you just removed has a leg on it that is supposed to engage a cam on the hammer. If that leg is broken it would explain why the bolt isn't releasing the cylinder

 

[arcticap]

As to the cylinder being bound up, if thet is the problem, If it hasn't been used for awhile and maybe was not properly cleaned or stored you might have some corosion freezing it to the arbor.
Dissasemble it as far as you can to make sure that is the problem and not something in the works like scalper said. If the cylinder is frozen a good soak with penetrating oil will most likely work if not the judicious application of some heat to the cylinder and more penetrating oil should get it.

Here's a video clearly showing how to disassemble a Dragoon which is very similar to an 1851. You want to take off the barrel and see if the cylinder itself is indeed frozen and then to try to free it. But first make sure that there's no ball stuck between the cylinder and barrel causing the cylinder to bind up and not move as a result of a squib load.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XejAypMHH2Y

If there is a stuck cap fragment, usually you can wiggle and twist the cylinder until it drops free.

Another possible cause of a locked-up cylinder is that a capped but very small/no charge was placed, causing the ball to move part way into the forcing cone. Even after removing the wedge, the cylinder remains stuck to the barrel.

You can check this condition by sight: if there is no space between the cylinder and barrel, this may be the condition. If there is a ball stuck, you can pound it back (wood or brass rod) into the cylinder and remove the barrel. (PLEASE don't use a screwdriver!)

This is all reposted from a thread about the same topic involving a Dragoon on the Muzzle Loading Forum that's not available to be read by the non-member public. To register for free to read the actual thread follow my referral link to register. Then come back and click on the 2nd link below to access the thread.

http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/fusionbb/index.php?referral/4225/

http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/fusionbb/showtopic.php?tid/248301/

 

[medic1204]

I cannot fully cock the hammer. It won't even go into the half cock position. There is absolutely no play at all in the cylinder. I tried shining a light between the cylinder and frame and couldn't see light so I suppose the problem is corrosion. Again I really appreciate your time and trouble to help me with this.

 

[arcticap]

IIRC, sometimes if the wedge is pounded in too deep the cylinder can bind up too. That can be determined when the wedge is backed out or removed to take off the barrel.

 

[arcticap]

When you try to cock the hammer just a wee bit you're suppose to be looking to see if the bolt under the cylinder is retracting by starting to drop down into the frame. That's just step one to see if the bolt is damaged and causing the binding by not unlocking and dropping down.
If it's retracting then the bolt is okay and you need to take off the barrel to get some penetrant and/or heat onto the cylinder or to find a stuck cap fragment.
Look at the first part of the video to see how to take off the barrel. Remove the wedge and then use the lever to remove the barrel. If the barrel won't come off then it may need to be gently tapped on the side of the frame with a plastic mallet or such until the barrel loosens up from the 2 small alignment pins in the bottom front of the frame.

 

[arcticap]

If your bolt is not retracting then it's possible that you'll need to remove the grip, mainspring, grip frame, trigger guard etc until you can access the broken bolt parts. That description is in post #4.
That's not the same cause as having a corroded cylinder which is described in post #5.
It may just be corrosion, but that's why the bolt is checked first to see which end needs to be disassembled.
You need to take the barrel off to clean the gun up anyway so you might as well do that to see if you need to deal with any corrosion.
When you come back you should tell us whether you found any corrosion on the arbor when you took off the barrel or whether the bolt is stuck in the up position and causing your cylinder to be "frozen" and locked up.

 

[medic1204]

Arcticap,
I really appreciate your help. I have watched the video and tomorrow I will disassemble to find the problem.

 

[arcticap]

Okay. All of the basic information is here in this thread. Let us know how it works out and if needed look for the reassembly video posted by the same person who made the disassembly video.
Good luck.

 

[Hellgate]

Is that gun a replica or an original? If a replica then go ahead a screw around with it yourself but if it is an antique then you might just do several thousand dollars worth of damaging buggering up screws, etc. If it is a real one, get it to a gun restorer and have it fixed right with the right tools to preserve its value.

 

[Oyeboten]

Do not force the mechanism...

Dis-mount as one would a Dragoon, in the Video.


See then if the Cylinder comes off allright.

If it does not, there may be oxidized lube or corrosion of the Cylinder Arbor fit.