Someone can explain to me the 357 Magnum "struck by lightning" myth??

[The Janitor]

I remember a peace officer who was shot by a .357 mag. while wearing a vest.He said it was like getting hit with a sledge hammer.

I remember being at work when an idiot got hit with a sledge hammer. He said, "oough", and dropped on all fours to catch his breath. I think what you have from that cop is a "fishing story".

Back to topic. A friend of mine was shot 3 times with a .357 mag. Not sure the load or gun, but he got one in the flank and two in the lower back. He is dead now. If he were still alive today, he would attest to the lethality of it..Or would he?

The point is, .357 is a damn strong pistol round, and the ability to chamber 38spl makes it all the more versatile. You take a pinch of powder, about 150 grains of lead, mix it all together in a brass pipe, and top it off with a dash of overkill. You can handle anything from deer to domesticated felines. You can even get birdshot rounds. Plus you have the safety advantages of a revolver over a pistol round. I wouldn't want anything less than a 6" barrel in a .357, for velocity, accuracy, and balance/recoil control. Aesthetics too, of course.

If I could only own two handguns, one would be a 6" 357 revolver.

 

[AStone]

If I could only own two handguns,
one would be a 6" 357 revolver.

I'm with you 100,
but I like 3".

(My other .357 mag
is a carbine.)

 

[The Janitor]

(My other .357 mag
is a carbine.)

hmm..A carbine .357 eh? What sort of performance do you get out of that? I've really been debating on trading in my rarely-used Mini-14 on a lever-action rifle. .357mag rifles are on my list to research.

 

[AStone]

It's a Marlin 1894C.

Disappointingly little time to shoot it so far
(own a business ), but very decent accuracy to 75.

And the length, weight, simplicity, speed and history are great.

I also own levers in .22 and .30-30.

Welcome to THR, by the way.
There's a bunch of us lever lovers around here.

Love is a lever gun.

 

[slabsides]

Early .357 loads did kill like lightening. I recall an anecdote from my time in Germany: A military investigative agent was attacked in the street in the nighttime in Berlin. Witnesses in a nearby restaurant heard three sharp explosions...three dead assassins were collected. Agent was carrying a .357 personal weapon. A .45 would probably have done as well with the same skillful shooter. Probably. But it made me a believer in the .357.
I don't think much of the round fired from a snubby, though.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

We should remember there is a similar myth about the .45 ACP, "If you hit a man in the finger you'll knock him down."

The .357 myth was deliberately fostered by Smith and Wesson -- specifically by Douglas Wesson, then president of S&W. He hunted with the .357, killing a lion in Africa and a Polar Bear in northern Canada. He did all he could to build up the awe people felt for the .357.

To be fair, it was an awe-inspiring cartridge. Nothing else like it existed at the time. I can remember the old "Dick Tracy" cartoons, where "Magnums" were things of such extreme power that the police only used them in special situations -- like having to shoot through an engine block.

A lot of people grew up reading stuff like that, and the legend fed on itself.

 

[tipoc]

Thanks Vern for some clarity and perspective.

Seems in the last month or so on at least three forums there has been a rash of pro .357 threads likening it to "The Hammer of Thor", "lightening bolts", "The best cartridge Ever", "The 98% Stopper" etc. All just recently. There must have been a couple of articles in a gun mag somewhere, or a history channel special.

The .357 is a very good round. Versatile because of it's many loadings and the different size guns and types it can be chambered in.

Skeeter Skelton said if he had only one gun it would be in .357. He also said that he could not beat the .44 Spl. for killing game with a Keith bullet at 900 fps or so.

Elmer Keith said that if he could only have one gun and only one round to shoot it would be the .44 Spl. He said the .44 Spl was the ideal police round and self defense round and this was after he had helped developed the .44 Magnum and the .41 Magnum.

The point is that what's best for one shooter don't fit all. And that more than one round can stop a fella or a 300 pound hog.

Dan Wesson took a lot of game with the .357. He was an expert and outstanding shot. He also said afterwards that some of it was a stunt and better rounds were available for some game he had taken with the .357. He was honest about it.

The .357 is a good round. One of many. For some it may be the best, but no round is the "best" for all.

A little Skeeter...
http://www.darkcanyon.net/MyFriend_The357.htm

http://www.darkcanyon.net/The_44Special_A_Reappraisal.htm

tipoc

 

[Erik]

Well, I'll chime in with the opinion that the .357 magnum was a great round, certainly one of the greatest, and remains at least a good round, be it on the range, in the fields, or the alleys.

That cannot be said of most cartridges, even some of the greats.

 

[ranger335v]

Nothing said about firearms effect is always true, nothing is always wrong. Too much depends on both what's hit AND the mental attitude of the target. Some folks lie down easy, some don't.

I remember a story in one of the gun magazines published in the late 60s in which a Texas cop would often fire a couple of shots into the ceiling when encountering raging a bar fight. That had always stopped the brawl until the last night. One of the angry drunks charged the cop with a knife. He was hit 3 times in mid-chest with a .357 but continued on to fatally stab the cop before he expired. Both men were dead within seconds. The story stuck in my mind.

Ammo and bullets have improved a lot since then but they still won't kill every time with lightening-like hits in every situation, even with good hits. Only a Central Nervous System hit - in the head if possible - can do that and even then a double tap is good insurance.

 

[tipoc]

Not even lightning always works "like lightning".

http://www.straightdope.com/columns/061201.html

http://wonder.cdc.gov/wonder/PrevGuid/m0052833/m0052833.asp

"approximately 30% of persons struck by lightning die"...

So why expect the .357 to do so? Even with lightning it comes down to shot placement and that trumps caliber.

tipoc

 

[icebones]

it sounds possible, i have heard of static build up on airplane fuselage, caused by friction of the atmosphere, so its plausible that a bullet could build up a electric charge.

an interesting idea for a new mythbusters episode maybe?

its not that i dont believe you guys but i have to see to believe.
gonna have to try this .357 St. elmo's fire tomorrow night,
ill keep a look out for ball lightening too

 

[icebones]

for a few kicks, i actually posted this .357 magnum St. elmos fire on mythbusters. too bad most of the people on that forum are IDIOTS who know NOTHING about firearms.

a guy actually argued with me... he said that a .50 caliber means the bullet is 50 inches in diameter.

another guy said something like "if a .357 magnum does it than so will other calibers"

i like shooting at night, but its into a hillside so no stray rounds will cause danger, and i live miles away from the neighbors, but i have to admit, i never fired a .357 mag at night...

man growing up in california and watching movies to learn about guns must be sad...

 

[tipoc]

Icebones what "sounds possible"? And what is the reference to static electricity?

Bullets don't build up electrical charges. The only person here who mentioned this was joking. The .357 in some loads has a heck of a muzzle blast, but this is gas and powder burning not St. Elmos fire. That early post about building up electrical charges and such is a joke meant to make folks smile not a theory.

tipoc

 

[icebones]

yeah i know,

thats the bad thing about typing, with written words its hard to pick up on "sarcasm"


bit for centuries st elmos fire has been reported on ship masts, and more recently aircraft wing tips.
st elmos fire is a coronial discharge created by grounded object in an atmospheric electronic field (ie just prior to an thunderstorm)

this would be near impossible to study, but if an aircraft wingtip can become ionized, then a bullet flight could also be ionized. not that this bullet would leave a streak of electricity or anything, but it could carry a very small weak static charge.

or maybe not...i dont know



the whole "stuck by lightening" thing may be due to the .357magnums ammount of muzzle energy when compared to other handgun rounds. could hydrostatic shock be a factor?

 

[tipoc]

Someone early on explained it...it is an analogy. A batter in the box can be hit by a fastball and fall down "as if struck by lightning", a parent can be told their child has died and react "as if struck by lightning", a person can get whacked in the head by their pet monkey and ...etc.

It's just an analogy. It's been used for the .45 Colt, the .45 acp, the .38 Super, etc. It has no specific meaning. It has nothing to do with static electricity, hydrostatic shock, or any particular property of the round at all. It's just another way of saying that in some loads it's a very effective self defense caliber. That's it.

Likely some character on a video game, Grand Theft Auto maybe, said it and it's making the rounds now. Who knows and I figured out only now that I don't care. I'm a bit slow sometimes.

tipoc

 

[Z71]

Just shoot a little Ruger SP101 in .357 mag with full power 158gr loads!

You may come to understand the "like lightning" analogy!