Driftwood Johnson
Member
CraigC, Just a dumb question, but I have a 26" barrel rifle and it does have a saddle ring. It has an end cap on the forearm, and no barrel band. I've always thought of it as a rifle, but would it be called a carbine due to it's butt plate and saddle ring?
Not CraidC but I can answer that question. If it has an end cap on the fore end and no barrel band, it is a rifle.
During the 19th Century, Winchester offered their rifles in three different configurations; rifle, carbine, and musket.
Typically, a rifle had a cap on the end of the fore end, and the magazine was hung from a single hanger dovetailed into the bottom of the barrel. Rifles usually had a cast crescent shaped butt plate. Winchester would supply a rifle in almost any barrel length desired, barrel length was not what defined the difference between a carbine and a rifle. Barrels could be round, octagonal, or half round half octagon. I have seen Winchester rifles with 16" barrels built in the rifle configuration.
This is a photo of a typical Model 1892 rifle. Notice the configuration of the butt plate, the cap on the end of the for end, and the method of supporting the magazine.
Carbines did not use a dovetailed magazine hanger, the magazine was supported by barrel bands, typically two. The front sight may have been dovetailed directly into the barrel, or it may have been integral with the front barrel band. There was no end cap on the fore end. The butt plate was a strap of heavy sheet metal bent to shape, generally less severly scooped than a crescent shaped butt plate. There was a slight flat at the comb of the stock. Carbine barrels had a relatively severe taper from the receiver to the muzzle. A saddle ring might or might not be present on a carbine. It was not a defining feature of a carbine, only a defining feature of a Saddle Ring Caribine.
This is a typical Model 1892 Saddle Ring Carbine. (The ring is on the other side.) Notice the barrel bands, and the lack of an end cap on the fore end.
The Musket configuration was like an overgrown carbine. Do not be confused by the 18th Century use of the work musket, these guns were rifled. The butt stock was similar to a carbine butt stock. The barrel was long, and the fore end extended almost all the way to the muzzle. Muskets usually had 3 barrel bands. Many Muskets were sold to foreign governments, so many had bayonet mounts on them. You don't see muskets very often.
Even though the rifles I have shown are '92s, Winchester used these configurations for all their lever guns in the 1800s.
Regarding the OP's questions, if I were going to buy a 45-70 lever gun I would buy the heaviest one I could find. I fired one of those Marlin Guide Guns a few years ago and it beat the dickens out of me with recoil. I could not keep shooting it. I would also avoid a crescent shaped butt plate and go for one with a nice rubber butt pad.
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