Working up a load?

[Atroxus]

I am new to reloading. I am also not a great shot. I started reloading so that I could afford to go to the range more often. At 25 yards I can barely keep all of my shots in the black on a 2'x2' target. At 7 Yards my best 10 shot group(2 hand grip no rest, stock sights Beretta 92FS) is just over 3.5 inches. This brings me to my question.

Given my level of (in)accuracy, would I be better off trying to work up a load myself in the hopes of finding an "accurate" load, or would I be better off using a load that someone else says is accurate for them with the assumption they are better shots than me and that pretty much any load will be more accurate than what I am capable of at the moment? Also if I do work up my own loads what would be the best distance for me to test the accuracy of my loads at?

 

[Steve Marshall]

At this point don't worry about trying to find an accurate load. Pretty much ANY load out of a manual is good enough. Try the milder ones to help eliminate flinching. And just shoot as much as you can. Now the important part. I have no idea as to your age, physical condition oe eyesight. Focus on the front sight. That is the single most important thing for accuracy. Devote all your shooting energy to the front sight. Make the shot surprise you. Don't worry about smiley faces on your target. That's Mel Gibson BS. Don't worry about speed. That will come later. Don't worry about drawing from whatever. Front sight, front sight, front sight. Now, if you can't focus the front sight either go to the dollar store and find glasses that will or go to the optometrist. Did I mention to focus on the front sight?

 

[qajaq59]

At this point don't worry about trying to find an accurate load. Pretty much ANY load out of a manual is good enough. Try the milder ones to help eliminate flinching. And just shoot as much as you can.

What Steve said and pay attention to how you are shooting. Check your stance, and are you pulling the trigger with the pad on your finger or with the inside of the knuckle. Shoot every shot as if there was a trophy of some sort in front of you. Also take lots of breaks so you don't fatigue. There is a list somewhere in the web that lists all the things you should do for accuracy, but I can't remember where it was. But if you can find it and follow it, you'll end up shooting real well. And if you find yourself just firing the gun and not concentrating, just stop. Practice makes perfect only if you practice doing it right.

 

[steve4102]

Excellent advice above! I would shoot smaller groups as well, maybe 5 shot groups, might cut down on the fatigue thing.

When teaching my son's to shoot I would load the mag/rifle myself. I would sometimes include a randomly placed dummy round(no primer/powder). When the dummy round was chambered and they attempted to fire, if there was a flinch it was clear as a bell. If you have a shootin buddy, have him load the mag for you and insert a dummy round now and then. Then when you shoot, think as though each round is that dummy round and it will just go "click". If you have a flinching problem this may help fix it.

 

[twice barrel]

To shoot accurately two things are imperative;

1) No other distractions and 2) clear sight picture

Distractions can be anything from activities around you, a pebble or fired case under one foot, the glare of sunlight, etc. Anything that robs you of your ability to focus on the target while viewing the sights relative to the target.

2) You must be able to see clearly.

When you start out you lack familiarity with the weapon and often with form, stance, best practices, etc. Use the tools that have been proven over years of design and research. Adopt a good stance, a good grip, and most importantly of all - GET COMFORTABLE. That is why not everyone uses the same exact stance or grip. Not everyone is good shooting offhand...good enough perhaps but not GOOD. We're all not gifted in the same ways so don't sweat it.

Working up an accurate load? Heck yeah. Its another rewarding aspect of the hobby.

Get a good rest and shoot sitting down at a shooter's station. Make your own sandbags from an old pair of jeans filled with coarse sand if no other is available. Don't make them floppy and don't make them rigid. You need more than one so you can stack or shift them around to a height and position that is solid and comfortable for you.

Experiment with different targets. I find a small aiming point improves my accuracy tremendously. I also prefer a small solid white dot but in a grey or shaded background perhaps ringed in thin black circles. For me the ability to silhouete my sights over the bullseye really helps. And I like to be able to see where I hit. Also set the target at a range where the size of the sights in relation to the bullseye is optimal for you. Don't concern yourself with what other's like at this point. Move it closer if need be. (presuming your range permits this)

Get rock solid yet relaxed. Focus on the sight picture while simultaneously squeezing the trigger. Do not anticipate the shot. When you do it correctly you will be surprised when the gun fires. As it discharges try your best to keep the gun on target even during recoil...don't look up to see how you did until you're back on target ready to shoot again. Either shoot again or then pause and study your results. In time you won't even pay notice to the recoil.

Once you've determined a loading that works for you, make a bunch up and go back to your offhand defensive shooting at silhouete targets and the like.

As you shoot you will know just what your load in your gun is capable of with you shooting under optimal settings. You can then strive to improve your performance under more difficult settings.

Then you'll be able to do what Clint Eastwood has been telling us for years!

( a man's gotta know his limitations)



TB

 

[Atroxus]

Cool, thanks for all the info. So my plan now is just to work up a safe/reliable load while I work on my accuracy. Once my accuracy is better I can start refining my load for accuracy.

 

[qajaq59]

I find a small aiming point improves my accuracy tremendously.

Absolutely true for me as well.

 

[Atroxus]

I was re-reading ABCs again about working up a load and the only information it had about what increments to increase powder was in the section on loading rifle rounds. It said to increase powder charge .5grs at a time watching for signs of over pressure. Does this apply to handgun cartridges as well? I would think that with smaller powder charge that smaller increment increases would be in order? Also the data I got from hodgdon has a starting charge of 4.3gr and a max charge of 4.8gr. So going .5gr at a time I am basically looking at Min or Max charge with nothing in between. I was thinking of increasing charge .1 or .2 grains at a time, but wanted to see what you more experienced loaders think first. Also the loading data has a C.O.L. listed but I don't recall seeing that mentioned in ABCs. Anyone know what it is/means?

 

[jfh]

When I work up handgun cartridges--at least for the typical ones, but not including .44 Mag or the older / larger straightwall cartridges, I have settled on using two-tenths grain increments. There are a couple of reasons for this:

First, with the typical powders I use--ball, flattened ball,, etc., some extruded, little / no flake--my (Lee) measures are accurate to plus-minus one-tenth grain. With some powder and the proper techniques, I get half that--but functionally, I consider the measures to be repeatable at that level of precision.

Second, at least when beginning the workup, I load and shoot a minimum of ten rounds at each level. Even if I chose to shoot these initial rounds without a chrono, I want a minimum of ten rounds in the target to have a nominally-statistically-valid check for accuracy. Because my goals currently include some ballistic characteristics (i.e., I like to develop self-defense 'clones' of certain factory PD loads), I usually shoot over the chrono as well. This procedure enables me to narrow down the variables I want to tweak fairly quickly.

For handguns, I have found no gain in trying one-tenth grain increments, based on my goals. However, if one's goal included looking for the most-accurate MAX load, I would probably implement that stepping about 5+% below the MAX load.

As for COL--the Overall length is set when sorting out the initial specification. For semiautos (using bullets without crimp grooves), I get the seating depth / crimp sorted out for reliable function, within the typical cartridge parameters. For revolvers (bullets with crimp grooves) I get the LOA setup for a crimp at the midpoint, and with the kind of (roll) crimp I want for this cartridge. Once this is done--e.g., the physical assembly is sorted out--then I sort out the range of charges to work with.

Jim H.

 

[BsChoy]

+1 on the small aiming points...I use nothing bigger than 1/2 MOA dot at 100 yards. 2-4 inches at 200 yards unless using a powerful scope.

 

[twice barrel]

When a minimum and maximum are that close together I start to question if I've selected the best powder for that loading.

Still, if I had some already on hand I'd pick a charge dead center so that I have a margin for error either way and load 10 rounds to test.

Either I like'm or I don't as the range for adjustment is too small to be meaningful for me since I have no interest in trickling-to-charge for every round for plinking.

TB

 

[Mad Chemist]

I also second what others said above about front site and body mechanics. One thing I'd like to add is dry-fire. It is an extremely valuable training tool and essential for skill maintenance. Follow all typical safety protocols of course.

For myself, developing more accurate loads has been more a function of consistency in preparation than in special recipe selection. If my loading process is very uniform, charges are precise, brass is uniform, seating depth and crimp identical, then the loads are more accurate. I know that powder type and charge makes a difference but for the most part, I think these other factors are more significant, at least for handguns. From what I've been learning, powder selection and charge variation do seem to be much more important for rifles.

 

[Atroxus]

I just finished loading my first 60 rounds of ammo. 3 batches of 20 each, with 4.3, 4.5, and 4.8 grains powder respectively. My OAL or COL has been 1.134"-1.141" with the average around 1.138" I noticed after my first 40 rounds that some of the lead had little blobs of lubricant on them that could explain the larger variance in OAL during the seating process, so from that point on I inspected the lead first and removed any excess lubricant blobs and it seems to help.

Now I just need to get to the range to test out my new ammo. My plan is fire 10 rounds at 4.3gr, check cases for problems, check barrel for leading and clean if needed then repeat the process for the other half of my 4.3gr batch. If no signs of overpressure I will repeat the whole process for my 4.5gr batch, then my 4.8gr batch. Once done testing will compare my notes/targets from each batch to determine which load will be my target load. Then I will start loading large amounts of bullets so I can work on my accuracy more. Anyone see anything I am forgetting in that process?

I thought of another question today too. ABCs says to recheck powder weights every 5th or 10th charge. I have been doing this every 5th. How often do you guys recheck the accuracy of your powder dumper for plinking ammo? How about for hunting ammo? Or match ammo?

 

[qajaq59]

For hunting rifle ammo, or when working up a load for accuracy, I check every round. I also weigh my cast bullets and trim all the cases the same. I'm picky. But...... I'm also retired so I have lots of time. Not sure I was quite this picky at 25.

 

[rfwobbly]

Don't worry about accuracy, that will come on its own as you shoot more. Most accuracy issues with new or seldom shooters IMHO is simply flinch or anticipation. Try working with ear plugs under ear muffs. When the bang becomes second nature then the hands get really steady. For detailed ammo testing though, you need to shoot from a wrist rest.

For the most part I use 0.2gr increments when the min/max is something like 4.0 to 5.6gr. But grain increments have to be based on a percentage of the min/max load data. Obviously, for safety reasons if the min/max spread is from 4.4 to 4.8gr you can't do a 0.2gr increment. That's simply too course. You don't see that tight of a span that often, but you do see it.

Frequency of checking powder drops is a matter of experience and trusting your equipment. Until you've loaded thousands of rounds with multiple powders, you won't know exactly what your equipment is doing, so it should be checked more often. Once you become assured of your equipment, you know how it behaves, can trust it to drop an exact amount of powder +/- a known variation, then you can ease up a bit.

Hope this helps!

 

[rick300]

Atroxes, I'm new also so take this with however grains you may but when I started I made "dummies" first to get the measurements right. Then I practiced dropping powder. If you do this a little you can feel a good drop or a bad one. If I feel a good drop I weigh it, if it's on I drop 3 or 4 more. If I feel a bad one I weigh it and sure enough it's off. Then I do another, if it feels good I weigh it and if it's good I do 4 or 5. I stay in mid range loads and don't "Hot Rod" and this works for me.

 

[Sunray]

"...apply to handgun cartridges as well?..." Nope. Use tenths. As in 4.3, 4.4, etc. However, assuming your pistol fits your hand, (It's essential. Can you easily reach the trigger with the middle of the first pad of your finger with no strain?), 3.5 grains of Bullseye with a 121 or 124 grain cast bullet(cast bullets are far less expensive to shoot regularly than any jacketed bullet) is a reasonably accurate load to use when learning how to shoot.
Take some lessons, if you can, and do some upper body exercises.

 

[NC-Mike]

Ask the guys with progressive presses that pump out 30 rounds a minute how many times they checks the powder throws...

Usually the answer is once. When they fire the round.