Bite the Bullet and kiss Bubba-buggered screws goodbye!

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Walkalong said:
A proper set of driver bits for guns is a must if you intend to take them apart, even once.
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If we're being honest, it's bad engineering. It was bad when cars did it (not that they've eliminated it), and it's bad when gun manufacturers do it. I've seen this issue way more in US firearms than foreign-made. It does seem to be getting better.

I've actually drilled out mystery fasteners on a US-made shotgun light mount to replace them with standard ones. And let's not talk about Ruger and their new models with thread pitches from the bronze age.
 
entropy said:
Likewise. I was raised in a family full of mechanics. Grandpa owned a shop, Dad and my uncle worked for him before Dad became a cop, my uncle became a High School auto shop teacher. I still work on cars, not because I like to, but because I can and it saves me money. (Put a alternator in my truck yesterday, actually.) I like to work on guns. I take my time, do it right, and use the right tools.
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Trollol on.......

CRESCENT WRENCH!






Ive finally bought or built most of the "special" tools i need on a regular basis, but i still need to buy a few more sets of driver bits. I loose them faster than pocket knives.
 
Bit sets are nice, but as noted the one you need is always hiding somewhere. Here is a basic set of fine firearms turnscrews: https://www.garrettwade.com/gunsmit..._EhiJ-70U9mG-61k9idhF4KMOqdBibVkaAhWbEALw_wcB I suspect you will not let these wander far from the bench.
The trouble with the bit sets is that there is no telling what steel goes into them, they were likely made in China, and the bits tend to wobble a bit in the holder. Makers such as Wera, Wiha, pb Swiss, Apex, Zephyr and Witte are most highly regarded. They can be used in a locking holder to approach the feel of the traditional tools. Care will always be necessary in fitting bit to screw, however, and "good enough" never has been.
 
LoonWulf said:
Trollol on.......

CRESCENT WRENCH!






Ive finally bought or built most of the "special" tools i need on a regular basis, but i still need to buy a few more sets of driver bits. I loose them faster than pocket knives.
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:D

I own one crescent wrench-it was a gift from SWMBO, though she calls them "Pennsylvania Knucklebusters". I do admit to having several Vise Grips, but I don't use them on guns, mostly cars.
 
How about buying a bunch of (relatively) cheap screwdrivers, and a Dremel tool, and grinding them to exactly fit whatever gun you are working on? No matter how many drivers in a set, you're never going to cover every screw that you may encounter. Make your own to fit.
 
Relatively cheap screwdrivers are made of cheap steel, and often snap anyway, even when ground to fit. I like finding old screwdrivers cheap, often by the boxful, at farm auctions and grinding those to fit. They're usually made of good steel. I'm talking the wood handled craftsman (not the brand) type ones of days gone by. I've never had one of those snap.
 
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3Crows said:
I like the Grace sets, wooden handles, USA made, some are specific to brand. I like the Marlin set in particular.
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That’s what I was going to buy, because some instinct whispered, “get old-timey screwdrivers with wooden handles... it is your only hope.”

But too many reviewers said Grace tips are soft and get chewed up fast.

Are they just clumsy oafs?
 
rust collector said:
Bit sets are nice, but as noted the one you need is always hiding somewhere. Here is a basic set of fine firearms turnscrews: https://www.garrettwade.com/gunsmit..._EhiJ-70U9mG-61k9idhF4KMOqdBibVkaAhWbEALw_wcB I suspect you will not let these wander far from the bench.
The trouble with the bit sets is that there is no telling what steel goes into them, they were likely made in China, and the bits tend to wobble a bit in the holder. Makers such as Wera, Wiha, pb Swiss, Apex, Zephyr and Witte are most highly regarded. They can be used in a locking holder to approach the feel of the traditional tools. Care will always be necessary in fitting bit to screw, however, and "good enough" never has been.
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Part of me knew that a bit set is not the best thing, and is even kind of “for the suckers,” but I didn’t know who makes the “real screwdrivers.”

Thank you for the information.

Edit: just looked at Garret and I see good screwdrivers at good prices.

Now I know to remember these sacred words when it comes to gun screwdrivers:

Hallowed Ground.
 
I have a set from Forster, I think it is this one:

https://www.forsterproducts.com/product/gunsmith-screwdriver-set-set-of-8-screwdrivers/

I was actually looking for a Grace tool set but had a gift card for a place that carried Forster. Plus, Forster was recommended by someone I trust.

They fit most everything I need to fit. Although the metal might be a bit soft. I twisted one of the drivers loosening an overtightened screw but was able to straighten it back out just fine. No harm, no foul. Also I managed to loosen the screw without buggering it up, so that's a win. FYI this was a one-time issue with a smaller, thinner driver and an overtightened screw. Every other use, the tools fit and work perfectly. Overall I am happy with the driver set.

I believe my dad had some Grace screwdrivers and recommended them. Good stuff. I've no idea how they compare to the Forster or Garrett Wade tools but they did work well for the old man

http://www.graceusatools.com/item-details.php?item_id=31&category_id=2

Both of them are made in USA, which is nice. No experience with the Garret Wade tools but they sure look well made.
 
Demi-human said:
I believe they are the “French Metric” wrenches.

I always hear many “French” words before this one finally comes out.

I don’t know why I let my father do things...:)
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Around here they are known as "Mexican Socket Sets"

My darling wife gave me a set of Brownell's screwdrivers for my birthday a lot of years ago and I have been known to use it on different mechanical devises besides guns. A good screwdriver is a good screwdriver no matter what you are working on. My following birthday she presented me with a nice set of Grace screwdrivers. These only get used on guns. I haven't managed to bugger up any of either set yet but just because you have the correct screwdriver doesn't mean you can't booger a screw anymore. Ask me how I know? I've managed that little trick a couple of times by being distracted when I should have been paying complete attention to the task at hand.
 
Here is a thread from Steven Dodd Hughes on making hollow ground screwdrivers.

It is from a book he wrote on gunsmithing double shotguns that I have and read before he posted this on the S&W forum. It’s probably easier to follow with the few pictures that are in the book but not much. He also wrote an article for American Rifleman that may have been the same or very similar way back in 2008 or 2009.

http://smith-wessonforum.com/s-w-smithing/174948-custom-grinding-gunsmithing-screwdrivers.html

Scrolling down I ask a few questions which are answered with a bit more detail.
 
pairof44sp said:
That’s what I was going to buy, because some instinct whispered, “get old-timey screwdrivers with wooden handles... it is your only hope.”

But too many reviewers said Grace tips are soft and get chewed up fast.

Are they just clumsy oafs?
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It would be nice for the screwdriver to be softer than the screws to protect the screws. I do not know if that is the case with Grace ;). I have not noted any deformation or "chewing up" of the blades. That being said, years as an aircraft mechanic and dealing with fasteners on engines that damaging could result in significant costs (like as much as a nice house), I do not routinely chew up screws or tools. If these folks are "chewing up" their drivers there is likely a technique issue.

The Grace screwdrivers are hollow ground so as to fit specific screws (in the rifle branded sets) and this means there is a fragile tip that can be easily broken if used as a hammer, pry bar, paint can opener or other monkey hijinks I see screwdrivers used for other than their intended purpose not to mention German torque, or worse, Texas torque, like if the screw is tight, at least three more turns ought to do it.
 
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Breaking a screwdriver blade is not exactly the best thing to happen while pushing on and twisting a screwdriver.

You won’t bugger the screw slot but other damage is likely to occur.
 
3Crows said:
A hollow ground driver should not need pushing on.
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No it shouldn’t but ask anyone who uses tools how that usually plays out.

If you have the work in a vise vertical so you are using the driver parallel to the ground it helps in this regard.

The way I usually do it is to go very slowly when a screw is stubborn and I can feel the driver just starting to give way.
 
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