Ballistic Apps

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Enkiduthewildman

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I've been using Bullet Drop+, but since I've gotten a chronograph I've discovered it's way off on drop data. Example: called for 1.8 mils at 350y. Fire verified correction is 1.1. It's about 8" off at only 350. I also use it to make decisions when working up handloads.

Some of the apps are expensive. has anyone gotten fire-verified dope consistent with data from a smartphone app?
 
the state of ballistic solvers is improving rapidly these days. They've been accurate for a long time, but they're getting easier to use and there is a lot more competition. but with that comes a LOT of unnecessary drama as one of the bigger names in the industry is promoting their product and bashing others on all the forums. Even so, I'd do some searches here and other forums. There's a lot of conversation about this right now.

the good news is the short answer to your question is there are several cheap or free ones that will give you good data out to 1000 yards. and if they're not giving you good data, then you probably don't have the input parameters correct.

as an example, I used the Shooter app on iphone (not free, but pretty cheap) to shoot the ELR PRS Match in WY last month, with a slow 6.5x47L and hit almost 50% of the shots between 1200 and 1800 yards. It was pretty challenging because of wind, as on a couple occasions I got a first round hit at 1700+ and then missed the second round because the wind changed. But elevation was solid out to 1200 yards, and only about .2 off after that. Here's a thread with details and pictures of that match. http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=808439

One thing to consider is using free solvers on the web. JBM is very accurate and has been for a decade. It's free to use on their website and you can print off a range card and laminate it and carry it with you. Also in the past month or two, Hornady announced their new 4DOF solver which is also free on their website, but I think only has hornady bullets at the moment.

There's also several free solvers that work in microsoft excel if you happen to have that on your computer. An example is Ballistic XLR. I think the author posts here.

If you want to spend a little more, Bryan Litz' Applied Ballistics is good. They may have a free website version too.

TRASOL is also supposed to be really good and only $9 on iphone. I'm going to mess with it when I get time but haven't yet.

Bullet Flight from KAC worked well for me but the interface isn't as easy to use as shooter so I don't use it much anymore.

Ballistic AE is popular.
 
Another vote for Shooter. Allows you to save gun/load combinations, allows different BCs for different velocity ranges, etc.

Mike
 
Fire verified correction is 1.1.
Click to expand...

Quite possibly because your rear sight was already high from regular sighting in.

Also, although I haven't done much in trajectories for a while, don't most drop calculations derive from a level barrel?

In other words, "drop" at a distance is calculated from a level barrel, and are only correct for that situation.

Someone enlighten me, but that's the way I remember it.

I may be misreading your description, though, or your sight radius might differ from the assumptions used in the calculator. If this is the case, then your sight radius would seem to be shorter than the sight radius assumed by the software.

Terry
 
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What chronograph? Read this: http://www.appliedballisticsllc.com/Articles/ChronographChapter.pdf

Have you corrected for your Velocity Decay between the Muzzle and Chronograph? Read this: https://www.facebook.com/appliedballisticsllc/posts/1182760501785831

Have you accounted for your turret tracking? : http://www.abmediaresources.com/talltarget.pdf

Have you accounted for your powder temperature sensitivity? : https://www.facebook.com/AppliedBallisticsLLC/posts/1183596951702186

Where are you getting your BC from? Is it one of our tested and verified BCs or is it off the box? How old or new is that data? I can tell you, one of the reasons our app is expensive is because we have a full time laboratory where we are constantly doing research. This allows us to have the most accurate information, but it comes at a cost. Its a big resource to run a lab. When looking at app choices, look at where the data they use comes from.

What we have on hand, is the raw Mach vs CD (coefficient of drag) information for over 700 bullets we have carefully tested. Aside from that, we have a system that is capable of sub 0.0001" measurements on up to 15 parts of the bullet at one time. Removing the human element means you don't have to take an average of multiple measurements. This system is used in high resolution quality control. But take a look at our Custom Drag Model Article, to see what kind of raw data we have: https://www.facebook.com/AppliedBallisticsLLC/posts/1166773243384557 you can download the pdf here: http://www.appliedballisticsllc.com/Articles/ABDOC130_CDM.pdf. Nothing is more accurate than this, and to prove it we took 1st, 2nd, and 4th place at the King of 2 Mile: http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com...ics-shooters-dominate-king-of-2-miles-finals/ . The RAPTAR-S took 1st, 2nd, and 3rd place at the US Army Special Operations Command International Sniper Competition: http://soldiersystems.net/2016/04/26/usasoc-sniper-comp-winners-used-wilcox-raptar/ and we were a top 6 pick in elite sniper tech: http://www.foxnews.com/tech/2016/03/31/6-top-picks-in-elite-sniper-tech.html. So I ask you, when you look at ballistic solvers, look at who is leading from the front ;). It isn't cheap to run a full time lab, but in the end it certainly pays off with performance.
 
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No argument there. I always use litz' BC no matter what calculator I'm using. (Except FFS)


btw, just an update from my post above on TRASOL... which i did purchase but haven't personally used much yet. There are a lot of reports that it's a buggy mess at the moment. So, for $9 it's not a high risk investment, but it does seem to be a pay now, use later proposition.
 
I've been enjoying strelok for ages now, I always verify the data with what I see on target, but have no issues yet
 
taliv said:
No argument there. I always use litz' BC no matter what calculator I'm using. (Except FFS)


btw, just an update from my post above on TRASOL... which i did purchase but haven't personally used much yet. There are a lot of reports that it's a buggy mess at the moment. So, for $9 it's not a high risk investment, but it does seem to be a pay now, use later proposition.
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I assume you just mean G7?

Mike
 
I been using Shooter lately and have been pretty happy with it. Normally I am only able to practice out to 700yds at the local range, but when we have our precision rifle matches, some of the hill tops we shoot from allow for an 825yd shot. Shooter was dead on for the 825yd plate at the last match, as well as all of the closer plates at odd yardages. I actually lucked out and won the last match, but using Shooter really helped simplify the windage adjustments as you can easily scroll through different wind levels and reset directions quickly.

Edit: I also like that the Litz derived BC's for all the bullets I use are built into Shooter, they seem to be quite accurate.
 
I use Ballistic AE on my iPhone and I've been pretty happy with it. My normal range goes out to about 850 yards, and I sometimes shoot beyond 1,300 yards. The program seems to work well and be reasonably accurate, but at 1,300+ yards there are a lot more factors determining a hit or miss than the app on my phone!
 
I assume you just mean G7?
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no, i don't. I mean instead of trusting the G1 or G7 numbers published by the bullet manufacturers (which used to be calculated), I am using the numbers that Litz measured with doppler radar and published in his books and which you can find in most calculators.

for example, go to jbm website and when you pull down their bullet profile, you'll see "bullet x" and another entry "bullet x (litz)".
 
taliv said:
no, i don't. I mean instead of trusting the G1 or G7 numbers published by the bullet manufacturers (which used to be calculated), I am using the numbers that Litz measured with doppler radar and published in his books and which you can find in most calculators.

for example, go to jbm website and when you pull down their bullet profile, you'll see "bullet x" and another entry "bullet x (litz)".
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Fascinating. I learn something new every day.

According to this 2012 Air Force Acedamny Paper he used microphones spaced at intervals along the path (does not mean he did not use Doppler radar later): https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct...AGONPdnspTInQ8ILA&sig2=7tBFON65TtfYZVlI60xvXQ

Mike
 
I wrote the ballistics calculator for BallisticsGL. I just made it free on the app store, so if the members of The High Road would take advantage of the free download it would be great.

https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/ballisticsgl/id965001118?ls=1&mt=8

I would love some feedback. I have compared it to Shooter (which I like) and the online Hornady calculator and find it to be similar to both of those.

The assumptions:
The line drawn from the shooters eye, through the scope or sight, to the target is a straight horizontal line. The line from the bore of the barrel will not hit the target (in most cases).

You know the actual sight height above the bore-axis. Most people just drop in 1.5" for a hunting rifle, but that may not be correct.

My calculator uses the G1 ballistics coefficient and after much research I settled on using the 1909 ballistics tables. I personally was surprised that those tables created results most similar to all of the online calculators.

I went through several formulas for approximating air density, and such. I felt that it really is more of a process of taking all of these formulas to approximate things and trying out all of the combinations of these formulas to see how it compares to someone else's approximation.

The app should be free, but sometimes it takes price changes a while to work through all of the servers. It will be free for about 48 hours. Enjoy the app. I love to give back to The High Road, the members have helped me so much with reloading and other tasks that I am very grateful.
 
Gilligan that's awesome thanks

Mike I suspect it wouldn't take much to persuade beech above to describe all the details of the testing. I suspect it's ongoing and has changed over the years
 
Thank you Sir! Downloaded and appreciated THR contribution. I'll use it.
 
Why stop at 500? We tested ours at over 1 mile! First round hit at 2477 yards! Not once, but twice! That's 1.4 miles. Even though we used the AB Mobile App (on Android) with a CDM (Custom Drag Model: http://www.appliedballisticsllc.com/Articles/ABDOC130_CDM.pdf )That's the same calculator you can find online for free here: http://appliedballisticsllc.com/ballistics/

http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com...ics-shooters-dominate-king-of-2-miles-finals/

Also their is a reason we don't use DA by itself. Their is also a reason we use station pressure (if you use the online calculator DO NOT USE BAROMETRIC PRESSURE. We use Mach vs CD, so the speed of sound calculation is important.
 
DocUSMCRetired said:
Why stop at 500? We tested ours at over 1 mile! First round hit at 2477 yards! Not once, but twice! That's 1.4 miles. Even though we used the AB Mobile App (on Android) with a CDM (Custom Drag Model: http://www.appliedballisticsllc.com/Articles/ABDOC130_CDM.pdf )That's the same calculator you can find online for free here: http://appliedballisticsllc.com/ballistics/

http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com...ics-shooters-dominate-king-of-2-miles-finals/

Also their is a reason we don't use DA by itself. Their is also a reason we use station pressure (if you use the online calculator DO NOT USE BAROMETRIC PRESSURE. We use Mach vs CD, so the speed of sound calculation is important.
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I ran the numbers on the website you list but can't seem to figure it out. I have the zero at 100 yards yet the calculator says that it is -0.25" at 100 yards.

Why only do 500, just for space sake. I know that my calculator is designed to give a good approximation and that error builds as the algorithm steps through the range of calculations. My calculator is for those that want to get on paper and have reasonable results, because there is no substitution for actually shooting and learning how your rifle and round performs in various conditions.

If I were competing then I would spend the money to get the tools to do it right. I am just an average user, punching paper, longest shot on game was around 130 yards for me, no rocket science needed, just aim in the kill zone, +/- 3" and let her go. :)

Here are the AB results:
appliedballistics.png
 
Fella's;

I've been using JBM ballistics online & free for years. Never had a problem with it myself & thought I'd see it mentioned on this thread. Was kinda surprised it hadn't shown up yet. It correlates well enough with my equipment & data logs.

900F
 
I've been using JBM ballistics online & free for years. Never had a problem with it myself & thought I'd see it mentioned on this thread.
Click to expand...

OP was asking about apps, meaning something to run on a smart phone, the JBM calculator is a web page and won't work well on a smart phone, and not at all if you are in the boonies and don't have a data connection.

The free apps work better in the boonies as there will be no ads to serve up to you as you use it :)
 
Wally;

Ah, perhaps I see, but dimly I'm sure. Being the curmudgeon that I am, complete with flip-phone and a refusal to update. I delight in driving the people at the phone store nuts. I love pointing out little directions that come up that say to press "call". There is no button on the phone that says that. I could go on, but there's no point, it's for my own amusement. The industry could case less.

:D 900F
 
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