Reusing powder?

Inertia works fine if you have a few 'heavier' projectiles.
Cam-lock for quantities and/or lighter projectiles.

I thought about using vice grips to hold the bullet while lowering the shell holder on my press,

Every reloader should own a puller of some kind.

Not really a question of 'if', but 'when',,,,,,,

Another vote for the Hornady cam-lock with collets. I also use the old traditional inertia puller which is ok if you are removing a couple of rounds--but they can break and make a mess too. Don't ask me how I know.

Imperial sizing wax and size them down.
Should be way easier than pulling and reloading.

Englishmn said:

size them down

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Am I wrong in thinking that this may be impractical?

My notion of how a standard full length sizing die works is that the case neck is reduced in size, and then opened up to the specified diameter as the expanding plug is pulled through on the upstroke. Running the die without the expanding plug is going to squeeze the neck and bullet a couple thousanths less than its supposed to be. That might take some serious force to accomplish. If they are steel core bullets, impossible.

Not to mention running a loaded cartridge through your die, which may make some people uncomfortable.

If you have enough to make it worthwhile, I'd at least pull the bullets and resize without the decapping pin. Powder should be OK if you put the same amount back in.

Resizing loaded ammo is a no no. Besides they are steel cases. Pull them and reuse the powder and bullets if you really think the time , effort and guess work are worth it. I would just right it off and forget about them or see if they will chamber in someone elses rifle then make a deal.

Laphroaig said:

Am I wrong in thinking that this may be impractical?

My notion of how a standard full length sizing die works is that the case neck is reduced in size, and then opened up to the specified diameter as the expanding plug is pulled through on the upstroke. Running the die without the expanding plug is going to squeeze the neck and bullet a couple thousanths less than its supposed to be. That might take some serious force to accomplish. If they are steel core bullets, impossible.

Not to mention running a loaded cartridge through your die, which may make some people uncomfortable.

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The reason I suggested using a body die. It does not touch the necks, so you can resize loaded rounds.

Mr_Flintstone said:

I took a black sharpie and marked the bullet and shoulder of one of the rounds, and tried to close the bolt (but I didn’t force it too hard).

View attachment 788676

You can see a ring around the top of the shoulder. That must be where it’s binding up. I think that if I measure the OAL, pull the bullets (without damaging them), reuse the powder and bullet in a new brass case, and reseat to the same OAL, it would be OK. Anyone see a problem with that?

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Well if they can't build a proper headspaced round I wouldn't necessarily trust them to pick a safe charge either. I'd pull the bullets and reload them, use the powder for fertilizer, and trash the cases personally.

1KPerDay said:

I'd pull the bullets and reload them, use the powder for fertilizer, and trash the cases personally.

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Me too - now. In a prior post in this thread, I posted that I'd resize and reuse the cases. I'd forgotten about the fact that they're steel cases anyway. So I've changed my mind and would now follow the same steps as 1KPerDay.

Laphroaig said:

Am I wrong in thinking that this may be impractical?

My notion of how a standard full length sizing die works is that the case neck is reduced in size, and then opened up to the specified diameter as the expanding plug is pulled through on the upstroke. Running the die without the expanding plug is going to squeeze the neck and bullet a couple thousanths less than its supposed to be. That might take some serious force to accomplish. If they are steel core bullets, impossible.

Not to mention running a loaded cartridge through your die, which may make some people uncomfortable.

If you have enough to make it worthwhile, I'd at least pull the bullets and resize without the decapping pin. Powder should be OK if you put the same amount back in.

Click to expand...

Yes, I forgot about the neck being sized in a fl die.

Try a Grip-N-Pull. They work! And you get several calibers with one tool. Little to no marring of the bullet and much easier than the kinetic pullers. Use gloves or pad the handles if you have a lot of ammo to pull, and your hands will thank you.

Back in the day when I got my first Mosin rifle and no cheap hunting ammo or reloadable brass was available I Mexican Matched lots of Bulgarian surplus LB FMJ with Speer .311" 150 gr. Hot Cor soft point bullet a friend game me that used to reload for 303 British that he no longer had.

I pulled the old steel jacket bullets which were undersized for my bore, averaged out the powder charges and drop them about 2.0 grs. as the original factory load was pretty warm. I then resized the original factory case neck and trimmed them to proper length, then seated the new bullet to the proper COAL listed in the Speer manual. It made a world of difference in accuracy and I still have a nice bag of leftovers for a rainy day.


Many of the old brass cases for one lot of ammo from the early 50's had lots of cracked necks even though it was sealed very well,probably seasonal cracking but the powder and bullets were fine so I saved the powder an bullets for later use.

Here's where I warn everyone - Don't try this at home. This is off-the-book handloading. I am not responsible for what you do.
I have done a good bit of research prior to trying this. I use a chronograph to look for ignition problems, which will show up in the numbers.
I have been reloading since the late 1980's.

I am doing the same with some 1951 Russian ammo for a Mosin-Nagant 91/30. This ammo is 150 grain steel case, steel jacket, lead core. The pulled projectiles averaged 149 grains.

I pulled 20 bullets, weighed the charges. I averaged the charge (49.5 grains of something that looks remarkably like IMR4895), and dropped it 15%. I reloaded the same bullet with 42 grains factory powder, and re-crimped the case with a Lee crimp die.

I am getting velocities very similar to what would be expected with I4895, and very consistent deviations. I have since dropped the charge an additional 5%, for a total of 20% reduced from factory. I am currently loading 40 grains of factory powder back into the cases. I have fired hundreds of these rounds, with very good consistency, and absolutely no problems.

I am getting ~2200 fps from the Mosin, with acceptable accuracy for practice, which is roughly 4" at 75yds. And, i'm not getting hammered every time I light one off. What I have is essentially .30-30 velocities (and bullet weight) fired from Mosin-Nagant. I can easily fire 50+ rounds without flinching, or getting a sore shoulder.

The remaining powder will be used in a similar manner, using different cases and projectiles. The powder I pulled has a burn rate very close to I4895, which is not surprising. That burn rate has worked well in .30 calibers for decades. For every 100 pulled bullets, I have enough left over powder for 22+ new rounds. That's free powder.

And I have 2 crates of this ammo.....

A lot of work if you have the time. Not me. Don't like guessing at powder type.

Jack B. said:

A lot of work if you have the time. Not me. Don't like guessing at powder type.

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What is there to guess? It’s not like you know the powder is ever factory load you shoot. Using the same powder and bullet, just putting them in a different case.

Jack B. said:

A lot of work if you have the time. Not me. Don't like guessing at powder type.

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This isn't guessing. I know the burn rate of the surplus powder. It doesn't matter what the powder type is, what matters is the burn rate.

Handloaders use surplus powder every day. I'm using surplus powder too, the only difference is that I'm also breaking down the cartridge, and reusing the components.

Whooda,
I also pull down surplus ammo (hard primer 1950s Yugo 8mm) and re-use the powder, but with one major difference.
I do not mix the powder from the individual cartridge cases.

Reason? Are you sure the case was 'fresh from the factory as originally assembled'?
In pulling down hundreds of rounds, I have come across European square flake, different size Western round tubular, and ball powder that had all been loaded in
shells with identical headstamps.
This ammo was bought in sealed cases containing 15 round boxes.
Obviously it had been boxed and repackaged prior to the case being sealed.

So, my advice (for me) is to just re-load each round individually.

JT

Put me in the group of "pull the bullets and toss eveything else." And I'd pull the bullets with a collet puller, Hornady or RCBS. But I already have a Hornady so that would make the decision easier for me.

GunnyUSMC said:

What is there to guess? It’s not like you know the powder is ever factory load you shoot. Using the same powder and bullet, just putting them in a different case.

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I never shoot factory loaded ammo.

JT-AR-MG42 said:

Whooda,
I also pull down surplus ammo (hard primer 1950s Yugo 8mm) and re-use the powder, but with one major difference.
I do not mix the powder from the individual cartridge cases.

Reason? Are you sure the case was 'fresh from the factory as originally assembled'?

JT

Click to expand...

Well, I didn't follow it from the factory in 1951, but I have factory crates, and inside those crates are soldered-shut tins.

I'm using powder from the same numbered lot, not mixing lots.

I see no difference from using any surplus powder, except that I do know the factory load with the bullet being used. I am absolutely certain of what the Soviet military considered a safe load.

I'm not recommending this to anyone else, particularly new reloaders. I'm just trying to expand the general knowledge base, and show folks that there is more than one way to skin a cat.

Jack B. said:

I never shoot factory loaded ammo.

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We're talking about factory loaded ammo. Now it someone gave me a bunch of reloaded ammo, I would pull the bullet, dispose of the powder and reload with new powder.

GunnyUSMC said:

We're talking about factory loaded ammo. Now it someone gave me a bunch of reloaded ammo, I would pull the bullet, dispose of the powder and reload with new powder.

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I agree with what you say. I don't shoot anything that I didn't make myself and I never trust any powder that I didn't buy new in it's original container. I like my eye's and fingers too much to chance them on powder that I'm not 100% sure of. I'll spend a few bucks more than guess at what 50 year old powder might do. I guess that's just me. Safety first.

Mr_Flintstone said:

I took a black sharpie and marked the bullet and shoulder of one of the rounds, and tried to close the bolt (but I didn’t force it too hard).

View attachment 788676

You can see a ring around the top of the shoulder. That must be where it’s binding up. I think that if I measure the OAL, pull the bullets (without damaging them), reuse the powder and bullet in a new brass case, and reseat to the same OAL, it would be OK. Anyone see a problem with that?

Click to expand...

Rather than using a different case you could try running those cases through a sizing die and see if it bumps the shoulder back enough. If so then just reload the components back in those cases.

I should have mentioned in my 1st post I,ve downloaded 8x57 Turk surplus for years. Turk is loaded on the hot side. I pull down 1-200 from the same case/lot.. Weigh every 10th round pulled to get a average weight of the whole lot I pulled down. Then reduce by 15%. Much better accuracy and easy recoil. Not a powder puff load by any means but makes for much more enjoyable shooting.