So in my circle of friends/family, I have at LEAST 2 members with weaker grip strength due to health. 1 cannot rack a semi auto slide, the other can for now but is slowly losing that ability, both like my sp101 but favor my stallion, however ballistics and personal preference dictate a .38 to have at least a 4" barrel. Entertaining ar pistols, single 7 vaquero birds heads, gp100s, bisley hammers, etc. Ultimately this is a range gun and home defense, so accurate to 30 ft with proper practice and easy to acquire sight pictures will be ideal. A thunderball .357 has entered my radar but somehow, sights and hammer don't seem to fit the bill. I'm open to whatever feedback/suggestions we can delve into here. Thanks!
Perfect handgun for lighter framed shooters
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An sp101 match champion, or maybe a 686 plus.
An Ar pistol with a brace would probably be a good option, and for a 1 gun fun/defense option probably the best, but its not really a "handgun" if that matters.
Another option might be the M&P ez series. Ive never shot one, but watched an older guy and his wife play with a...380 i think....Neither seemed to have any issues with that little gun.
Im not sure if this would be helpfull, but how bout something like a Canik Tp9sfx? It can take a dot, and comes with a screw in cocking ...thingy. With that extension (or even grabbing the dot which i do sometimes) it cocks very easily for a heavy sprung striker 9.
The stock springs are pretty stiff. It will in fact not run any of the really light ammo i can find here, but replacing the spring would allow you to run lighter loads and make it easier to charge.
An Ar pistol with a brace would probably be a good option, and for a 1 gun fun/defense option probably the best, but its not really a "handgun" if that matters.
Another option might be the M&P ez series. Ive never shot one, but watched an older guy and his wife play with a...380 i think....Neither seemed to have any issues with that little gun.
Im not sure if this would be helpfull, but how bout something like a Canik Tp9sfx? It can take a dot, and comes with a screw in cocking ...thingy. With that extension (or even grabbing the dot which i do sometimes) it cocks very easily for a heavy sprung striker 9.
The stock springs are pretty stiff. It will in fact not run any of the really light ammo i can find here, but replacing the spring would allow you to run lighter loads and make it easier to charge.
That is worth considering I have a tp9 but had not looked further into them thanks!
Eta, so far my tp9 has chewed through over 1000 white boxes and a few defense loads here and there and so far only hiccuped with the Federal champion loads, have some drt 85s I've been meaning to try but not gotten around to it yet lol.
Mines sluggish with the 115 winchesters....they are brown boxes, but i assume its the same thing lol.
It flat out chokes on American eagle 115s, and one other that i cant remember. Its Its run fine on all the 124 and heavier that ive gotten ahold of.
Friend of mind loads a max charge of power pistol behind 124s and it likes those the best.
It flat out chokes on American eagle 115s, and one other that i cant remember. Its Its run fine on all the 124 and heavier that ive gotten ahold of.
Friend of mind loads a max charge of power pistol behind 124s and it likes those the best.
troy fairweather
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There are so many guns to pick from, just have to see what they like and can use now and in the future. Something with a shorter trigger pull is probably good to, seen some with week hands have trouble with that before. Do they have any trouble with cocking a single action revolver.
Loonwulfs canik does look fun with the ff3.
Loonwulfs canik does look fun with the ff3.
Sa revolvers are ok but better with bisley hammers, they've had a chance to play with many types at my house and this is what I've narrowed it down to lol. May be a stupid question, but I've never attempted it, how hard is it to attach a hammer spur to various revolvers?
Further information, it's not the trigger, it's the cocking action that is our dominant concern..... (Loonwulf definitely has my interest on that canik, though with a modified knob as I would for a side charging ar pistol.)
Of all your projects........you let me down man...let me down hard....
Sorry, sorry!...you know hammer guns aint my thang! Actually lemme look around i THINK I made a hammer spur for my muzzle loader let me see if i cant fit it to my SBHOf all your projects........you let me down man...let me down hard....
and here you go, i couldnt find the one i made for my muzzle loader so heres a 5 min rendition.
Ive got big hands, and while i have no issue cocking that gun, letting the hammer down feels way more secure with my thumb joint over the extension.
I could pretty easily build a nice one if you want something like that. id need to know the dimensions on thr spur.
Ive got big hands, and while i have no issue cocking that gun, letting the hammer down feels way more secure with my thumb joint over the extension.
I could pretty easily build a nice one if you want something like that. id need to know the dimensions on thr spur.
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troy fairweather
Member
That's a nice idea, I have short fat thumbs. I have a few spurs in my box but no revolvers here to try them. Should make some and sell them, I can see the news now( device that makes revolver fully semi automatic) lol.
https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1004651974
Been around a while, at least for the Astra .357's, I can't speak to any others. They've been made for other revolver models as well.
Maybe one for all the Enfield Number 2 Mark 1* revolvers would have a market - somewhere tort lawyers don't reside.
Been around a while, at least for the Astra .357's, I can't speak to any others. They've been made for other revolver models as well.
Maybe one for all the Enfield Number 2 Mark 1* revolvers would have a market - somewhere tort lawyers don't reside.
Barry loyd
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A Smith and Wesson model 10 would be a great choice since most of them are 4 inch versions.
Zaydok Allen
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I think for range and home defense the SP101 is a bit limited by it's small size and weight. But a 686+ is a great suggestion IMO. If hand strength is an issue, a good trigger job might help. Depending on arm strength and the ability to hold on target, I think an eight shot 627 would be even better as it will soak up more recoil and gives you an extra round, but the frame may be too big for the folks in question.
I think the S&W ez series is an even better option as capacity goes up and recoil will be reasonable. Throw a threaded barrel and suppressor on it and it's even better.
The OP mentioned AR pistols. If you've never shot one, the muzzle flash and incredible noise they produce is distracting to me, and in an indoor environment would be terrible, even with hearing protection. Personally I think AR pistols are a terrible compromise in almost every way. You get less than stellar (though still effective) rifle ballistics due to the short barrel along with all the other negatives, for what? A 30 round capacity? Ok, well that is a very real benefit, but personally there is no way I'd want to shoot one of those things indoors without a suppressor. I owned one for two years and got rid of it as I felt the benefits did not outweigh the negatives.
Personally I think the sweet spot for a long arm for home defense rests in the pistol caliber carbines that have been chopped down to braced pistol sizes. You increase the velocity of a pistol cartridge that is already considered adequate for home defense, you increase the capacity to that of an AR, and if you throw a suppressor on that you will reduce your disorientation from firing indoors a whole lot.
My next purchase is likely to be a 7 inch CZ Scorpion Evo 3 pistol, with a ridged tail hook. And that might be the one gun I decide to spring for a suppressor on. With a good bullet, 9mm will do the job.
Boarhunter
Member
I suggest either the Smith 9 EZ or 380 EZ. Smith nailed it with this design. The ease of racking the slide and loading the magazine is impressive.
BOARHUNTER
BOARHUNTER
JTQ
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I always follow these "I'm old, weak, small, woman, injured, etc., and what gun to choose" threads, since I'm in my 60's and I'm not a big guy.
I have a 686 and a 1911 as primary shooters and there is no way I'd choose the 686 over the 1911 with my current physical abilities. It may change in the future, but as long as I have the thumb strength and dexterity to work the thumb safety, I'd much rather have the 5-ish pound trigger and shorter trigger reach of the 1911 than the 10-12 ish pound trigger and longer trigger reach of the 686. Lighter weight and more leverage is an advantage to me.
As far as racking the slide, I cock the hammer of the 1911 first, insert a mag, and then rack the slide. It makes slide racking a whole bunch easier than with the hammer down.
If this is just a plinking gun for the range, I can see an advantage for a single action revolver, just to play with, but if I have to use it to defend myself, I'd rather have an auto than a revolver. As a 90 year old, I may have a different answer, but for now, I'd choose the 1911.
I have a 686 and a 1911 as primary shooters and there is no way I'd choose the 686 over the 1911 with my current physical abilities. It may change in the future, but as long as I have the thumb strength and dexterity to work the thumb safety, I'd much rather have the 5-ish pound trigger and shorter trigger reach of the 1911 than the 10-12 ish pound trigger and longer trigger reach of the 686. Lighter weight and more leverage is an advantage to me.
As far as racking the slide, I cock the hammer of the 1911 first, insert a mag, and then rack the slide. It makes slide racking a whole bunch easier than with the hammer down.
If this is just a plinking gun for the range, I can see an advantage for a single action revolver, just to play with, but if I have to use it to defend myself, I'd rather have an auto than a revolver. As a 90 year old, I may have a different answer, but for now, I'd choose the 1911.
Sneakshot92
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crestoncowboy
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There are plenty of slide retraction handles, knobs, grips etc for the more popular semi-autos. if that is something you might look in to. There are also a lot of tip up barrel Berettas in 22, 25, 32 and 380. Can load into the barrel rather than racking the slide for the first shot. Maybe there were more calibers idk. The sights on the smaller ones suck but 30 feet is pretty close. I own a few of the 22 and 25 versions and can hit well past 30 feet even with the poor sights. The model 86 actually has good sights in 380. Not sure about the 32 models. I cant imagine that any rifled barrel gun would give any problems at 10 yards. Even the sorriest darringers I've used were good to that distance.
The idea that revolvers are good for SD for people lacking in grip strength is a bizarre one. It takes a LOT of digital strength to manage a DA trigger pull well. Cocking revolvers is a decidedly non-optimal technique for home defense.
The better answer, IMO, is to figure out how make a semi-auto rackable. Most autos come oversprung from the factory in terms of recoil springs, particularly when it comes to full-sized pistols. That helps ensure that someone who shoots a decent amount but doesn't ever do the appropriate preventative maintenance of changing springs won't have a problem at the 10k round mark, and it may cover up some junky feeding with odd bullet profiles, and it may help save wear and tear on the frame/slide abutments.
But it increases the likelihood of limp-wrist malfunctions and difficulty with slide-racking. For shooters without great digital strength, they're unlikely to rack up the round counts, or provide a sufficiently unyielding platform, to encounter most the problems that a heavy recoil spring is good at staving off. So they're getting little in return for the negatives.
Throw a slide-racker of some sort on there along with a somewhat lighter recoil spring and racking gets way, way easier. Then cock the hammer as suggested above, and it shouldn't be too much for anyone who has enough strength to hang onto the gun in recoil.
ETA: I'd also add that the strong points of revolvers are largely rendered irrelevant in the circumstances being discussed. Revolvers can handle more powerful cartridges than semi-auto's, but that's obviously not a capability you're going to take advantage of if you have hand strength limitations. Revolvers are probably less likely to generate an ND/AD due to poor trigger discipline - but only if you're not cocking the hammer, and, as discussed by others and above, people with poor hand strength aren't going to do well with the DA pull. Revolvers are perhaps less prone to failures in the context of a contact-distance struggle where the assailant (or bear) is physically contacting the gun and potentially interfering with the slide's operation on an auto - but if your hands are too weak to rack a slide and you get into a physical tussle, your gun is going to be taken away from you.
I really like revolvers. I have several and love shooting them. But I really don't think they offer much in this scenario.
The better answer, IMO, is to figure out how make a semi-auto rackable. Most autos come oversprung from the factory in terms of recoil springs, particularly when it comes to full-sized pistols. That helps ensure that someone who shoots a decent amount but doesn't ever do the appropriate preventative maintenance of changing springs won't have a problem at the 10k round mark, and it may cover up some junky feeding with odd bullet profiles, and it may help save wear and tear on the frame/slide abutments.
But it increases the likelihood of limp-wrist malfunctions and difficulty with slide-racking. For shooters without great digital strength, they're unlikely to rack up the round counts, or provide a sufficiently unyielding platform, to encounter most the problems that a heavy recoil spring is good at staving off. So they're getting little in return for the negatives.
Throw a slide-racker of some sort on there along with a somewhat lighter recoil spring and racking gets way, way easier. Then cock the hammer as suggested above, and it shouldn't be too much for anyone who has enough strength to hang onto the gun in recoil.
ETA: I'd also add that the strong points of revolvers are largely rendered irrelevant in the circumstances being discussed. Revolvers can handle more powerful cartridges than semi-auto's, but that's obviously not a capability you're going to take advantage of if you have hand strength limitations. Revolvers are probably less likely to generate an ND/AD due to poor trigger discipline - but only if you're not cocking the hammer, and, as discussed by others and above, people with poor hand strength aren't going to do well with the DA pull. Revolvers are perhaps less prone to failures in the context of a contact-distance struggle where the assailant (or bear) is physically contacting the gun and potentially interfering with the slide's operation on an auto - but if your hands are too weak to rack a slide and you get into a physical tussle, your gun is going to be taken away from you.
I really like revolvers. I have several and love shooting them. But I really don't think they offer much in this scenario.
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bdickens
Member
That's what I'm thinking as well.
I believe most of the issues are with poor technique.
troy fairweather
Member
A friend of my dad is a inventor,he would test things and see how a elderly or weak person could use stuff. He would oil up his hands( think with olive oil) and use his non dominant hand, to test the stuff. Not saying one should go to a gun shop and try it,but maybe try before you clean your gun at home. Maybe it will give a better idea how things work worst case scenario.
The S&W M&P Shield EZ (either 380 or 9) is designed specifically for the situation you describe. While the Shield is a striker, the EZ is hammer, providing a much easier time racking the slide. Other features are also intended to earn the name EZ. Recent American Rifleman
Review: Smith & Wesson M&P9 Shield EZ by Mark Keefe - Thursday, January 30, 2020
describes the details.
Review: Smith & Wesson M&P9 Shield EZ by Mark Keefe - Thursday, January 30, 2020
describes the details.
Vaild points! Mare's leg thoughts?
The ar pistol concept should have been clarified better on my behalf, this WOULD be a suppressed 10.5" sba3 setup. I believe the suppressor indoors would be quite nice, and thus, on a 10.5 barrel still easy to wield.
Jim Watson
Member
My hands are not what they used to be. Recoil is unpleasant and I have gone to lighter loads and lighter recoil springs. The hotshots think USPSA Limited Minor is a dead end but it is what it takes for me to have an enjoyable match. I have setups that let me shoot .45 Minor in IDPA ESP, too.
The overhand push-push slide rack is now my standard and when at home checking a gun before cleaning or packing for the range, I will cock the hammer, if present.
Getting a grip to "sling-shot" the half-slide of my M41 or Kadet is more of a challenge that you might think.
I am OK with a DA revolver or good DA/SA auto.
The overhand push-push slide rack is now my standard and when at home checking a gun before cleaning or packing for the range, I will cock the hammer, if present.
Getting a grip to "sling-shot" the half-slide of my M41 or Kadet is more of a challenge that you might think.
I am OK with a DA revolver or good DA/SA auto.
Hokkmike
Member
A SIG 250 in .380 will rack VERY easily. Holds 15 rounds. Treat the long trigger like a 2 stage and they are GREAT.
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