Velocity is #1 Phase

Absolutely not. Accuracy is all that matters.

Lee Q. Loader said:

Almost every reloader I know, including myself, starts out reloading with their #1 concern for their reloads being "highest velocity possible without sign of overpressure".

Is this your experience?
The reason I ask is i'm in the process of trying to talk a friend "down" from that phase.

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Not really. Most new reloaders I've known, myself included, were Safety #1 for the first several months of reloading, then phased into Consistency #1, Economy #1 (which was a dangerous period for me since when I started pinching pennies safety and consistency went right out the window), THEN came "The Performance Bug." Some folks get stuck there for a long time. F=ma always and everywhere. I tend to concentrate on mass instead of acceleration but both are part of the equation.

I like big bullets, and I cannot lie.

Lee Q. Loader said:

Almost every reloader I know, including myself, starts out reloading with their #1 concern for their reloads being "highest velocity possible without sign of overpressure".

Is this your experience?
The reason I ask is i'm in the process of trying to talk a friend "down" from that phase.

Click to expand...

3.8 grains of tg is a max load for a 38 158 swc. I load and shoot that because it gives me the best accuracy. 4.0 grains of tg in 9mm with the 115 rmr mpr and mmw was the most accurate. It's almost a start load.

Everyone knows safety is third (Mike Rowe reference). Accuracy is number one, velocity is number two, Safety is number three...

Lee Q. Loader said:

Almost every reloader I know, including myself, starts out reloading with their #1 concern for their reloads being "highest velocity possible without sign of overpressure".

Is this your experience?
The reason I ask is i'm in the process of trying to talk a friend "down" from that phase.

Click to expand...

Your friend…. Is misguided
First ya gotta bump the shoulder back.

Lee Q. Loader said:

Almost every reloader I know, including myself, starts out reloading with their #1 concern for their reloads being "highest velocity possible without sign of overpressure".

Is this your experience?
The reason I ask is i'm in the process of trying to talk a friend "down" from that phase.

Click to expand...

I figure the highest velocity accurate load is best. I choose the powder that has the highest velocity. Then look for an accurate load.
Some guns I look for the lowest pressure for the velocity.

AJC1 said:

3.8 grains of tg is a max load for a 38 158 swc. I load and shoot that because it gives me the best accuracy. 4.0 grains of tg in 9mm with the 115 rmr mpr and mmw was the most accurate. It's almost a start load.

Click to expand...

24.4gr. of IMR 4227 under a 300gr. Sierra JSP in a RSBH .44Magnum is an absolute HAMMER of a load but it's kinda hard on aging hands so I backed off to 22.2gr. - which is still a HAMMER of a load but it's more like an Irwin than a Mjollnir.

I want the most speed I can get that will shoot MOA. I'm not worried about squeezing that last 50 fps out of a cartridge, but I do want to at least match published factory velocity. I wouldn't sacrifice 100 fps to turn a 1 MOA rifle into a 3/4 MOA rifle. In the real world, shooting under field conditions, a 1/2 MOA rifle isn't going to be better than a 1 MOA rifle. That only matters on a bench.

For example. Traditionally 2800 fps is about where 150 gr 308 loads fall. If I can match 2800 fps and still shoot MOA I'm good. If I had to go to 2600-2700 fps to get MOA, I'd find another powder. And if I can get closer to 2900 fps and still shoot MOA that is even better.

You goal can be very application dependent.

If your a USPSA/IDPA shooter you want as low a velocity as you can get and still meet the power factor (with whatever safety margin you're comfortable with) for your particular division, assuming your accuracy is acceptable. Reliable feeding in that sport is almost more important than raw accuracy within certain limits.

If you're loading sub sonic ammo for suppressed shooting then you have a fairly hard maximum of ~1050fps if you want a quiet round.

If your reloading for a bench rest gun the accuracy is number one by a larger margin.

If you loading for hunting accuracy is still critical but you might sacrifice a little of that for better terminal effects.

etc

Max velocity was my top priority for a self defense 9mm load I tested a while back. Other than that, I like to keep it middle of the road and shoot for safe and accurate for the application.

I think a lot of people go through that stage. Whether it's the first stage in general, I couldn't say.

For me it was pretty early on, and I got over it pretty quickly - though not quickly enough to avoid beating the daylights out of a few good guns. At some point I decided that, velocity-wise, the goal was to replicate book values, and that if I wanted something faster I should go buy a different gun. That was a few decades ago, and I haven't really changed my mind since then.

For semi-auto's my first goal is the gun must function. Accuracy is goal number two.

Accuracy is goal #1 for revolvers.

Acceptable recoil is also a consideration, someone smaller or less strong may shoot my guns on occasion. I can shoot barn burners in my .480 but don't always have to.

Of course safety is always important.

I don't need much velocity for punching paper or cans at 100yds or less. Others may have different needs.

chris

Lee Q. Loader said:

If I knew for sure that was happening I would sacrifice the 100fps, But I don't think I'm a good enough shooter to know that I've acheived this!

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That is easily tested and proven with a day at the range.

Most accurate load at the highest velocity I can safely reach. I got most of my stupid stunts out of my blood 30 years ago or more, long before I started reloading, and I never was much of a speed freak anyway. So I rarely push my loads up to max. Might actually be costing me some accuracy in the case of magnum handgun loads, but since I don't have an in-person mentor to consult I have tended to err on the side of caution.

mcb said:

You goal can be very application dependent.

If your a USPSA/IDPA shooter you want as low a velocity as you can get and still meet the power factor (with whatever safety margin you're comfortable with) for your particular division, assuming your accuracy is acceptable. Reliable feeding in that sport is almost more important than raw accuracy withing certain limits.

If you're loading sub sonic ammo for suppressed shooting then you have a fairly hard maximum of ~1050fps if you want a quiet round.

If your reloading for a bench rest gun the accuracy is number one by a larger margin.

If you loading for hunting accuracy is still critical but you might sacrifice a little of that for better terminal effects.

etc

Click to expand...

Exactly. The munition must meet the need. Advice is colored by the major discipline of the person giving said advice. In SD and hunting velocity matters because of terminal belistics. Mine could punch a hole in the paper and fall in the dirt and I could care less.

Lee Q. Loader said:

Almost every reloader I know, including myself, starts out reloading with their #1 concern for their reloads being "highest velocity possible without sign of overpressure".

Click to expand...

Sounds like you need to meet a new group of reloaders.

As a few guys have said, it depends on what I'm loading for. In 9mm it has been cycling the action reliably, I'm not great with a pistol, so accuracy kind of is what it is.

In my AR's it has been a reliable, decently accurate load for "blammo ammo" and the best accuracy with good velocity on the heavier 75/77gr loads. For the long range stuff I'm looking for the fastest and most consistently accurate load I can get. I can care less about an inconsistent load at 2850fps when there's a consistent load at 2800fps. I have chased velocity, especially in hunting loads, but have gone to an accurate load at a decent velocity. At the ranges we shoot game at around here 100fps isn't going to make much of a difference in lethality.

I don’t own a chronograph. Once or twice a year I get together with a buddy on his property and use his. I bring my new and favorite loads to try out just so I know. My goal has always been making a safe and accurate loading as economic as possible. I have become pretty good at being able to guesstimate without a chronograph. And to be honest if a round shoots good I really don’t care about 10 or 20 fps.

Nope. #1 Accuracy. #2 Reliability. #3 Velocity threshold for a particular bullet...

I can definitely remember being in a similar phase. If I go back 30 years ago, I was reloading for a cheap surplus rifle and 12 gauge and I wanted "moar power!" I didn't have a real purpose. I can remember packing shells with so much powder it would blow out and dust the range. Fortunately it was a slow powder (because of higher published velocities) so I didn't blow myself up. I sure loosened that Mossberg up though.

I got a purpose when I started carrying, and when I started hunting. I started carrying 38 Special and it can be a little weak, so I was chasing velocity for a bit. Without it, the cartridge has sub-par penetration and expansion.
When I switched to 357 Magnum, the highest-velocity loads did not serve my purpose. There was too much recoil and it was no good for fighting. No one taking handgun combat seriously is chasing magnum velocities. For handgun hunting, maybe. I'm not doing that. I hunt with a rifle. Put a game-animal photo target out at 250 or 300 yards and check the results. Chances are you'll start focusing on accuracy and velocity won't be a concern. While most of the inaccuracy will be a result of skill, if you're reloads aren't meticulous, you can easily have a 6" group at a few hundred yards with everything else being perfect.

So what purpose does the friend reload for?

Lee Q. Loader said:

Almost every reloader I know, including myself, starts out reloading with their #1 concern for their reloads being "highest velocity possible without sign of overpressure".

Is this your experience?
The reason I ask is i'm in the process of trying to talk a friend "down" from that phase.

Click to expand...

Yeah. When I started reading at age 17, my quest was focused on velocity.

On an "overgrown" pistol round like .30 Carbine pretty much precluded much in the way of velocity growth.

But my epiphany came at my Grandfather's funeral when one of friends (who had likewise been a marksmanship instructor at Ft. Benning during WWII) enlightened me.

"Hits count"!

After that, my focus turned to accuracy - and particularly accuracy across all the platforms for which I reloads.

For me, it's has been cost, quantity and availability.

I started at 18 with a .44mag (cost) quickly aquired a hi-cap 9mm (quantity) and have lived through numerous ammo "droughts" (availability) when I could continue to shoot as much as I wanted with no concern about replacing it.

I've never owned a chronograph and have no interest in getting one.