Prepared for the shock?

Skills-based and scenario-based Force on Force training. Nothing is better for improving and testing decision making under stress.

The military theme of "Train like you fight" comes to mind. Try some Sim or airsoft to keep the brain engaged under stress.

The military theme of "Train like you fight" comes to mind.

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They told me this at Thunder Ranch. I told them that I can't pee that much to make the training effective.

You might find the following book an interesting bit of reading ...

Force Under Pressure
How Cops Live And Why They Die
Lawrence N. Blum, Ph.D.

If you make your reactions muscle memory, and then practice them under limited stress (i.e. a stress shoot, etc.) your body should do what it knows during a real fight.

I think that I have an idea what the OP is saying.

Practice, even FoF, is good - but you enter it knowing that you're entering it. You are prepared for it. But your body and mind will betray you when you are unprepared.

I have been accosted with a deadly weapon on a few occasions in my life. Several times, the violence was completely unexpected and from an unseen quarter. In those examples, my mind/body REFUSED to accept the situation for a period of several seconds. I was essentially paralyzed. Not with fear, but with a rejection of the situation. Once that instant of shock cleared, I was free to react (and I did well enough that I lived).

Many confrontations are escalating affairs, and in those situations (noises in the night, being followed, etc.) we enter the confrontation already 'peaked'. We are ready to go.

But how do you train your mind to REACT when the confrontation is without prior escalation?

match induced stress

Competitive shooting introduces an element of psychological and physical stress that is not found in a leisurely practice or plinking session. Heart rate goes up that's for sure. The mind wants to wander, or it wants to get it over with. There are distractions. There's a temptation to rush a shot or to not follow through. Over a long match on a hot or cold day, fatigue sets in.

Maybe an important match replicates, over a period of many hours or days, some of the instant effects of a SD situation? Certainly, I can imagine that a surprise SD situation, with its threat of imminent death or bodily harm, is several orders of magnitude tougher to handle.

Nonetheless, I think match stress can round out one's preparation and training.

To me a match is about 1/3 the stress of the real thing, but even practice with 1/3 the stress is better than practice with no stress.

I agree and so I recommend stepping the consequences up a notch.

Sim rounds move fast and will leave welts or even break skin at close ranges. People will ofter wear long sleeve shirts and such to protect themselves.

I don't.

I've watched the guys who are well protected do stupid things (like charge a barricaded position) that you wouldn't normally want to do.

When I train, by not wearing high levels of protection, I am really, HONESTLY, trying to not get shot. As far as I'm concerned, not getting shot places higher than shooting the other guy.

well, there you go playstation/ wii/ xbox programmers. create a game that us ccw guys could practice on. with the element of suprise very realisticly added into it. it is one thing to shoot, and another thing practicing situations. better yet would be a simulator machine that would be sold to or rented to gun clubs and the like. where the booth closes and you have 360 degree surround video/sound to simulate actual conditions. average joe could not afford one. but a good sized gun club could. charge $20.00 for 5 minutes. something like that.

Nothing can simulate walking down a relatively crowded urban street and having someone step forward from the crowd to physically and verbally accost you.

The question is how to shift into fight-or-flight quickly and minimize the tendency to freeze at the incongruity. Short of engaging in all sorts of confrontations as a matter of course, or having our own Cato Fong leap out at us unexpectedly to test our reactions, I do not know how to do so.

All I can say is that your mental and physical reactions to intense stress are much more important than your abilities with a firearm. Airsoft is all you need for good force on force practice. Force on force practice is not nearly as important as having clear thinking and decision making skills.

Try doing some things that will get your adrenaline pumping. Go white-water rafting, rock climb, etc. In an emergency situation, stay focused on what you have to do and what the people around you have to do. When I've been in emergency situations, I have been able to keep my cool by helping the people around me. If I'm concerned about you, I'm not focused on me. Concern yourself with the task at hand. Focusing on how you feel or how scared you are is not going to help you manage the stress.

The best way to prepare for this, like I said, is to get your adrenaline going. One thing that you can do is to start speaking your mind. We are very polite and non-confrontational by nature, so when you hear a co-worker talking about something political that you disagree with, speak up. Confrontation in a safe environment where only your pride is on the line is a great way to build your ability to handle more serious confrontation. Now I'm not saying you should go around being a jerk and starting fights. But debate with people and have friendly arguements. Pair that with actual adrenaline dumping experiences, and you will have a good foundation for good judgement under pressure.

Of course good shooting practice is good too, but it's only one factor. Take my advice with a grain of salt. Don't get yourself fired or anything and don't go drowning yourself in a river.

From Massad Ayoob in "Combat Handgunnery" --

First thing that goes is muscle control. It's REALLY easy to pull the trigger by accident.

So you train "presentation" to "point" and NOT "to shoot." If you train to present and shoot, you'll reflexively pull the trigger in a crisis situation. You want to be deliberate about pulling the trigger, not "reflexive."

Practice "presentation" -- It's more complicated than it seems.

Spend some time "point shooting" -- from about 20 feet, 7 yds/paces. That's the nominal "engagement distance." You should be able to point and hit center of mass w/o having to physically line up a sight picture.

If you go through the steps, deliberate, regularly, often, you'll develop a "physical memory" of the movement which will over-ride the anxiety.

Post confrontation adrenaline runs for hours. Don't try to drive.

Mindset.

And perhaps the best way to overcome the rational fear of getting killed, is to be cold and agressive; out of the rational fear that panic and paralysis will significantly increase the chances of getting killed.

Look at it as being in a house on fire with the hallway in flames. You know the door is there, but the rational fear of getting burned is forefront. The greater rational fear of staying there and dying should induce a careful, measured dash through the flames to get out the door. Without slipping, avoiding any obstacles as they appear and opening the door first time.

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http://gtr5.com
http://ssuntedstates.com

A couple years ago, I heard that car accident victims have the same type thing - after the "Bang," their body locks up with a combination of an adrenaline dump and the mind refusing to accept the situation. I thought that was a load of fertilizer until I got hit. Lemme tell ya, I'm a fairly big, tough guy and after the BOS hit & ran, I stood there, stammering like a jackhammer. The cop who showed up got nothing out of me - I made no sense. I was so appalled that this guy hit ME and then the adrenaline kicked in and I was shaking so badly the cop asked me if I was on anything. Fortunately, that died a pretty quick death...

The 2nd time I was in an auto accident, I was calm, rational, and competely aware of the entire situation. While I still had the adrenaline dump, my reactions weren't so "spazmatic." A little muscle tremor, but nothing like the first time.

Cops (et. al.) are now using this kind of training - running FoF simulations where they get shot by airsoft weapons. This way they get that sensation of being shot and learn what happens to their bodies and their reactions. They run the drill again, again being shot. It hurts a little, but it prepares the mind & body for "what will happen."

Q

Nothing like CQB or jungle senario paintball to get adrenaline pumping. Do a local search on paintball feilds in your area. Most of the better ones will have rentals if you do not have equipment.

I think the keys to handling the stress of a "defensive" situation are preparation and repetition. There are some good non-shooting drills available and you can do them anytime and just about anywhere you have privacy and room to move; we did some really useful drills in our PPITH/PPOTH classes although some drills require a partner. Point is, drills involving drawing a firearm - sweeping away a garment, hand on gun, drawing, extending - become burned in after time. The body and mind begin to act reflexively and smoothly. The idea is that the burden of those gross movements becomes less significant in a defensive situation allowing the body and mind to deal with other things at hand.

I'm sure there are better shooters than me that can offer good drills but dig into the NRA PPITH and PPOTH literature. There are some decent drills there.

Cops (et. al.) are now using this kind of training - running FoF simulations where they get shot by airsoft weapons. This way they get that sensation of being shot and learn what happens to their bodies and their reactions. They run the drill again, again being shot. It hurts a little, but it prepares the mind & body for "what will happen."

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I've been shot with an airsoft gun and a real gun. My reaction was very different to the latter.

shock and awe

AdamS:

This is a side note; but connects with the thread topic.

I advocate the deep crouch Weaver stance in shooting for self defense, just because of the "intense shock" of not only facing some one shooting at you, but also the physical and mental shock -should you be struck with their bullet and yet remain in the fight for your life.

The other stance, the Isosceles {SP?}, gives a balance of your torso; upper body that with the slightest off balance, then requires a swaying, rebalancing back to balanced posture. Take a look at the range sometime, of shooters in the Isoceles stance. They have their shoulders and head arched back, their stomachs thrust forward, and their feet on line, parallel to each other. Weak. The "shock" of combat or recognition of being wounded, while in that posture does not lead to a rapid recovery of physical or mental stability. And all this while you are attempting to keep a sight picture and trigger control.

The fraction of a second loss can mean the difference between a return fire, or continue to fire and missing that precious moment you have maintain your aim, or re-aim and shoot.

The Weaver is more stable and therefore less vunerable to off balance and balance recovery than the isosceles provides.

And, as written here on THR, you will do in reflex as you have been training to do.

A Disclaim: No, I'm not attempting to incite argument for the best stance in shooting.

I am a big advocate of Airsoft for FOF training. I think it's great that most production guns are available in airsoft(minus the XD ), allowing for much safer and effective training. Plus it's fun!

I am a big advocate of Airsoft for FOF training. I think it's great that most production guns are available in airsoft(minus the XD ), allowing for much safer and effective training. Plus it's fun!

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Don't get me wrong, Airsoft is great for FOF training. I was responding to the suggestion that it helps to simulate what it is like to be shot. I have been shot with both, and no. It does not in any way simulate actualy being shot. It simulates a lot of other great things, but that is not one of them.

I'm not police or military, and I've never been in a gunfight. My only experience that relates to your question is having competed in boxing and submission grappling.

Every fight I've ever had (in the ring/on the mats-- not on the street) I've been as prepared for as anybody could be, both in terms of conditioning and in terms of how many hundreds or thousands of rounds I've done training full contact with very good fighters. What I've found: unfortunately nothing has ever prepared me for the adrenaline and the twisted-up stomach I feel when I'm standing in my corner in front of a crowd, waiting for the action to start, wondering if this will be the time that I get seriously injured, humiliated, etc.

But as soon as the bell rings and the fight starts, a funny thing happens: it's like my mind gets shut off and suddenly what I'm doing is really no different from what I've done so many times before. I stop hearing the crowd, and think of only the moment I'm in, and everything becomes automatic.

However, I also always run out of gas a lot faster in a fight than I do in even the hardest sparring, which means I'm not as relaxed as I should be. Higher levels of muscular tension suck the oxygen right out of my blood. I have never once felt that I've performed up to my potential in a fight-- it's like I regress a year or two every time, losing maybe 30% of the skill level I walked in with. It's frustrating. I know of no way around it.

As they say, you don't rise to the occasion, you fall to the level of your training. (Something like that, anyway.) In my experience, you don't even get to function at the level of your training-- you fall to, at least in my case, 70% or so of your training.

One interesting thing I've seen recommended and tried myself a few times: next time you're at a range that will allow it, try dropping and doing 20 push-ups and immediately pop up and start firing. I've also tried running uphill sprints in National Forest out in the Sierras and then shooting. It's amazing how much your own heartbeat will move the handgun/ rifle/ shotgun around, and how close you come to that feeling of tunnel vision when you're sucking wind. Give it a shot.

Everybody else on here w/ real combat experience and training has much better advice for you, but that's the best I can offer. Since you're going to revert to a level even lower than whatever your training is, you'd better train hard and train often!

Shay hit it with the first response. While it won't completely simulate the real deal it comes closer than anything else. Especially if you're all allowed to go hands-on along the lines of ECQC.

Regarding a previous post on Weaver/Iso: You're comparing apples to oranges. A fighting Iso will not only be more stable than the poorly trained shooters mentioned, it also allows you to keep your balance if you go hands on. When was the last time you saw a lineman or a boxer in a Weaver-esque stance? You give up your hips in a Weaver & that's a bad place to be.

Shay said it in his response. Seek out good, well-planned force on force exercises focused on the goal of presenting the student with the mental problem.

Sims and Airsoft guns can be and are used to teach the skill of shooting at a moving, responsive target. But the value of the human dynamic in FoF is the social interaction. Go take a FoF class; it will change how you see the problem. It's not a shooting problem, it's a thinking problem.

Yes, FoF training is planned. And we enter the scenario in a different mental state than when problems come at us unexpectantly. The folks I've talked to who have both been in actual fights and went through FoF exercises always said the stress levels associated with the built up anticipation of waiting for "their turn" in the exercise were higher than what they felt in those unexpected, actual fights.


Some just plain freeze when they're first exposed to situations like these, even in a role playing exercise. That's nothing to be embarrased about. The reason why role-playing exercises are important is we learn about ourselves. And then we can teach ourselves how to break through obstacles like panic.