How much do autoloaders reduce recoil?

The cycling of the autoloader's action kind of slows and spreads out the recoil impulse. My Remington 1100 is considerably (but not prohibitively) heavier than an 870, so a good deal of recoil is being soaked up by the gun's weight vs. a pump. Using low- to medium-base hunting or target loads, you may not realize enough of a difference to justify the extra money to purchase an auto.

There sure seem to be a bunch of recoil-sensitive aspiring shotgunners out there!

My Winchester 1400 is sweet. The higher pressure the load, the more the affect on FELT recoil, not actual recoil. It's a 2 3/4" gun, but I use it a lot for duck hunting with 2 3/4" high brass fasteel loads that pack quite a punch and I din't even have a recoil pad on the gun, don't need it. It's a light gun, too, lighter than an 1100 OR probably the 870 since it has an aluminum receiver. One help, too, is the gun fit me perfectly right out of the box.

Some semi autos reduce the peak recoil force. Total recoil force is a product of what's going out the other end, and cannot be reduced per se. Gun weight plays a major factor in the results.
A gas semi auto will definitely spread out the peak recoil force, as the gas action creates forces pushing the rest of the gun forward during part of the cycle. A Remington 1100 is one of the best at this due to the rather heavy steel action sleeve.
A recoil operated auto set up correctly will moderate recoil a little by the friction piece dragging and compressing the action spring.
An inertia action does almost nothing to reduce peak recoil as the receiver and everything else except the back of the bolt has to move rapidly to the rear to compress the spring in the bolt. They did not invent those two piece stocks for nothing.
All in all, if you are looking to get the least peak recoil, a gas semi auto is a good start. Now all the inertia aficionados can chime in about gun fit, and it does have an impact, but reducing the peak recoil force is the most important factor to my mind. You will note that the semi autos one sees clay shooting where hundreds of rounds are likely to be fired are almost exclusively gas operated.

BTW, comparing .308 to .30-06 is apples and oranges vs recoil. The 06 packs more powder into the case which factors into the recoil force equation. I have a very light Remington M7 in .308 and the recoil isn't that bad. It's a very light rifle, lighter than an H&K 91. A gun that light in .30-06 would be a punisher.

Sorry, but the recoil component due to the gasses exiting the barrel is very minor compared to the bullet, or shot, etc., and only the difference between gas streams is diminished further still. A .30-06 and a .308 shooting the same weight bullet at the same velocity out of the exact same weight gun will have identical recoil for practical purposes. I don't have the energy to look up the recoil formula right now, but you can check it.

felt

The higher pressure the load, the more the affect on FELT recoil

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Please explain that one to me. Is the recoil pulse faster? Maybe the recoil velocity of the firearm? I ask because no formula that I know of includes a "pressure" element as part of the calculation for free recoil. There is no formula for felt recoil.
Do the higher pressure loads produce more velocity? That would have an effect on free recoil and perhaps on felt recoil.
Felt recoil is normally a function of elements that are "extra-ballistic".....shooter experience with recoil, how the shooter holds the gun, shooter anatomy, clothing, gun fit/stock shape, barrel length/muzzleblast.
The one variable that I can see that might affect felt recoil is if the higher pressure results in an increase in the recoil velocity of the gun (all other things being equal...???)

The .308/.30-06 comparison......the powder charge weight difference between the two is about five grains on average. The result is that the .30-06 gets more velocity, though at lower peak pressure (using IMR 4064 as a benchmark).


Pete

I am a bit disappointed by those answers, I thought (correctly fitting) semis were the cure to perceived recoil. Did I not read something about the Beretta A400 Xtreme soaking up most of it right here on THR? Would anybody who owns one care to enlighten us regarding its felt recoil when compared to a good old side by side or pump action shotgun?

That being said, if HD is OP's main preoccupation and a shotgun's recoil is perceived as an important obstacle, I might suggest looking into an AR in 5.56mm instead. Some .223 HD rounds are very interesting. My personal preference would still be the 12 gauge using 00 buckshot, but I am neither old nor bothered by recoil so much, I already own a 12 gauge, and owning an AR would prove both complicated an expensive up here.

Getting back to topic, my dads 20gauge 870 is a sweet shooter, barly any recoil. My mossberg 500 12 really isn't that bad either. My suggestion is trying some managed recoil loads of home defence loads and see if you can manage them. But a shotgun spread inside house distances isn't going to be all that dramatic and barrel length doesn't really effect spread like a lot of people think, longer barrels do help a little with recoil but not much also. ATI also make stock with a pretty decent buttpad and I think somwhere you can buy a stock with a spring in it to reduce over all recoil.

For home defense, Remington's VersaMax Tactical will be the softest shooting making a 12ga round feel more like a 20ga. It features a Nordic extended mag tube, Nordic bolt release and barrel clamp. Barrel is 22" vented with fiber optic front sight. The VersaMax's are popular with 3Gun....ie. Daniel Horner.
I got mine in zombie green.

750 rounds without even a hiccup. Shoots STS Nitros as well as cheap Walmart promotional shells.
The ability to run any type of shell was the main reason I bought it. I got the zombie model because Bud's had them on sale.

Comes with an extended tactical choke for blowing off door hinges.

A .30-06 and a .308 shooting the same weight bullet at the same velocity out of the exact same weight gun will have identical recoil for practical purposes. I don't have the energy to look up the recoil formula right now, but you can check it.

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The 308 would still have about 17% less recoil, about 15 ft lbs of recoil vs about 18 ft lbs from 8 lb guns. A 308 can get the same speeds with 150 gr bullets with about 47 gr of powder where a 30-06 needs about 61 gr of powder. That 14 gr of extra powder has to be added to the bullet weight. It would be like shooting a 165 gr bullet at the same speed as a 150 gr bullet. In the real world the 30-06 will be about 100 fps faster, so you end up with about 25% more recoil to gain about 100 fps.

Short answer on shotguns. Using the same loads with same weight guns the ACTUAL recoil will be exactly the same with any gun. A heavier gun will reduce the ACTUAL recoil.

With pumps, doubles, most single shots, or inertia operated semi's the recoil hits you within a very short time period. A gas operated semi reduces ACTUAL recoil because they tend to be heavier. They also reduce FELT recoil because the recoil is spread out over a longer period of time. It is only a fraction of a second difference, but is enough to be noticeable.

Combined with a heavier gun most folks find a gas operated gun to be the most comfortable to shoot. But if you select a very light gas gun, you could offset any benefits of the gas system and still get a hard kicking gun. A heavy pump, inertia gun or double could in fact recoil less than a light gas gun.

Fit does play a role, but it is impossible to measure since everyone is different.

A quality recoil pad does essentially the same thing as a gas operated gun. It spreads out the recoil reaching your body over a slightly longer period of time.

Muzzle breaks redirect some of the gasses leaving the muzzle and do reduce the amount of recoil. They also redirect the noise, making the guns much louder.

OTTO- seriously?
WOW

OP - IF the semi weighs the same as the O/U, there will be ZERO reduction in actual recoil; the gas action will elongate the recoil pulse in a few milliseconds the make the perceived recoil a little less

Sorry, but the recoil component due to the gasses exiting the barrel is very minor compared to the bullet, or shot, etc., and only the difference between gas streams is diminished further still. A .30-06 and a .308 shooting the same weight bullet at the same velocity out of the exact same weight gun will have identical recoil for practical purposes. I don't have the energy to look up the recoil formula right now, but you can check it.

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http://www.saami.org/PubResources/GunRecoilFormulae.pdf

Charge weight of powder (actually, ejected gases) seems pretty important to me. It is a linear relationship, nothing exponential in the equation. No, it's not superfluous. Working pressure of the round has NOTHING to do with recoil, just the weight of the mass headed out the end of the barrel and its velocity. Figuring a 150 grain bullet and 45-50 grains of powder vs 150 grain bullet with 58-60 grains of powder, velocity pretty equal, recoil force is going to be about 5 percent lighter .308 vs .30-06 given equal gun weights. Perhaps you consider that superfluous, but it's real and it can be felt by the shooter.

You'll find calculations for shotgun recoil on the site listed.

Yep, I consider that superfluous. So we agree, except for the definition of significant.

I have ever used was my grandma's double barrel 12 gauge. I hated that gun. As a 12 year old it really hurt.

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Excessive Drop probably have more effect on recoil than the bore size.

When I was 12 I killed my first rabbit with my Dad's model 50 Winchester, at 8-1/4# it's heavy but it's also a very mid recoiling 12 gauge. I was a big kid but toting that gun in the uplands was a chore so when I got a 7-1/4 # SXS I thought I had it made, now that I'm less mobile a 12 gauge SXS that weighs 7-1/2# is what I use for buck, heavy field loads and slugs.

Weight matters and defining your needs will determine weight, go as heavy as needed or go smaller bore.

The heaviest gun with the lightest load will administer the lowest recoil. That same gun if it fits properly, will also deliver the lowest felt recoil (AKA "kick"). Elongate the recoil pulse with a gas action and it drops a little more of the perceived recoil

It makes a big difference! I shot on o/u for years then tried an autoloader. Haven't shot the o/u since. There is a significant difference in recoil.

I have shot many a shotgun, and yes semi autos in general shoot much softer than pumps or doubles. My father is in the same shape as the OP. A benelli 20 was the answer for him. I, myself opted for a Berretta 3901 and have'nt looked back. Still hold a soft spot for my old Ithica 37, but the auto goes with me into the field these days.

Gas guns kick noticeably less then pumps, doubles, or Benelli's recoil system.

I bought a Benelli Black Eagle several years ago to replace my old Browning A5 as a turkey gun.

That sucker kicked much harder then my A5, and right up there with the hardest kicking shotgun I ever owned.

It went down the road after the first season.

You Beretta 390 or Rem 1100 is a much softer shooting gun.

rc

I was seriously considering Super Black Eagle 1, the one H&K was importing, back in the day. 3-1/2" shells sounded interesting with steel. A bud had one, and he let me shoot it a lot. Fit good, looked good. With 3" Magnums it kicked, but livable, and I could shoot it real well. Then I tried some 3-1/2 inchers. Holy mackerel, that was the worst kicking shotgun I have ever shot. It was worse than the Mossberg 535 pump or whatever number it was. I was shooting a specially lightened (as in machined) BPS 10 gauge at the time so I was no stranger to recoil.
Thank God for tungsten. I went back to a 3" 12 and never looked back.

That would be due to the 1100 weighing about a pound more than the Benelli. HEAVY guns with LIGHT loads equal lower recoil. Go the opposite way and you can do some serious damage to your shoulder and elsewhere