30-06 Accuracy Load

[lastofthebreed]

Having recently purchased a Browning BAR in 30-06, I turned to the combined knowledge embodied in this forum for an accuracy load that pretty well duplicated factory ballistics in the BAR.

Acting on advice from Browning, I bought an RCBS small base sizing die.

After resizing and trimming a batch of once fired Winchester brass, I proceeded to prime each case with W/W large rifle primers and charged them with 52 gr. of IMR 4064 powder. I topped each case off with a Hornady 150 gr. Interlock bullet seated to a depth that fits the BAR magazine with just a touch of room to spare and went to the range.

I had already zeroed the rifle at 100 yds using Winchester factory ammo so I felt comfortable setting my first target up at 200 yds. I wound up with a 2 inch, 5 shot group with my first 5 shots.

Subsequent groups opened up just a bit, maybe the barrel got a little warm? Suffice to say, I am happy.

Thanks to all you guys for getting me on the right track, the first time.

 

[Galil5.56]

That is some good shooting! I have used almost that exact loading, going back many years. They fly true, but the bullet seems to be very lightly constructed at stout velocities. Use the same IMR 4064 for 165 gr bullets, with very accurate results as well. Again, great shooting.

 

[Jack B.]

Having recently purchased a Browning BAR in 30-06, I turned to the combined knowledge embodied in this forum for an accuracy load that pretty well duplicated factory ballistics in the BAR.

Acting on advice from Browning, I bought an RCBS small base sizing die.

After resizing and trimming a batch of once fired Winchester brass, I proceeded to prime each case with W/W large rifle primers and charged them with 52 gr. of IMR 4064 powder. I topped each case off with a Hornady 150 gr. Interlock bullet seated to a depth that fits the BAR magazine with just a touch of room to spare and went to the range.

I had already zeroed the rifle at 100 yds using Winchester factory ammo so I felt comfortable setting my first target up at 200 yds. I wound up with a 2 inch, 5 shot group with my first 5 shots.

Subsequent groups opened up just a bit, maybe the barrel got a little warm? Suffice to say, I am happy.

Thanks to all you guys for getting me on the right track, the first time.

Sounds exactly like my favorite .30-06 loads. I get my best accuracy with IMR 4064 and Hornady 150gr Intrlock bullets. Hodgdon Varget loaded to about the same fps. is pretty good also.

 

[gojones]

I too am a fan of IMR 4064 with 150 and 165 grain Hornady bullets. I have been using this for 30-06 for over 40 years. Just no need to keep looking for better combo because I don't have the ability or equipment to shoot better. Great for hunting deer.

 

[Slamfire]

Ain't it great not to have to re invent the wheel? When I started competive shooting I asked the good shooters for load data for the 308 Win and the 30-06. Their recommended loads I have now used for decades, and they shoot well, shoot well enough that if the rifle does not shoot them, there is something wrong with the rifle!

As an example, 47.0 grains IMR 4895 is an excellent target load in the 30-06, shoots well in darn near everything. It is not a magnum load by any means, but it is accurate, in a Garand:



Or in a M70 standard weight rifle:

 

[sage5907]

Yes, it's great not to reinvent the wheel. I have two favorite 30-06 150 grain loads and one of them is with 51 grains of IMR 4064. One of my rifles likes 52 grains of IMR 4064 just a little better. My best accuracy load with 150 grain bullets is 57 grains of Reloader 17. I stumbled on this powder while doing accuracy testing and I was surprised and amazed at how well it shoots. In 50 years of rifle shooting Reloader 17 has been one of the best things that has happened to me. I quickly became my favorite powder and it has close to the same point of impact at 200 meters as does IMR 4064.

 

[Jack B.]

Yes, it's great not to reinvent the wheel. I have two favorite 30-06 150 grain loads and one of them is with 51 grains of IMR 4064. One of my rifles likes 52 grains of IMR 4064 just a little better. My best accuracy load with 150 grain bullets is 57 grains of Reloader 17. I stumbled on this powder while doing accuracy testing and I was surprised and amazed at how well it shoots. In 50 years of rifle shooting Reloader 17 has been one of the best things that has happened to me. I quickly became my favorite powder and it has close to the same point of impact at 200 meters as does IMR 4064.

Been wanting to try Reloader 17. I've have been a Alliant pistol powder fan for many years. When I first started reloading Hercules Powder was the only powder I could get.

 

[gojones]

Yes, it's great not to reinvent the wheel. I have two favorite 30-06 150 grain loads and one of them is with 51 grains of IMR 4064. One of my rifles likes 52 grains of IMR 4064 just a little better. My best accuracy load with 150 grain bullets is 57 grains of Reloader 17. I stumbled on this powder while doing accuracy testing and I was surprised and amazed at how well it shoots. In 50 years of rifle shooting Reloader 17 has been one of the best things that has happened to me. I quickly became my favorite powder and it has close to the same point of impact at 200 meters as does IMR 4064.

I have a new jug of RL17 just for the 30-06. One day I am going to work up a load to see if it is better than IMR 4064. I have read this too many times not to be tempted.

 

[Swampman]

I'm glad that things went well and that the load shot accurately for you.

I would however, advise that in the future you start low and work up in increments. I'm not saying that a full work-up is needed when you have a suggested charge weight as your goal , but loading and firing at least a couple of rounds in half-grain (or smaller depending on what round you're working with) increments as you raise the charge weight isn't just a good idea, it's a fundamental rule of reloading safety.

Current Hodgdon/IMR data shows 51 grains of IMR 4064 as max with a 150 grain bullet. Their suggested starting load is 47 grains.

 

[Nature Boy]

I’m wondering if service rifle (Garand) load data might be a safer place to start since the OP is loading for a gas operated semi auto BAR.

My assumption being the limitations of that rifle regarding pressures are likely different than a bolt action, i.e. faster powders would be better than slower

 

[ArchAngelCD]

I own and load for an M1 Garand, a 1903A3 Springfield and a Model of 1917 and I use a lot more 4895 than 4064. There is nothing wrong with 4064 it's just that I prefer 4895 for my M1 ammo and use the same ammo in all my US military rifles.

With a 150gr bullet I charge 46.4gr of H4895 or 47.0gr of IMR4895 and both shoot very well for me in my rifles.

 

[Blue68f100]

I’m wondering if service rifle (Garand) load data might be a safer place to start since the OP is loading for a gas operated semi auto BAR.

My assumption being the limitations of that rifle regarding pressures are likely different than a bolt action, i.e. faster powders would be better than slower

BAR's normally like std full power ammo. Browning controls the bolt so well it's like it's in slow motion compared to an AR.

I've been working up loads for a Rem 7400 and 742 in 30.06 . These guns are a blow back design and are way over gassed in my opinion. I've elected to use the slower powders to keep the bolt speed down. Most of my loads are compressed going this way but it has worked for me. The 742's are a major problem due to the cheap soft steel the receivers are made from. The barrels rust very easy too, which is a problem in the area I live in. It averages 60% + on the humidity most of the time. Just got a cylinder hone in to polish the chambers up. Hopefully to remedy the problem of it ripping the rim off the brass. Currently I have to lube the bullets to prevent this due to roughness in the chambers.

 

[eastbank]

my load for a Remington 7600 in 3006 is 55grs of imr-4350 with a 165gr nosler BT, it may not be ok in a auto loader, eastbank.

 

[Swampman]

I've been working up loads for a Rem 7400 and 742 in 30.06 . These guns are a blow back design and are way over gassed in my opinion. I've elected to use the slower powders to keep the bolt speed down. Most of my loads are compressed going this way but it has worked for me.

The Remington 742 and 7400 are NOT blowback designs, they are definitely gas operated.

I've only loaded for a few Remington gas operated semi auto rifles, but I found that the same powders that worked well in the Garand and M1A worked well in them. IMR 4895 and 4064 gave good accuracy and decent velocity without beating the gun to death.

In my opinion, using slower powders in an attempt to keep bolt speed down in a semi auto gas operated rifle probably isn't the best option available, in fact, it's almost guaranteed to do just the opposite.

Bolt velocity in a gas gun isn't determined by chamber pressure so much as it is gas port pressure. The reason 4350 can give higher muzzle velocities than 4895 is because it keeps pushing the bullet longer as it goes down the barrel.

This means that pressure in the barrel stays higher, further down the barrel than it does with faster powders. That means that when the bullet passes the gas port and allows gas to start working the action, there's more pressure and thus more energy available to cycle the action, which means that the bolt will be cycled faster, even though the powder itself has a slower burn rate.

As I said, I don't have a lot of experience working up loads for Remington semi autos, mainly I've just loaded hunting ammo for friend's rifles. I can say that I haven't seen anything about them that contradicts accepted norms for loading gas operated high power rifles.

 

[Slamfire]

Bolt velocity in a gas gun isn't determined by chamber pressure so much as it is gas port pressure. The reason 4350 can give higher muzzle velocities than 4895 is because it keeps pushing the bullet longer as it goes down the barrel.

Very true. As a general rule,for gas guns, it is better to use faster powders than slower powders. You want the pressure to drop quickly as the bolt is opening. I think IMR 4350 is too slow for a gas gun, tried it in a 30-06 Garand with a gas vent cylinder lock and even with the gas vent cylinder lock, it was hard on the rifle.

For a 30-06 or 308 Win gas gun, I can recommend IMR 3031, (the fastest I would go) the "standard" is IMR 4895 (or AA2495 or H4895), and the slowest is IMR 4064. The 308 cartridge was developed with IMR 4895 and the powder used in 30-06 WW2 ball was IMR 4895. Those are good, safe choices. The pressure drops and the bolt is not over accelerated as it would be with a slower burning powder. The next thing to do is keep your pressures down, don't try to match maximum bolt gun velocities. I am of the opinion that the Rem M742 rifles will work fine with a 150 grain bullet just at 2700 fps, which is a ball ammunition duplicate. Pushing bullets faster will be hard on the recoiling parts of the mechanism.

I recently purchased new IMR 3031, the last stuff I used was from the 1970's, and the powder has changed. It used to be a long grained powder, now it is a short cut which throws better. IMR 3031 dates back prior to WW2, sometimes in the late 1930's, and it was a popular powder in 30-06 match loads.

 

[gojones]

I have a Remington 760 (pump action) that I acquired in the 70's from my dad. I started out using IMR 3031 but ultimately settled on IMR 4064. For some reason this gave me my best accuracy at less than maximum velocity for Hornady 150 grain SP. Most of my hunting with this gun was done in the 70's and 80's. My son has it now. Was pleasant to shoot and easy to handle in the woods. I think I settled on 47.5 grains of IMR 4064 if memory serves me.

 

[Blue68f100]

The Remington 742 and 7400 are NOT blowback designs, they are definitely gas operated.

I've only loaded for a few Remington gas operated semi auto rifles, but I found that the same powders that worked well in the Garand and M1A worked well in them. IMR 4895 and 4064 gave good accuracy and decent velocity without beating the gun to death.

In my opinion, using slower powders in an attempt to keep bolt speed down in a semi auto gas operated rifle probably isn't the best option available, in fact, it's almost guaranteed to do just the opposite.

Bolt velocity in a gas gun isn't determined by chamber pressure so much as it is gas port pressure. The reason 4350 can give higher muzzle velocities than 4895 is because it keeps pushing the bullet longer as it goes down the barrel.

This means that pressure in the barrel stays higher, further down the barrel than it does with faster powders. That means that when the bullet passes the gas port and allows gas to start working the action, there's more pressure and thus more energy available to cycle the action, which means that the bolt will be cycled faster, even though the powder itself has a slower burn rate.

As I said, I don't have a lot of experience working up loads for Remington semi autos, mainly I've just loaded hunting ammo for friend's rifles. I can say that I haven't seen anything about them that contradicts accepted norms for loading gas operated high power rifles.

I started with Varget and it was throwing brass into the next zip code the reason I switched powder. If it doesn't extract it rips the rim of the brass, which has been addressed. That and I never did get any grouping I liked (>2.5" @100yrds) and the crony numbers were very slow, <300 off book. The IMR4350 got me a lot better crony numbers (150 off) and 1.5" grouping at 100 yrds, with brass ejection 1/2 of Varget. I do have some 4064 I'm working with now. I've had to made some repairs to the guns and reworking the loads. I just had to get one gun back to my neighbor for dear season which opened last weekend here. Since he has got it back he as take out 2 hogs, a 2 yotes. The story on the Rem 742 are they are junk, made of the cheapest steel you could get back then. I used 2 guns to get one simi functional. The bolt on these guns eat the rails up on the receiver, barrels rust just by looking at them. The 7400 is a decent gun. It shows no receiver wear but the barrel had rust in the chamber too. The humidity where I'm at averages 60% or higher. Not a good combination. Keeping oil on the gun you would think be a good thing here, but not. The soil is very sandy and fine which coats anything exposed. This is his truck gun, so it's abused heavily. I've got him protecting the outside of the guns with paste wax, at least it want a track the fine abrasives soil in this area. He is now putting the gun in a hard case when in the truck.

Sorry for the side track, was not my intent.

 

[Sunray]

52 grains of IMR 4064 is one full grain over current max for a 150 grain bullet. That can be attributable to differences in loading manuals, but you're right at max either way. However, you need to work up the load from the start load, not just pick one and hope. Highly probable you csn reduce 2" to 1 or 1.5 inches if you really want to. Two is dandy for deer.
"...small base sizing die..." Unlikely to be absolutely necessary, but it's an SB die or an FL die anyway. The SB just sizes a couple thou more than an FL.
"...a depth that fits the BAR magazine..." Max OAL is 3.340" and that should fit the mags. Rule Number One applies though. It works. Don't fix it.

 

[RainDodger]

For a 150 grain bullet and IMR-4064, I got really fine accuracy with 49.7 grains (Sierra MatchKing). Not a BAR though - out of a bolt rifle. My chrono has it at 2,846 FPS.

 

[Captcurt]

my load for a Remington 7600 in 3006 is 55grs of imr-4350 with a 165gr nosler BT, it may not be ok in a auto loader, eastbank.

This is my go to load when working with a new 30-06. If it doesn't shoot well with 4350 you usually have a to burn a lot of different powder and/or do some bedding work.

 

[Swampman]

Highly probable you csn reduce 2" to 1 or 1.5 inches if you really want to.

I kinda doubt it.

That was a two inch, five shot group at 200 yards with a semi auto rifle.

A five shot, one MOA group at 200 yards from what sounds like a stock hunting style/weight gas gun with a two piece stock and shooting hunting bullets isn't something you see every day.

I'd be extremely impressed if the one MOA grouping ability was consistently repeatable at 200 yards.

Consistently shooting 3/4 or 1/2 MOA at that distance with a stock BAR would be almost incredible.