357 Colt Trooper (1968) and 38sp +P ammo

[Cluster Bomb]

I have a box of +p 38sp ammo that was given to me for the wifes 38sp however hers is not +p rated.

Is it safe to shoot them in my 1968 357 Colt Trooper, since its a 357. I read someplace that the older Trooper doesn't like a steady diet of 357 loads (which i have been feeding it with no probs)( yet)

Thanks

 

[4v50 Gary]

Your Trooper can easily handle +p or +p+ as both are lower pressure than a .357 Magnum.

 

[22-rimfire]

Great revolver. As Gary said, 38spl... no problem. The Trooper also was chambered in 38spl only, which is where your research yielded the +P info. Those are comments about preserving a Colt rather than stressing it.

 

[DPris]

Curious about why you'd think a .38 Special +P load would not be safe in your .357 Magnum Trooper.
Denis

 

[Cluster Bomb]

I have read that some older revolvers wer made different than todays. And that the original trooper was made different thann the mkii and that stress related probs due to +p and steady diets of 357 in the original lead to cracked frames. Similar to some s&w.

 

[brnmuenchow]

That pistol will eat +P ammo all day long.

 

[rcmodel]

When your gun was made, .357 Mag ammo was rated 40,000 CUP.
It has since been reduced to 35,000 PSI.

+P .38 Spl is loaded to 18,500 PSI.

The only thing you need to do is clean the carbon rings out of the chambers after shooting .38 Spl in it.

rc

 

[Cluster Bomb]

Thanks. Again guys. I always want to make sure when shooting. Last I need is a hand granade and ruining a gun and or my self.


Rather look like an idiot for asking than an idiot without a hand for not.

 

[DPris]

There are two questions that always provoke curiosity when I see them.

One is "Will .38 Special +P hurt my .357 Magnum?"
The other is "Will Speer shotshells hurt my barrel?"

In the first, I've never heard of cracked Trooper .357 Mag frames from using .357 Mags (although I suppose it's possible), much less the much lower-powered .38 +P.
What tends to go first on the older V-Spring Colt DA revolvers is the hand, not the frame, and that certainly will take longer with a .38 than a .357 Mag diet.

In the second, if those shotshells damaged bores, Speer would pretty much not still be selling them continuously for over 40 years.

You're right in older revolvers being made different than today, both in terms of design & metallurgy (depending on how old), and that the original Troopers used entirely different actions than the MKIIIs.

Your '68 Trooper .357 (and my '66 Trooper .357) won't hold up to .357s as long or as well as the MKIIIs that followed in 1969, but unless you get a little loony in handloading the timing will go before the frame does.

Shooting any commercial .38 Special load from a reputable manufacturer will put far less stress on the gun than a .357 Magnum load.
Wear also depends on how much you shoot.
500 rounds a week in either caliber will wear out an older Trooper fairly quickly.

Something to remember is that those guns were designed in an era where only target shooters shot them regularly, and they had to be rebuilt periodically with heavy use back then.
Putting 20,000 rounds through a gun simply wasn't envisioned for the average buyer. That only came along within the past 30 years or so.
Many people today expect far more from those guns than their designers ever did.

Follow RC's advice on the carbon rings, take it easy on the old Colt (in terms of volume, not caliber of ammunition), and keep in mind that Colt won't be servicing these things forever.
The day will come when they'll stop, and at that point you may not be able to keep it going if you wear it out.
Gunsmiths capable of working on the actions are down to a handfull nationwide, and parts are drying up.
Denis

 

[Cluster Bomb]

I knew I can shoot 38s outs a 357. I was just worried about the action, frame and cylinder. With the extra. Pressure

 

[2zulu1]

Just to add to the above post, I sent an out of time MkIII Trooper to Colt for repair. Should be back any time now with the action tuned to factory specs, cost was $65.00.

Edited to add, Colt's forging process for the Trooper MkIII are/were amongst the best, if not the best, in the industry.

 

[DPris]

Still don't understand quite why you thought +P .38s would not be as safe to shoot in your Colt as the magnums you're already shooting through it.

Any cylinder proofed for .357 Magnums can handle .38+Ps with a lotta room to spare. Any frame built for magnums, ditto. The hand takes a beating to at least some degree every time you fire anything in the gun, and +Ps will give it more of a thump than conventional .38 Special rounds, but not nearly as much as fullbore magnum ammunition. That's the nature of the old V-Spring actions, and their greatest impediment to long life.
It's the primary cause of the guns going out of time, when the hand wears or shortens too far for correct carryup and lockup.

The "extra pressure" of a +P load comes nowhere near magnum pressures, as RC pointed out for you.
If you're comfortable with magnum pressures, dunno why you'd be concerned with +p .38s.

But, hopefully now you know.
Denis

 

[Cluster Bomb]

All I really only know a few things on ammo

Shoot what ur gun is made for,
+p can be dangerous in guns. Not built for it.
Don't shoot reloads from people u don't know.
If in doubt don't shoot it.

 

[slick6]

All I really only know a few things on ammo

Shoot what ur gun is made for,
+p can be dangerous in guns. Not built for it.
Don't shoot reloads from people u don't know.
If in doubt don't shoot it.

The +P .38's being dangerous in guns not built for it are only referring to guns that were designed to shoot just standard pressure(Non +P).38 Special ammo. But, since your 1968 Trooper was designed to shoot the far more powerful .357 magnum rounds-then, .38+P's cannot possibly harm this revolver.

 

[DPris]

+P can be safely fired in just about any modern .38 Special revolver in good condition.
It's not inherently DANGEROUS, it'll just tend to accellerate wear.
It can be safely fired in ANY .357 in good condition.

What does your wife have?
You mention hers is "not rated" for +P.
Maybe we can help you understand hers a little better, too.
Denis

 

[pendennis]

The ca. 1968 Colt Trooper .357, is built on the Colt I frame, which is larger than the S&W K frame. It's the base frame for the Python, as well.

I own a Python made in 1978, and it's had over 3K rounds through it, mostly 158gr .357 Magnum loads, with WW296 powder. I had it checked three times, and it's as tight today, as it was new; and the timing is spot on.

Colt does recommend that D frames be factory checked after 3K rounds of +P; but modern +P is relatively mild compared to the original +P.

S&W says that +P can be used without concern in any steel frame manufactured since 1957, when model numbers first appeared. I would suspect, that most K frames made since 1905 would probably handle +P without problems.

 

[Cluster Bomb]

Taurus 82

 

[DPris]

Why do you think it isn't +P rated?
Denis

I'm asking because their website shows it is. Is it an older version that you're concerned about?

 

[Cluster Bomb]

Its serial does not come up under their sit. So its older

 

[DPris]

I don't think I'd be too concerned about it.
I can't see it being unsafe, but if you want to pursue it you could probably call & ask 'em.
Denis

 

[Remllez]

Cluster,

I've been trying to shoot my 1968 Trooper .357 loose for many years, many rounds of all flavors and it still locks up tight as the day I bought it. It isn't going to win any beauty contests to be sure, but honest wear doesn't bother me one bit.

The action has gotten nothing but better over the years, it's almost like there's no mechanical parts inside the frame!! Just plain smooth and it loves 158 grain LSWC in both .38 and .357- shoots em like lasers.

I've heard the V spring Colts shoot out of time with heavy use but my particular gun didn't get that message. And like Dpris said it's usually just the hand and many shooters accept that it's a wear item and shoot em up without worry.

If I'm in the mood for fire breathers I shoot my Blackhawk or Dan Wesson, that's not to say I have babied my Trooper, its just the way I shoot heavy loads. It's always advisable to keep a few wear parts for grins and with the V spring guns it's good insurance.

Shooting .38 + P's will only help smooth the action out on your Colt, they don't make revolvers like that anymore.

 

[brnmuenchow]

Cluster Bomb:

All I really only know a few things on ammo

Shoot what ur gun is made for,
+p can be dangerous in guns. Not built for it.
Don't shoot reloads from people u don't know.
If in doubt don't shoot it.

Never any harm in asking... NEVER! I have learned just like everyone else buy asking, or simply being corrected by someone over something you may not be aware of. There are people, friend's and family that have been around guns longer than I have been alive and sometimes I am supprised about how little they may know about something firearm related. Better safe and sound than sorry.

 

[243winxb]

357 Colt Trooper (1968)

Back in the 60"s , heat cracked the barrel on mine. Looked like charcoal in the forcing cone. Shooting rapid fire on a 90+ degree day killed it. The metal is very soft compared to a S&W. Found this out while engraving my name under the grip. Returned it to the factory for a new barrel. Came back with a barrel defect, rifling went 1/2 way down tube, stoped, turned & started again. Sent it back again. 2nd new barrel was ok, but trigger pull was now 8 lbs, with vise marks on the frame near the rear sight. Sold it ASAP. Swore never to buy another Colt.

 

[Guillermo]

+P is the same pressure as regular .38 ammo was before SAAMI lowered the standards.

+P is safe in any quality revolver since the 1930s

The marketing weenies did a good job of making people believe it is a hot round when it is anything but.

They emasculated the .38 and are now selling regular pressure ammo as "hot"

Here are the facts. Ignore the hype.

http://www.smithandwessonforums.com/forum/ammo-forum/77-faq-my-p-study.html