44 mag loads for 16in carbine

[Float Pilot]

Still playing with loads from 16 inch ROSSI M-92 44 magnum factory open sights. The 300 MP worked ok but it sure is dirty.
So far I have not found a load that I really love for this little carbine.

210gr Sierra Jacketed HP
27.5 grains Lil Gun
Star Line Brass ( virgin)CCI-350
Lee Crimp and 1.613 col
= 2,140 fps Large group for some reason.

210gr Sierra Jacket HP
28.5 gr 300 MP
Star-line
WLP
Lee Crimp and 1.620 col
=2,042 fps average and a large group

240gr Hornady SIL-FMJ
25.0 gr 300 MP
Star line
WLP
Lee Crimp and 1.600 col
=1,795 fps average and a huge group.

240gr Hornady SIL-FMJ
23.0 gr Lil Gun
Star line
Old CCI-350
Lee Crimp and 1.613 col
=1,840 fps average and a 5 inch

246 grain Cast EKC gas checked SWC
23.0 grains of H-110
Start Line Brass
CCI-350
Lee Crimp
1.600 col
= 1,710 fps and a 3.0 inch group at 100yrd


246gr EKC SWC GC
23.0 grains IMR 4227
Star Line Brass ( virgin)CCI-350
Lee Crimp and 1.665 col
= 1523 fps with only a 3 fps spread. No pressure signs. Large group for some reason.






246 grain Cast EKC gas checked SWC
22.0 grains of Lil Gun
Start Line Brass
CCI-350
Lee Crimp
1.613 col
= 1,803 fps average and 3 shots one hole plus two flyers


246 grain Cast EKC gas checked SWC
23.0 grains of Lil Gun
Start Line Brass
CCI-350
Lee Crimp
1.613 col
= 1,827fps average and a 4.0 inch group at 100yrd


246gr Cast EKC gas checked SWC
8.0 grains Power Pistol
Start Line 44 SPECIAL BRASS
WLP. Lee Crimp
= 1,185 fps and a 3 inch group

265grain Hornady FTX
21 grains of H-110
CCI-350
Star Line brass
Lee Crimp. Would not feed
= 1,510 fps and a 2.5 inch group at 100 yrds

300 grain hard cast Precision Performance Gas Checked SWC
18.0 grains AA#9
Star Line Brass
CCI-350
1.610 col Lee Crimp
=1,038 fps average and a 3.00 inch group

300 grain hard cast Precision Performance Gas Checked SWC
22.0 grain H-110
Star Line brass
CCI-350
Lee Crimp and 1.610 col
=1,585 fps average and a 3.00 inch group

300 grain hard cast Precision Performance SWC w GC
19.5 grains Lil Gun
Star Line Brass
CCI-350
Lee Crimp and 1.613 col
=1,615 fps average and a 6 inch group.


300 grain hard cast Precision Performance SWC w GC
20.0 grains Lil Gun
Star Line Brass
CCI-350
Lee Crimp and 1.610 col
=1,620 fps average and a 2.25 inch group. * Note this load is a wee bite too hot for my over-sized chamber.


300gr SWC GC
20.0 grains IMR=4227
Star Line VirginCCI-350
Lee Crimp and 1.615 col
= 1,350 fps and a 2.0 inch group at 100 yards. NO PRESSURE SIGNS

300gr SWC GC
20.5 grains IMR=4227
Star Line VirginCCI-350
Lee Crimp and 1.615 col
= 1,396 fps and a 6.0 inch group at 100 yards. NO PRESSURE SIGNSSo half a grain really opened up the groups.


300 grain hard cast Precision Performance SWC w GC
20.0 grains 300 MP
Star Line Brass
WLP
Lee Crimp and 1.610 col
=1,510 fps average and a 1.75 inch group.

300 grain hard cast Precision Performance SWC w GC
21.0 grains 300 MP
Star Line Brass
WLP
Lee Crimp and 1.610 col
=1,568 fps average and a 5 inch group.

300 grain hard cast Precision Performance SWC w GC
22.0 grains 300 MP
Star Line Brass
WLP
Lee Crimp and 1.610 col
=1,626 fps average and a 3.0 inch group.

 

[MEHavey]

1892Win PUMA 44Mag
LYMAN #2 Mould 429667/240gr LRNFP(plainbase)/H-110/21.0gr/CCI-LrgPstlMag/ Rem*Case / OAL:1.580"
QL16"=17,403psi/1,423fps *(39.5.1H20) Actual Vel = 1,571fps Excellent Accuracy

 

[bocefus78]

240gr Hornaday xtp
New starline brass
24.0gr imr4227
Mag primer
This is VERY close to max! Use at your own risk.
No.chrono data but by my math, should be 1600 plus fps easily.


That load shoots a little over an inch from my buddies rossi rifle. Scout Scoped and rested.

 

[shootniron]

Don't know what you are looking to do...but a couple of those 300gr loads that you have listed are pretty good...in my book.

This is just me, but I prefer the 250gr bullets in my 44 carbine.

 

[Float Pilot]

My 246 grain bullets were supposed to be 250 grain. But they are dropping out at 246 to 248.

The one load with 300MP is pretty accurate as far as groups with the 300 grain gas checked SWCs, but it is SUPER DIRTY. The cases look like I was shooting black powder and it fouls the bore after 10 shots.

I would like to find a cast bullet around the 280 grain range just to see how it works out.

 

[gamestalker]

I don't load specifically for a carbine, but my revolver loads are also carbine loads.

That said, I like H110/296. My favorite is a 225 gr. JHP with 25 grs. of H110/296, that load will do a good job of substituting for my morning cup of coffee.

I'm not at all experienced with the LFCD, but have you tried using just a standard roll crimp instead? If the FCD isn't effecting enough crimp, or if a roll crimp isn't properly applied, it can interfere with combustion. The bullet will experience pre-ignition travel, which can cause some problems.

Maybe try just a roll crimp, it might clean up things a bit? Your seating die has the ability to effect a roll crimp, it's built into the seating die. The LFCD is an option, but depending, it may not always be the best option with 300 MP?

GS

 

[Float Pilot]

My Lee Crimp dies for the 44 mag is a roll crimp. My loads are deeply crimped into a cannelure or groove.

 

[gamestalker]

Well the crimp sounds ok then.

I don't know anything about 300 MP, but I''ve been wanting to try it being that it is supposed to work similarly to 296/h110.

GS

 

[336A]

What is the groove diameter of your bore? I know Marlins run on the larger side with .431" .432" being the common measurement in .44 and .444 rifles. Perhaps yours is the same?

 

[MEHavey]

If running a Marlin, go 0.431"-0.432"



...also (in the Marlins), a 38 standard twist will limit your bullet weight, 280 being about
as heavy as you can go. (Rossi runs 1:30 and can go ~15% heavier for equal velocities)

1894 MARLIN 44 MAG HEAVY
Acc432-280_PlainBase* Cast #2 / Lym450Sized 0.432/LymAloxLube(50/50)
H110 / 20.5
CCI_LP_Mag
OAL:1.600"
QUickLoad(20")= 33,803psi/1,633fps / Actual Vel =1,630fps



* http://www.accuratemolds.com/

 

[GBExpat]

Float Pilot, thank you for sharing the 19 loads that you have tried in search of a "standard load" for your rifle (sharp-looking little rifle, btw!).

I thank you not so much for sharing the loads information (I have a Marlin 1894S) as I do for allowing me to see that I am not as Bad Off (a.k.a., "Eat-Up-With-It") as I was beginning to believe ... or, at least, if I (probably) am, I am not alone.

Almost 2 years ago I sent off the electronics module of my CHRONY BetaMaster to have the memory upgraded from 10 10rd Strings to 102 10rd Strings ... and I am already within a dozen of having filled it for the second time ... and I did not use it very much in the 1st 12 months that it was back.

I wish that I could offer some hand-/re-loading suggestions for your Rossi, but I have not (yet) delved into reloading for my 1894S.

As it has been since shortly after I bought it in 1988 at the Medina, OH GunShow, I have the Williams 5D aperture sight that I added configured for generic (American Eagle, etc) 240gr "whitebox ammo. I have never used it on a critter at farther than about 100m, but at that range and with that ammo it is deadly-accurate.

 

[Float Pilot]

Gamestalker, and et-all.... I will try slugging my bore in between flights over the next couple of days. The chamber is slightly over-sized and I get some case swelling about 25% of the way above the rim on hotter loads.
Fortunately I have a lot of Virgin Brass for experiments.

This little carbine certainly seems to like heavier bullets and cast lead. The rifling is shallow but wide. It is a new Taurus made Rossi. You can see that I yanked the bolt safety and installed a peep sight. Unfortunately the hole for the safety was NOT centered in the bolt so I had to drift the front sight way over.
I would prefer a William or old Lyman style peep.

This is going to be an airplane take-along carbine. Once I find a bear defense load for this carbine I will just load up a bunch in virgin brass and call it good. It is a wee bit rough on brass and not as much fun to shoot as many of my other rifles.

The only reason the I bought some 300MP powder was that I have been totally unable to find any H-110 or even another can of Lil Gun over the last year. The H-110 that I do have is 30 years old and I only have half a pound.

The 300MP seems to be in the same general pressure range, but it sure is dirty. In a pistol it makes a HUGE muzzle flash.

 

[GBExpat]

... You can see that I yanked the bolt safety and installed a peep sight. Unfortunately the hole for the safety was NOT centered in the bolt so I had to drift the front sight way over.
I would prefer a William or old Lyman style peep. ...

Aaaahhhh ... thanks for the explanation!

I was scratching my head over that bolt-attached aperture sight. Never seen anything quite like that setup.

 

[Float Pilot]

Steves Gunz sells them. You just remove the goofy lawyer safety and this gets pinned into place. I have it jacked way up because my front sight blade is still too high.

The standard open sights were driving my old eyes crazy. With the short barrel there was not enough of a sight radius. Moving the rear sight back to the bolt gives me six more inches.

http://store.stevesgunz.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=20_30&products_id=5

 

[gotboostvr]

I'm running 23.8gr 4227 under a Hornady 240gr XTP in once fired Remington brass, Winchester primer, roll crimp in the groove.

I think 24.1 is max per Lyman #49. 23.8gr has recoil on par with most (sane) factory ammo. 4227 shoots pretty clean when you've got it up around the top end with a good roll crimp.

Wish I had chrono data.

It happens to be my "accuracy load" in both of my hunting 44's.
16" stainless steel Rossi and a 6" 629-6, a great hunting duo.

 

[Float Pilot]

I managed to dig out a box of old 265 grain Hornady jacketed flat soft points.
I only had a short time to make up ten of each load and run out to the range. In the rain....

Note how the CCI-350 mag primer was more mild than the Winchester WLKP primer for the same load of Accrute 300MP. Weird....


265grain Hornady Jacketed soft flat point
23 grains of H-110
CCI-350
Star Line brass
Lee Crimp. 1.644 col
Hi= 1,699fps--Lo= 1,663 fps 1.30 inch group at 100 yrds

Clean brass. Muz ener= 1,698 ft lbs. 100 yards ener=1,117 ft lbs

265grain Hornady soft flat point
22 grains of Accurate 300MP
CCI-350
Star Line brass
Lee Crimp. 1.644 col
Hi = 1,623 fps --Lo= 1,606 fps and a 4.0 inch group at 100 yrds


265grain Hornady FTX
22 grains of Accurate 300MP
WLP primer
Star Line brass
Lee Crimp. 1.644 col
Hi=1,671 fps Lo= 1,618 fps and a 5.5 inch group at 100 yrds

 

[mavracer]

I'd be happy with most of those H110 loads, that's what I use ~20gr behind 300 gr something or others. Ive used a couple different cast bullets and Nosler and Hornady Jacketed.

 

[GBExpat]

... 1.30 inch group at 100 yrds ...

WHOA! That looks like a keeper ... as if you had not already figured that out.

 

[Lee S. Forsberg]

What is the diameter of your bullets?

 

[Float Pilot]

I slugged the bore. The lands are .425 and the grooves are .430....

Here are the bullets I have most been playing with. I have some non-gas checked 250 grain cast slugs that are .432 in daimeter. I might try those next.

L to R
210gr Sierra 240gr Hornady Sil fmj. Lee 246 grain SWC GC Hornady 265gr JFP, 300gr Precision cast

 

[Float Pilot]

Primers make a huge difference in this carbine

265grain Hornady Jacketed soft flat point
23 grains of H-110
CCI-350
Star Line brass
Lee Crimp. 1.644 col
Hi= 1,699fps--Lo= 1,663 fps 1.30 inch group at 100 yrds
Clean brass. Muz ener= 1,698 ft lbs. 100 yards ener=1,117 ft lbs

265grain Hornady Jacketed soft flat point
23 grains of H-110
Winchester WLP
Star Line brass
Lee Crimp. 1.629col
Hi= 1,670fps--Lo= 1,603 fps 4.0 inch group
Same load as above but with WLP primer.


Also tried a wee bit larger cast slug with horrible results.

255gr keith style cast SWC sized to .432
24.0 grains H-110
Star Line Brass,
Win WLP primer
Lee Roll crimp
1.670 col ( too long to cycle)
=1,707 fps average and a 3 foot group