AI vs. Sako
- Thread starter ktmhk53
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trapshooter
Member
Sas,,
I think you missed my point. Obviously, I hacked you off. Sorry. I call 'em like I see 'em.
Gunny Schmit,
I'm going to send you a PM. I'm serious.
I think you missed my point. Obviously, I hacked you off. Sorry. I call 'em like I see 'em.
Gunny Schmit,
I'm going to send you a PM. I'm serious.
Mute
Member
I have shot both and yes IMO the AI is better. Better stock, better bolt, better trigger. That said, if I had that much money, I'd rather send it to George Gardner to make me a rifle. But, I know exactly what I like or don't like on a precision rifle.
no worries trapshooter, i like talking to people who say it as it is. no hard feelings or nothing.
am more than happy to recive a PM from you . look forward to it.
-- looking @ the picks of the sako from a diff angle it dosent seen as ungainly as i remembered, however the AI seems more streamlined & prob better balanced. I was thinking it over today and to be honest if you are a civilian i think its money better spent on a custom job or a Sako/sig. however personally if i could easily afford AI i woud buy it, but i think most ppl out there would rather have a rifle build the way they want it than an of the shelf AI (though there are options with them)
all in all there isnt that much seperating the AI and sako. the AI is the better rifle but for the price of the difference i'd rather go custom or the sako as you can get a good scope with left overs. though if you have the money...buy the best! as long as your up to the challange, well are ya punk?
go ahead, make my day!
Adam
am more than happy to recive a PM from you . look forward to it.
-- looking @ the picks of the sako from a diff angle it dosent seen as ungainly as i remembered, however the AI seems more streamlined & prob better balanced. I was thinking it over today and to be honest if you are a civilian i think its money better spent on a custom job or a Sako/sig. however personally if i could easily afford AI i woud buy it, but i think most ppl out there would rather have a rifle build the way they want it than an of the shelf AI (though there are options with them)
all in all there isnt that much seperating the AI and sako. the AI is the better rifle but for the price of the difference i'd rather go custom or the sako as you can get a good scope with left overs. though if you have the money...buy the best! as long as your up to the challange, well are ya punk?
go ahead, make my day!Adam
trapshooter
Member
Sas...
If Gunny Schmit and I can get together, we'll let him have the last word, as he'll have the chance to shoot both, in the same day. He has an AI, but I think he will give us the straight...well, you know,, uhhh, professional opinion.
I'm ready to concede that the AI has an edge in several areas (it does have more eye appeal, for instance, just to start). I agree on the stock, and thus the balance may tip in it's favor. Not having examined one directly, it's hard for me to say anything about 'feel' of the action, etc., which means a great deal about how I view the ultimate worth of a gun. Heck, maybe they are worth that much more.
In the end, I'm probably quibbling about the price/performance difference between a Vantage and a Corvette, also .
Performance is roughly equal (if the 'Vette is a Z06), but the Vantage has the edge in areas that go beyond performance (although it wins there, too). I'd take either one. Same with the rifles.
If Gunny Schmit and I can get together, we'll let him have the last word, as he'll have the chance to shoot both, in the same day. He has an AI, but I think he will give us the straight...well, you know,
, uhhh, professional opinion. I'm ready to concede that the AI has an edge in several areas (it does have more eye appeal, for instance, just to start). I agree on the stock, and thus the balance may tip in it's favor. Not having examined one directly, it's hard for me to say anything about 'feel' of the action, etc., which means a great deal about how I view the ultimate worth of a gun. Heck, maybe they are worth that much more.
In the end, I'm probably quibbling about the price/performance difference between a Vantage
and a Corvette, also .Performance is roughly equal (if the 'Vette is a Z06), but the Vantage has the edge in areas that go beyond performance (although it wins there, too). I'd take either one. Same with the rifles.
Zak Smith
Member
To resurrect an old thread...
I've shot the TRG42 (338), AI-AWM300, and I own an AI-AWP (308). I've handled but not shot the Tubb rifle. (And of course I have experience with conventional Rem700's and Win70's.)
The AW/AWM/ASM series has a "field replaceable" barrel system, and the parts are made such that you can take a bolt from any other same model drop it right in. Of the TRG and the AI, both will shoot half-minute or better from the box with no load development. The consensus on SH and SP.com is that the AI is a "tougher" rifle which will put up with more abuse. The bolt seems to run more "on its own" on the AI vs. the TRG (for me).
If I were to buy a 338 or 300, my choice would be the AI-AWM. It's probably the most well thought out field-worthy precision rifle.
Comparing the Tubb to either the AI or the TRG isn't really appropriate. The Tubb is an extremely focused design for shooting from defined positions, not for humping all day across the Wyoming or NM high plains and engaging targets from improvised positions. That super adjustable Tubb stock just doesn't work very well shooting from weak-shoulder, for example. Is a 25oz Anschutz trigger reliable when the rifle is caked with sand dust?
In response to Steve's question, "Why aren't the top competitors using it?" -- They are, but you're looking at a different game. The AI's win or fare well (depending on the shooter) in IPSC/USPSA "MOR" (manually operated rifle) class and in the "sniper/tactical" or "practical precision rifle" matches.
$4k price hike? Let's say we're comparing a $4500 AW to a $800 Rem PSS. With the AW, you get a superior action permanently bonded to the frame substructure, fully adjustable stock ergos, field replacable parts & bbl, optics rail machined into receiver (albiet the AI rail), a great adjustable 2-stage trigger, a magazine system that actually works when dirty, and a whole sytem that will shoot half MOA or better with basically any match quality ammunition. You can forget finding the load your rifle "likes" and doing painstaking load development, just pick any decent match ammo.
Yes, a $3000 GAP gets you real close, but you're still "stuck" with the limitations of the Rem700 action.
Of course, this may be a moot point if AI's post-buyout management makes drastic changes.
-z
I've shot the TRG42 (338), AI-AWM300, and I own an AI-AWP (308). I've handled but not shot the Tubb rifle. (And of course I have experience with conventional Rem700's and Win70's.)
The AW/AWM/ASM series has a "field replaceable" barrel system, and the parts are made such that you can take a bolt from any other same model drop it right in. Of the TRG and the AI, both will shoot half-minute or better from the box with no load development. The consensus on SH and SP.com is that the AI is a "tougher" rifle which will put up with more abuse. The bolt seems to run more "on its own" on the AI vs. the TRG (for me).
If I were to buy a 338 or 300, my choice would be the AI-AWM. It's probably the most well thought out field-worthy precision rifle.
Comparing the Tubb to either the AI or the TRG isn't really appropriate. The Tubb is an extremely focused design for shooting from defined positions, not for humping all day across the Wyoming or NM high plains and engaging targets from improvised positions. That super adjustable Tubb stock just doesn't work very well shooting from weak-shoulder, for example. Is a 25oz Anschutz trigger reliable when the rifle is caked with sand dust?
In response to Steve's question, "Why aren't the top competitors using it?" -- They are, but you're looking at a different game. The AI's win or fare well (depending on the shooter) in IPSC/USPSA "MOR" (manually operated rifle) class and in the "sniper/tactical" or "practical precision rifle" matches.
$4k price hike? Let's say we're comparing a $4500 AW to a $800 Rem PSS. With the AW, you get a superior action permanently bonded to the frame substructure, fully adjustable stock ergos, field replacable parts & bbl, optics rail machined into receiver (albiet the AI rail), a great adjustable 2-stage trigger, a magazine system that actually works when dirty, and a whole sytem that will shoot half MOA or better with basically any match quality ammunition. You can forget finding the load your rifle "likes" and doing painstaking load development, just pick any decent match ammo.
Yes, a $3000 GAP gets you real close, but you're still "stuck" with the limitations of the Rem700 action.
Of course, this may be a moot point if AI's post-buyout management makes drastic changes.
-z
Bunkerbuster
Member
- Joined
- Dec 21, 2005
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- 21
Seems like this is a popular topic. I posted this topic on Glocktalk and did not get too much response.
Trg22
Interesting discussion. I've got a TRG22 (.308) as well as a Tubb T2K (.243). (Would love an AI AW but think the Mrs might go nuts if I turned up with yet another rifle.) Both are superb rifles in every regard. The Tubb is fractionally more accurate than the TRG22, (we're talking maximum of 2mm difference at 100 yards for a 5 shot group, so it's not really worth talking about unless you're in a crazily serious competition). I wouldn't tramp the Tubb T2K around in the wild for anything though. It's gorgeous and is incredibly well built, by McMillan Bros, but it's not built for serious outside dragging through hedge rows etc. I like my TRG a great deal too. It's beautifully built, is easy to use and shoots like a dream. With the brake on it, recoil is quite low but can still thump a bit if you dont keep it tight enough into your shoulder. The triggers are both wonderful but the Tubb is marginally better. The TRG22 is easier to hold level while prone or benched than the Tubb T2K because of the design of the rear of the stock. I know a couple of people with the AI AW (.308) and they love them too. I guess what it comes down to is when you're paying serious cash for a weapon like these, you can't really go wrong. It's just personal preference.
Interesting discussion. I've got a TRG22 (.308) as well as a Tubb T2K (.243). (Would love an AI AW but think the Mrs might go nuts if I turned up with yet another rifle.) Both are superb rifles in every regard. The Tubb is fractionally more accurate than the TRG22, (we're talking maximum of 2mm difference at 100 yards for a 5 shot group, so it's not really worth talking about unless you're in a crazily serious competition). I wouldn't tramp the Tubb T2K around in the wild for anything though. It's gorgeous and is incredibly well built, by McMillan Bros, but it's not built for serious outside dragging through hedge rows etc. I like my TRG a great deal too. It's beautifully built, is easy to use and shoots like a dream. With the brake on it, recoil is quite low but can still thump a bit if you dont keep it tight enough into your shoulder. The triggers are both wonderful but the Tubb is marginally better. The TRG22 is easier to hold level while prone or benched than the Tubb T2K because of the design of the rear of the stock. I know a couple of people with the AI AW (.308) and they love them too. I guess what it comes down to is when you're paying serious cash for a weapon like these, you can't really go wrong. It's just personal preference.
Don't own a Tubb. Have shot with a number of High Masters who have one.
A Tubb rifle is a specialized rifle, specifically designed to win Highpower Matches. As previously stated, it is adjustable in all dimensions, including time and space. The guys who own them tell me it takes a while to figure out all the adjustments. It is a reliable rifle, but only in the context of a rifle match. You put these things back in a case, maybe fabric, maybe plastic, and you carefully carry it to the next firing point. At the end of the day, you put it away in a stronger case. These are precision instruments and are not to be dropped or bounced around like a service rifle.
If you want to go four wheeling, don't buy a sports car. If you want to run stock car, don't get an Indy car. These are special purpose items.
Medusa
Member
Fosbery
Member
My 2p:
The Sako is a superb rifle but the AI is just about perfect in my opinion. The trigger pull is the best out of the box I have ever experienced, bar none. The bolt is the like liquid silk. The grip just feels better in the hand and is also more suited to left hand and off hand shooting in my opinion. The mag release is much easier to access too, and the bipod is more user-friendly.
I've not had much experience with the Sako though, so my advice is only worth what you paid for it
The Sako is a superb rifle but the AI is just about perfect in my opinion. The trigger pull is the best out of the box I have ever experienced, bar none. The bolt is the like liquid silk. The grip just feels better in the hand and is also more suited to left hand and off hand shooting in my opinion. The mag release is much easier to access too, and the bipod is more user-friendly.
I've not had much experience with the Sako though, so my advice is only worth what you paid for it
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