Al Gore's Speech--surprisingly good

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Cosmoline

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I just read the text of Gore's MLK day speech and I must say I'm surprised. I actually agree with most of what he said. I expect to see the four horsemen coming anytime now.

It's worth a read. He acknowledges that the problem with the growth in executive power stretches over many decades, and with some exceptions doesn't launch into the usual partisan attacks. He's close to the truth, I'm afraid. The signs and portents on their own may not be significant, but when added together they point in a terrifying direction. When Congress becomes a mere rubber stamp, and all real power rests with the Executive, then what is the difference between the President and Caesar? Between the limp Roman Senate of the imperial age and the Congress of today?

http://www.drudgereport.com/flash1g.htm
 
I think it's sickening to hear this ....um.... gentleman talk about the "rule of law".:barf:

Funny how he suddenly has such concern over the Constitution.

From Al Gore's presidential campaign:

Al Gore’s campaign platform on gun control

IMPLEMENTING COMMON SENSE MEASURES TO GET GUNS OUT OF THE HANDS OF CRIMINALS AND CHILDREN. As a Senator, Al Gore was one of the lead sponsors of the Brady Bill; as Vice President, he helped shepherd that legislation to enactment. But the current patchwork of laws and regulations leaves too many loopholes for criminals to exploit and too many opportunities for guns to get into the wrong hands. While protecting the rights of law abiding gun owners, as President, Al Gore would:

Seek a nationally mandated, state-run system of photo licensing for all potential hand gun purchasers. No more loopholes or exceptions – anyone who wants to buy a handgun would have to have a license that would prove they are eligible to own a handgun (having passed a background check to prevent felons and the mentally ill from buying guns and demonstrated knowledge of gun safety).

Ban so-called "junk guns," the cheap handguns so often used in violent crimes;
Increase penalties for knowingly selling a gun to someone ineligible to purchase one; for using a gun in a violent crime; and for illegal trafficking of guns;

Advance a variety of other common-sense gun control measures previously advocated by the administration, including a three day waiting period, one-gun-a-month, closing the gun show loophole, and requiring child-safety locks on hand guns;

Provide grants to states to develop systems that end plea bargaining for criminals who use a gun in a crime, and implement a model federal test program;

Oppose efforts to provide special legal protection for gun manufacturers.

Oppose efforts to loosen existing limits on concealed weapons;

Require gun manufacturers and federally-licensed sellers to report gun sales to a state authority.

http://www.sightm1911.com/lib/rkba/AlGore_guns.htm
 
I read it too - it was a good speech, considering who was giving it. He did hit many of the nails on the head with this one.
 
wally said:
The Second Admnedment.

--wally.

Tell me, what laws have been overturned on 2nd grounds in the courts?

The courts are NOT going to protect us from an antigun President. Only Congress can. When the next Dem takes the helm, what hope do we have if the Executive can simply enact its own laws and declare half the people on THR "terrorists."

Do I trust Gore? HELL NO!! But there's no denying he's right on the money this time. I don't think much of GW, and never have. But what really scares me is a President Gore or H. Clinton adopting the level of executive power GW has usurped. You have to look down the road with this. The problem didn't start with GW and it won't end with him--or with the "war on terror." An imperial executive with a left wing anti at the helm is the ultimate nightmare, but unless something is done SOON to check the power of the Executive--either by the Supreme Court or Congress--I fear in another decade the power just won't be there anymore and we'll have to resort to much more tragic means to deal with the problem.

The best thing that could happen now is to have the more excessive anti-terror measures overthrown in court, including seizure of US citizens without trial or warrant, wiretaps without even a FISA warrant, and virtually limitless power of TSA jackboots. But so far most of the courts have been too timid and unwilling to challenge the executive in the "time of war." It now falls on Congress to stand up and earn its pay. If those branches fails, it falls back to us. And unseating some future Caesar will be neither easy nor pleasant.
 
I think he means that which the 2nd has guaranteed us, not the amendment itself.

The Praetorians couldn't have started naming Emperors if the people of Rome had all had glaidii and the will to use them.
 
I read it too - it was a good speech, considering who was giving it. He did hit many of the nails on the head with this one.

The Democrats have no power. They can SAY whatever they want. It's pretty easy to take pot shots at the opposition.

Does Al Gore have any evidence of DOING any of this while he was a heartbeat away from the Presidency for eight years?

http://www.isp-planet.com/politics/fidnet.html

FIDNET: Will Big Brother Be Watching You?

Federal government's proposed network monitoring scheme threatens privacy, offers little in return.

by Patricia Fusco
ISP-Planet Managing Editor
[August 10, 1999]


If U.S. Vice-president and presidential-wannabe Al Gore can publicly identify himself a patriarch of the Internet, then President Bill Clinton may well go down in history as the sire of "Big Brother."

Those of you unfamiliar with the all-knowing totalitarian depicted in George Orwell's novel 1984 might want to familiarize yourself with the British author's rendering of "Big Brother" as an absolute, omnipresent, and automated antithesis to democracy.

What makes Mr. Clinton a candidate for the Orwellian epithet? Consider his administration's proposal for constructing a computer system capable of monitoring all data networks in the U.S.:

Security over privacy
As prescribed by the White House plan, the Federal Bureau of Investigation would be charged with the task of scouring the nation's networks for intruders through a Federal Intrusion Detection Network—FIDNET. Its assignment: Notify the government of all computer attacks that could damage national operations or the American economy.

This network policing initiative takes aim at protecting the federal government's massive computer systems and infrastructure from attack. A spokesperson for the administration said that the "President is committed to doing what we need to do to protect our infrastructure, while at the same time balancing the need for privacy.''

Entrusting the FBI to protect both state and private networks means that FIDNET would be built around a "netted" intrusion detection system for non-Department of Defense government computers.

Omniscient system
Modeled after the DOD system, intrusion detection monitors installed on networks are connected, so that all FIDNET sites would automatically recognize a particular intruder or distinct intrusion technique utilized in any given attack.

The FBI will sit at the center of the system, where the filtered data from network sensors are channeled through the newly created National Infrastructure Protection Center. Ultimately, the plan calls for similar monitoring sensors to be installed on private-sector information systems.

Outside the Clinton White House, the FBI is not widely recognized as a principal conservator of civil liberties. Perhaps the administration would like to be able to reinvent history at will, just as Orwell's "Party" did through its "Ministry of Truth" in 1984.

Those bleeding hearts
The Center for Democracy and Technology was quick to criticize the FIDNET plan for trampling upon the civil liberties of netizens nationwide. According to the CDT the White House clearly recognizes that privacy is undermined by FIDNET, but the government seems convinced it possesses eminent domain over essential network operations.

The CDT believes protecting private networks is best left to the private sector. The organization said that the Electronic Communications Privacy Act already allows for system owners to monitor the use of their private networks in order to protect themselves from outside forces. The CDT contends that melding a military function with a civilian watch guard can only produce ill-favored results.

But the CDT's primary concern is that the plan places network monitoring and surveillance in the hands of a policing agency that is not well suited for such a vocation. Do you really want the folks who brought you the Branch Davidian fiasco poking around your network?

Other civil liberties groups criticized the proposed FIDNET system because a nationwide surveillance infrastructure would be ripe with the potential for abuse. FIDNET itself would most likely be vulnerable to security breaches and prone to constant attack.

Can't fight back
Although FIDNET has the commendable goal of alerting officials to unfriendly raids, the scheme is not designed to stop an assault that could cripple government activities—or the American economy. Without the ability to hinder network-choking activities, the FIDNET plan is analogous to hiring "Chicken Little" to broadcast a weather report. What's the point of telling everyone the "sky is falling" if you don't have an atmospheric repair kit handy?

Not to belittle the notion that computer terrorism poses a serious threat to state and private networks, eroding civil liberties in the name of fighting terrorism does not justify sacrificing privacy.

In Orwell's 1984, "Party" lies are designed to uphold the ruling truths that "Freedom is Slavery," "War is Peace," and "Ignorance is Strength." In 1999, the Clinton Administration appears to be designing FIDNET to vindicate the political truths that "Access Guarantees Privacy," "Terrorism Begets Security," and "Networks are Eminent Domain."

—End
 
Sad to see people believing al-Gore. He is the definition of a corrupt machine politician. His comments are interesting for two reasons:
1) They are part of the Bush Derangement Syndrome
2) They are the opposite of his actions.
 
Do I trust Gore? HELL NO!! But there's no denying he's right on the money this time. I don't think much of GW, and never have. But what really scares me is a President Gore or H. Clinton adopting the level of executive power GW has usurped. You have to look down the road with this. The problem didn't start with GW and it won't end with him--or with the "war on terror." An imperial executive with a left wing anti at the helm is the ultimate nightmare, but unless something is done SOON to check the power of the Executive--either by the Supreme Court or Congress--I fear in another decade the power just won't be there anymore and we'll have to resort to much more tragic means to deal with the problem.

Cosmoline -- you ARE right on the money with this. I just think we're better off not running to the fox to protect the henhouse.
 
Do I trust Gore? HELL NO!! But there's no denying he's right on the money this time. I don't think much of GW, and never have. But what really scares me is a President Gore or H. Clinton adopting the level of executive power GW has usurped. You have to look down the road with this. The problem didn't start with GW and it won't end with him--or with the "war on terror." An imperial executive with a left wing anti at the helm is the ultimate nightmare, but unless something is done SOON to check the power of the Executive--either by the Supreme Court or Congress--I fear in another decade the power just won't be there anymore and we'll have to resort to much more tragic means to deal with the problem.

Comsmoline - +1. People better start looking past their noses - this utopian nightmare with Bush isn't going to last forever.
 
I don't believe Gore would have made such statements if he had been President, concerned about his own authority and ability to do what needs to be done. It is all essentially partisan. It is a political precedent though, likely to be quoted later, because a Democrat President might have some explaining to do if trying to assume the same level of power.

Actually the sky is not falling, since the President's actions in question were a sincere effort to protect the country. Had the FISA court been asked, they might have approved the actions. The jury is still out whether the actions were illegal, despite what popular sentiment Gore wants to reinforce.
 
+1 cosmoline

Why concentrate on who told the truth rather than what the truth is?

Also, attacking Gore is like flogging a dead rabbit - pointless and gratuitous albeit potentially sickly satisfying.
 
RealGun is correct in that Al Gore would not have said this had he been president or running for president, but that doesn't detract from what he said. I think this creep towards tyranny is something that people with all kinds of different political beliefs can agree is potentially dangerous.
 
Lobotomy Boy said:
RealGun is correct in that Al Gore would not have said this had he been president or running for president, but that doesn't detract from what he said. I think this creep towards tyranny is something that people with all kinds of different political beliefs can agree is potentially dangerous.

Actually I am a bit amused because I am well into Napalitano's book describing with many examples how the government at many levels routinely breaks the law in the name of enforcing the law. They get away with it too.
 
Al Gores

Al's still "stuck on stupid" in 2000 and proves everytime he opens his mouth.:rolleyes:
 
shermacman said:
Sad to see people believing al-Gore. He is the definition of a corrupt machine politician. His comments are interesting for two reasons:
1) They are part of the Bush Derangement Syndrome
2) They are the opposite of his actions.

What Gore says doesn't bother me, because I know he wakes up in the wee hours of the morning and says to himself, "If I hadn't prostituted myself and come out in favor of gun control, I'd be President of the United States right now."

And that warms the cockles of my heart.:D
 
Frankly I couldn't care less what Al Gore said or didn't say. I am just thrilled that he didn't end up as our president. Would we be in Iraq? Afghanistan? No... What would he have done after 9-11? Probably send a couple cruise missles toward Afghanistan and said he got retribution. We would now have a nuclear Iraq, and Iran claiming Iraq and Isreal as justification for its nuclear program. If you like would prefer this writing of history, Al Gore is your man.
 
Actually the sky is not falling, since the President's actions in question were a sincere effort to protect the country.

and the NFA '34 was a sincere act to protect the country... etc

who cares what bush's motivation is? he's still destroying our constitutional republic.


seriously, it was an excellent speech. gore, did get a few facts wrong. e.g. the trend didn't START with the bush admin. arguably, it started with his. Arguably, it started with Reagan.

In either case, YES, obviously gore is disingenuous, politically motivated and his actions were totally opposite of his words in this speech.

He's still spot on in this speech, and I don't think anybody's buying that HE'S the solution. But i wish the whole country would read this speech.


The best part was this:

I call upon Democratic and Republican members of Congress today to uphold your oath of office and defend the Constitution. Stop going along to get along. Start acting like the independent and co-equal branch of government you're supposed to be.

But there is yet another Constitutional player whose pulse must be taken and whose role must be examined in order to understand the dangerous imbalance that has emerged with the efforts by the Executive Branch to dominate our constitutional system.

We the people are-collectively-still the key to the survival of America's democracy. We-as Lincoln put it, "[e]ven we here"-must examine our own role as citizens in allowing and not preventing the shocking decay and degradation of our democracy.

Thomas Jefferson said: "An informed citizenry is the only true repository of the public will."

The revolutionary departure on which the idea of America was based was the audacious belief that people can govern themselves and responsibly exercise the ultimate authority in self-government. This insight proceeded inevitably from the bedrock principle articulated by the Enlightenment philosopher John Locke: "All just power is derived from the consent of the governed."


how could you say that and NOT support the 2A?
 
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