Another 1858 Remmington question

[Crawdad1]

That's what the conversions are built for, cowboy action loads.

Something like this,


http://www.midwayusa.com/product/62...0-grain-lead-hollow-base-flat-point-box-of-50

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/16...on-45-colt-long-colt-250-grain-lead-flat-nose

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/17...on-45-colt-long-colt-250-grain-lead-flat-nose

They state to use ONLY 'Cowboy Action Loads' in these cylinders where velocity is kept below a certain feet per second.

 

[Crawdad1]

I don't know this loading isn't to weak,

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/29...on-45-colt-long-colt-250-grain-lead-flat-nose

A review under this round,


I bought these to try in my new Colt Single Action Army and are completely happy with them. Very accurate and cleaning is easy after using them. I'd recommend them to anyone. I even used them to shoot a white tail deer and it dropped it in its tracks at 35 yards.

 

[Pokajabba]

I had one of these in the past, but don't any longer as they're limited in what can be shot. Lead bullets only because the frames are not strong enough to deal with swaging copper. I like being able to shoot more than just lead bullets and I sold it for a Ruger Old Army, which is a strong gun.

Anyway, when I had one of these, if I was target shooting, I was shooting whatever lead bullet load I could get for the best price. If I was carrying it for whatever reason, I was using Federal Champion lead hollow points.

 

[kBob]

Just for giggles I pulled out Smith's Pistols and Revolvers and looked up a few things.

First the factory load listed in his .45 Colt test was NOT as slow as the cowboy loads.

What was closest was the factory loaded .44 Special which listed a muzzle velocity of 770 fps and 246 grain bullet.

Pretty close to the midway cowboy loads in .45 Colt listed. .429 bullet instead of .452 but close.

It penetrated 4 boards.

I would not feel unarmed with the 1858 and a conversion cylinder if that was all I could get. I would however spend a great deal of time working with the gun on the range and perfecting my carry method.

As the OP is talking Open Carry one wonders if having a big honking hogleg of a revolver displayed might be worth more to diswadding most ignoramouses on the trail than a 9x19 crunch'n ticker.

A no shot stop beats an any shot every time.

-kBob

 

[anvil_fire]

Well i decided to go with some Winchester Super-X. They are 255gr lead bullets (box rated at 850 fps). 850fps is the upper limit that is recommended with the conversion. I shot some of them and they are very accurate.

 

[Crawdad1]

Well i decided to go with some Winchester Super-X. They are 255gr lead bullets (box rated at 850 fps). 850fps is the upper limit that is recommended with the conversion. I shot some of them and they are very accurate.

Stay with "COWBOY ACTION LOADS" ONLY!!!! Anything else and you're on your own. Please read the directions on your conversion cylinder does it say ANY round under a certain feet per second or does it say Cowboy Action Loads that are under a certain feet per second?

 

[Crawdad1]

Please read,

"This conversion cylinder is for BLACK POWDER cartridges or black powder equivalent cartridges (also called Cowboy Ammunition) with lead bullets on a steel frame revolver ONLY. Attempting to use modern ammunition and/or installation on a brass frame will create a dangerous condition that can result in injury or death. Dry firing with the conversion installed will damage the firing pins."

 

[midland man]

and I don't understand why the brass frame is an issue as the cylinder holds the pressure I bet its a red tape lawyer thing! but the dry firing could be more of an issue just get some snap caps to dry fire with!

 

[44 Dave]

cylinder holds the pressure

The frame takes the recoil.

 

[45 Dragoon]

44Dave is right. The brass frames are too soft.
I don't see where you stated the make of your cylinder, but all are rated for smokless loads. The R&D / Taylor's / Howell types are 850 fps I believe and Kirst says 1000 fps. Obviously, the reloading tables will keep you below max pressure. As far as Kirst goes, I don't think any "normal"(meaning not +P ammo) off the shelf loads are more than 1000 fps .

I haven't shot B.P. in a looooooong time and don't care to in my revolvers any more (already had all "that kinda fun" I want!). I shoot my reloads that scoot 250gr lead about 900 fps. with all my revolvers. In other words, they all eat the same diet.
These revolvers are where I came up with the figures (tolerances) I use for all cap guns.


Mike
www.goonsgunworks.com
Follow me on Instagram @ goonsgunworks

 

[Crawdad1]

and I don't understand why the brass frame is an issue as the cylinder holds the pressure I bet its a red tape lawyer thing! but the dry firing could be more of an issue just get some snap caps to dry fire with!

Because the manufacturer told you not to that's why. You guys are playing with fire.

 

[gilgsn]

You don't need to push that 1858 for maximum power. A 200gr bullet at 800fps is more than enough. Don't be stupid.

Gil

 

[Pokajabba]

A few years ago when I called Taylor's to order some parts, I asked them how close to the 850 fps recommendation I could go and the gunsmith who I was talking to said in the 58's you can go as high as 950 to 1000 fps, ONLY if it was a lead bullet.

I took his advice, went to the range, loaded the cylinder up with some 250 gr .45 Colt HSM at 860 fps (cheapest .45 Colt Cabela's had then) and shot the box with no issues. Then tried a box of Federal Champion 225 gr lead hollow points at 830 fps, again had no issues.

I believe so long as the pressures don't exceed 14000 PSI and the bullets are just lead, the cylinder will last forever and the frame will be fine.

 

[Crawdad1]

A few years ago when I called Taylor's to order some parts, I asked them how close to the 850 fps recommendation I could go and the gunsmith who I was talking to said in the 58's you can go as high as 950 to 1000 fps, ONLY if it was a lead bullet.

I've bought over the years 5 revolvers from Taylor's & Company and every one of them has been a real gem. So good I wouldn't consider buying from any other place and if their gunsmith said that well, I stand corrected then.

 

[Pokajabba]

I've bought over the years 5 revolvers from Taylor's & Company and every one of them has been a real gem. So good I wouldn't consider buying from any other place and if their gunsmith said that well, I stand corrected then.

I believe the reason Taylor's says "black powder or black powder equivalent aka Cowboy Loads" is because they think that's an easy definition and people will walk into the gun store and say, "the manufacturer says Cowboy ammo only" and the schmuck behind the counter who's getting paid $10/hr walks over to the shelf and sees a big box that says .45 COLT COWBOY ACTION and the lightbulb goes off and he makes the sale.

Then there's the CAS crowd.

Call me stupid, but I think it's easier to say unjacketed lead bullets only at standard pressures under 1000 fps.