Boberg XR9, Rohrbagh R9, MSAR A-Angel, KelTec PF9, Walther PPS, Kahr PM9 & Taurus 709

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Please compare and contrast these seven, for everyday smartcarry CCW:


--Boberg XR9

--Rohrbaugh R9

--MSAR ArchAngel

--KelTec PF9

--Walther PPS

--Kahr PM9

--Taurus 709 SLIM


Heaviest, lightest, fattest, slimmest, tallest, shortest, longest, shortest, features, quality .... Place side bets on whether the Boberg & Archangel will ever become more than vaporware, etc.

I eventually want to get one of these for everyday smartcarry, and it will be the Boberg if the Boberg ever comes to exist within 5 years. If it does not, then I want to compare the other options. Did I leave anything out in tiny, lightweight 9x19s?

Go! :)
 
I can only speak about the PM9 as it's the only one I have CCW experience with.

I tried the SmartCarry holster with my PM9 - it didn't work for me. (Anybody wanna buy a like new SmartCarry Standard holster?) I use a Milt Sparks Summer Special II IWB that I modified to carry appendix style (but still allows me to carry behind strong side hip IWB if I want to).

Good luck!
 
I carry the PM 9 in a Desantis front pocket holster everyday. Wear Docker shorts and a t shirt.The gun is amazing accurate for such a small gun. Must be that poly rifling.

I had the PF9 which was OK but the grips are very "aggressive" like non skid.
It did not thrill me so it's gone.

Also had the Rohrbaugh Stealth 9 and it fail to roar on many attempts. Went back to the factory 3 times and still did not work correctly. FTF, Stovepipes and magazine dropped out. The most expensive work of art that was a compete disappointment. I'd by 4 PF9's over it.

The Taurus looks like a nice design but I am not a Taurus fan.

Read the reviews on the PPS, do not think it is the Walther of long ago.

The CZ Rami was mentioned. It is a great gun but not "tiny" as mention by the OP. It's a bit chunky but I would take the alloy 75 compact or the new PO7 Duty, but now we are in bigger holster guns.
JMO
 
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Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow Please compare and contrast these seven, for everyday smartcarry CCW:
--Boberg XR9
--Rohrbaugh R9
--MSAR ArchAngel
--KelTec PF9
--Walther PPS
--Kahr PM9
--Taurus 709 SLIM
Heaviest, lightest, fattest, slimmest, tallest, shortest, longest, shortest, features, quality ....

Kind tough....actually impossible, to compare guns that actually exists vs guns that exist only on paper or dummy models.

Regarding dimensions, weight, etc the hard work has already been done and is stickied on this forum:
Pocket Autos
http://thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=171820

The Walther PPS and Taurus Slim are too large for the guns in the above chart. Compact Autos
http://mouseguns.com/CompactCompare.pdf

Here is an excellent website to do side by side comparisons of size and weight:
http://www.gunvgun.com/guns
 
Kind tough....actually impossible, to compare guns that actually exists vs guns that exist only on paper or dummy models.

I understand.... but dimensions at least can be compared, and weight, at least on the alleged specs put out by them on the prototypes.


Regarding dimensions, weight, etc the hard work has already been done and is stickied on this forum:
Pocket Autos
http://thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=171820

Yes, that's very good (thanks) for the Rohrbaugh, KT PF-9, and Kahr MK9, but I want to add the other 4 to the mix: The two vaporwares (which can be compared dimensionally), and the two that are too big (but not by much) to make the chart as you say - the Walther PPS and Taurus Slim. These two are small & light enough for Smart Carry for most people, even though they are NOT small enough for pocket carry for most people.

Here is an excellent website to do side by side comparisons of size and weight:
http://www.gunvgun.com/guns

Thanks - very nice!

Does the CZ RAMI count?

No thanks - single stacks only for me for Smartcarry; thanks. That's why the CPX-1, the P11, and others are not in the running.

By the way, as I type this, the Kahr P380 is what's in the pants (smartcarry), and it's my "jogging rig" (and temporarily an everyday rig). But since I sold my MK9, I want something in 9x19, but lighter than the MK9, for my everything-else-but-jogging everyday smartcarry. Obviously, the revolutionary Boberg is gonna be it if they get the bugs worked out and get it to market. But if not, I wanna take a look at the other 6.... I doubt that I'll go for the Rohrbaugh since it is so expensive. So, I will probably end up with a plastic fantastic in this category, if the Boberg doesn't appear: The Taurus, Walther, KelTec, or Kahr PM9.
 
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"compare and contrast"

I did that a few years ago. I bought, and carry daily, an R9. Heck, I bought it used - barely - too. It's so old it has the black carbon fiber grips on it.

John
 
Yes, but "a few years ago" only 2 of the other 6 (the KT PF9 and Kahr PM9) existed to compare to. Two of them still don't 'exist'. :p
 
I didn't like the Rohrbaugh R9, I never felt well armed with it and all its drawbacks, though I do like the heel release it had, it's more secure for pocket carry.

I feel a lot better with the Kahr PM9 and a spare 8rd mag weak side, though I wish it had a heel release instead. The MK9 is my fav, though not practical in slacks.

If Rohrbaugh releases a stainless framed version or the R45 I'd be interested.
 
Why not compare fictional firearms used in sci-fi books, too?

I mean, once the 'vaporware' guns become actual firearms, then they still need to be Beta-tested for 1-2 years before I'd be willing to invest in one, let alone consider using one as a dedicated defensive weapon.

On that note, diminutive size pistols chambered in the common defensive calibers need to demonstrate a high level of consistency when it comes to reliable functioning in order to be considered for dedicated defensive carry weapons. It sometimes seems that doesn't happen until a couple of years after their initial release. Then there's the potential ammunition sensitivity issues to consider in some reduced size platforms.

Personally, I don't like to consider firearms which haven't seen at least a reasonable amount of attention and usage by LE/Gov users. Those folks can come up with creative ways to abuse and break firearms which can sometimes confound engineers with their originality. Make a pistol which can withstand the abuse and attention of cops, and then you can brag about it. :neener:

Never handled a PF9. I have, however, seen more P11's fail to complete a 36-round qualification course of fire without functioning problems occur than I've seen pass one.

The last PM9 I handled and fired seemed to feed & function fine when I was shooting it, but the owner (another instructor) eventually got rid of it because it didn't demonstrate consistently reliable feeding for him. I didn't care for the characteristics of the felt recoil & controllability, and I definitely didn't care for trigger, but it was his gun and he just wanted me to try it for a while one day.

The PPS shares some characteristics with a platform I appreciate and respect when it's chambered in 9mm, which is the P99 series. It seems by listening to owners that they've probably outgrown their teething pains. I haven't asked anyone at Walther America about them because I already have a handful of excellent 9mm's which are only marginally larger from a practical perspective when it comes to my pocket/belt holster carry methods.

I don't see any firearms on that list that really meet the considerations I use at this time. At least not yet. The PPS might come closest ... but I'd want to run 300-500 rounds of some different defensive loads through one before I thought about spending my own money on one. Dunno yet.

While I'm offering opinions, I suppose I might as well say that I dislike lower abdomen/appendix carry almost as much as I do SOB carry methods ... so the whole Smartcarry consideration wouldn't come into play for me.

Just thought I'd share, anyway.
 
Bogerg??? Does someone actually have a production Boberg in their hands? If so tell us about it. If not, then lets not talk about them until/if they ever show up.
 
I'd love a Boberg, it looks so awesome, I love the design it's very innovative. The 3" version looks like a Kahr PM9 killer on paper.

On paper.

I'd like to personally put it through some trials, the videos look great. If he can put a 4" service length barrel with this design in the size of a Kahr PM9 and make it reliable, hell yes!
 
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"I didn't like the Rohrbaugh R9, I never felt well armed with it and all its drawbacks"

I haven't noticed any drawbacks. It works and meets my needs.

I'll never shoot it 101 times in one session like I did the first time out with it. Ouch. Why 101? I started shooting the third 50-rd. box and decided I'd had enough. It was reliable and pretty accurate. Great trigger, decent sights.

John
 
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