Cast my first 45-70's

Status
Not open for further replies.
J

jgh4445

Member
Joined
May 17, 2008
Messages
990
Location
South Alabama
I used a Lyman 457193 mold. I took 29 lbs of pure lead and added one lb of pure tin that I got from a lab ( not solder). I was expecting to get about 420 gr bullets, instead I got 405 to 406.7 for the 45 I cast. They filled out nicely and have a diameter or 459 to 460 pretty consistently. Got 'em in a pan of Gatefeo's best lube now. Now to cut some over the powder wads and hand prime some new Starline. One step at a time.
 
that stuff is addictive. I have a web belt full of cartridges I made on my old Lee single stage press. They pack a 405 bullet [from a Lee mold] Starline brass, Winchester Large Rifle primers, with some good ol' Goex under a cork paper wad, with a grease cookie on top, and a felt wad under the bullet for my Trapdoor carbine...
 
30/1 is a good alloy. Some fellow go as soft as 40/1, others like 20/1. Properly sized and lubed you should not experience leading in the barrel.
 
30:1 yields a Brinnel Hardness of about 5.5 (tested), and is entirely satisfactory when sent downrange at traditional 45-XX(X) velocities. It is perfect bullet & alloy to kill anything on this continent.

The OP mentioned over-powder wads so I presume both black powder and black powder-type soft lubes ( -- i.e., traditional)

~~~~~~~~~~~
BTW: My 457193's:
- When cast with #2 weigh 413gr.
- When cast of 30:1 weigh 422gr.
My 45-70 Guide Gun likes them.
My 45-90 John Bodine does not. (It likes the heavy stuff)
~~~~~~~~~~~
 
Correct assumption MEHarvey. I'm also wondering if I really need a wad as long as there is sufficient compression. Why does my 30:1 mixture weigh so much less than yours out of the same mold?
 
I recommend/use one or two 0.060 card wads to both protect
the bullet base and adjust the compression underneath them.
(Fired without that card, recovered bullets actually showed
the high-pressure stipple pattern of the powder itself.)
Since the base is all important, I stayed w/ the over-powder card.
(0.030" cards cut from milk cartons work too.)

Out of curiosity, what is the as-cast diameter of your bullets? (Mine are 0.460")
 
As cast is .459-60. Thought I'd try Goex and Swiss, both 2F both 65 gr by weight, 5 shots each with .060 and .030 with and without a circle of newsprint over the primer hole.
 
It is addictive. Wait til you start shooting them. I love re-loading BP cartridges and do so for my .45-70 trapdoor as well as loading .45 colt for a couple single actions.

For the .45-70 I also cast a pure lead 405 grain bullet, SPG lube, over-powder vegetable fiber card and load 60 grains of Goex 2f. Good stuff right there!
 
I understand milk carton wads are about .030 and the plain "ol cardboard on the back of a writing tablet will work for .060. Is this correct? Also took a .490 RB and slugged by barrel. Seemed like it was a bit tighter at the muzzle and at the breech than in the center. There was about a foot in the middle where I could push the slug thru by hand, then I had to tap it out as it got tight again at the breech end. Diameter was .457
 
Last edited:
jgh4445; I've been reloading for over 50 years, loaded commercially with annual production of 2.5 million rounds. What is the supposed purpose of news print over the primer hole. Come to think of it, I'm not sure what you mean by primer hole. Not trying to be a smart a$$, I've just never heard of it.
 
JHg, using a wad under the bullet helps protect the base of the bullet from the dimpling caused by the powder being slammed into it on ignition. Probably doesn't matter much as far as hunting accuracy/distance goes but it will make a difference when moving into longrange target work.
The new print wad may or may not help your accuracy, but as far as your main use of the rifle at them moment, it's just one more thing that will take up your time during the loading process.
Large pistol primers generally give a smoother ignition to blackpowder than large rifle primers, but in todays component supply world, use what ya got.And once again shooting close range the extra ES from the large rifle primers won't change the vertical in the groups enough to notice.
One that goex powder best to jump right on up to 70 or 75 grs. Keeping the powder charge up will help keep fouling troubles down.
 
jgh4445; I've been reloading for over 50 years, loaded commercially with annual production of 2.5 million rounds. What is the supposed purpose of news print over the primer hole. Come to think of it, I'm not sure what you mean by primer hole. Not trying to be a smart a$$, I've just never heard of it.
__________________
Click to expand...

It's a quite common thing for the bpcr target shooters to either use a newsprint wad over the flashhole, under the powder charge, or simply seat the primer into the pocket with a strip of newspaper. The thought is to lessen the flash of the primer and give a more uniform ignition to the powder charge.
Folks have been employing that practice for a number of years.
 
Thanks Don. I'll start with about 70 gr of goex and try 75 too. I poured 65 gr of Swiss in to an empty Starline case. Looked like in order to seat the bullet to the crimp line, it would take about 1/4 inch compression. Thats without any type of wad.
 
With the Swiss, I'ld start with just enough powder that there is firm contact between the wad/bullet and the powder, then work up. Some rifles Swiss will work well when compressed others, not so much.
Be sure to compress the powder before seating the bullet when the powder charge fills the case more than the bullet can set on comfortably. Otherwise you will be deforming the bullet nose, and that does nothing for accuracy, and will cause leading.
 
I just do .459 405gr bullets (around the 30:1 ratio) with beeswax/tallow lube in the grease groves of the bullet itself all over 55 grains of 2F BP. It works fantastic in my Winchester 1886 Extralight (insanely accurate load and pleasant on the shoulder). 45/70 loaded up with blackpowder is too much fun.
 
In my Springfield Trapdoor I prefer the hollow base 405 grain bullet cast by Rapine in a 60/1 configuration. The main reason for the hollow base bullet, when using a compressed load of 70 grains the 2F BP the base of the bullet will expand upon ignition causing the bullet to seal the bore. Therefore you get much better accuracy.

Also slightly opening the flash hole, off hand I can't remember the diameter, however very slightly will insure proper ignition. In fact that is the only way I've got any real accuracy out of the Springfield Trapdoor rifle. (8-10" at 500 yards) I also used SPG lube. Needless to say I never got any leading in the bore. Actually the load I described is a close MilSpec load used by the US Military back in the day.

You might try getting the booklet titled Loading Cartridges for the Original .45-70 Springfield Rifle and Carbine, by J.S and Pat Wolf
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

J
  • Locked
45-70 ammunition for my new rifle
Replies
18
Views
2K
jgh4445
J
J
  • Locked
Casting .45 colt
Replies
8
Views
1K
66gt350
6
S
  • Locked
Casting Balls
Replies
15
Views
1K
Palehorseman
P
M
  • Locked
Playing with my own cast Minies
Replies
4
Views
593
MCgunner
M
J
  • Locked
45-70 Crimping Question
Replies
12
Views
2K
Don McDowell
Don McDowell
Back
Top