Cheap reloading

[JohnMc]

Hey All,
I mis-remembered the primer limit as per building. It's what Gearhead Jim said, per residence and varies locally. I googled a little and it's the NFPA 495: Explosive Materials Code that I had read in the SAAMI primer storage pamphlet quite a while ago. This isn't US law, but it seems "many communities" have adopted the NFPA code as local law, according to some interweb sources.
Sorry about any confusion!

SAAMI primer pamphlet:
http://www.saami.org/specifications_and_information/publications/download/SAAMI_ITEM_201-Primers.pdf

 

[entropy]

Lee Loaders are the 'gateway drug' in reloading..........

 

[Lost Sheep]

Let's not get carried away here. A $90.00 ammo press that works? This is true. Acceptable for a beginner? yes. First class? Um sorry....no.

You get what you pay for.

Lee does make the worlds finest high quality dippers, I will admit that. Of course no one else makes them because, why would they? A huge demand for dippers?

Well, it is indisputable that the Lee Classic Turret is the best auto-indexing 4-station turret press in current production anywhere in the known universe. (Do not confuse the Classic with the somewhat inferior Lee Deluxe Turret, nor their lightweight aluminum "C" frame Reloader press.) The Classic Turret is cast iron with a respectable linkage and a large-diameter ram.

Of course, no other manufacturer makes an auto-indexing turret press currently.

It is not as strong as a Redding, but we are talking about straight-walled pistol cartridges, not swaging bullets or even large caliber rifle cartridges.

When I decided my Lee Progressives (Pro-1000) were not to my liking (more like a nightmare every time I used them, but that is just MY experience - I am not suited to progressive presses) I did a LOT of research to find the best gear money could buy that filled my needs and style. A few hundred rounds a month, multiple calibers and I put my gear away after every loading session.

So, yeah, my Lee Classic Turret is the core of my loading bench. That, an an RCBS 10-10 scale. Both first-class.

Lost Sheep

p.s. The Lee Dippers (in my opinion) are not first-class. They have a couple of flaws that would have been easy to fix in their initial design. The angle of the handle and the shape of the bottom both mandate against the way Richard Lee says they should be used. Lee dropped the ball on those.

p,p,s. It is worth noting that Lee's warranty has a time limit. RCBS and Dillon (I am not sure about the others) warranties are lifetime, virtually or literally no questions asked, original owner or 50th. Lifetime of the tool, not lifetime of the owner. That is spelled "forever". You pay for that, too, and it is worth it if you ever need it.

 

[Scooter22]

The OP wants to dip his toe into reloading a couple boxes here and there. And you guys got him up to 5,6,700 bucks of reloading equipment!? The Hand Press w/priming, a set of Lee dies and components will allow good, basic reloading. An quality reloads. The Lee Dippers work fine if you use them correctly. Sheesh.

 

[Lost Sheep]

The OP wants to dip his toe into reloading a couple boxes here and there. And you guys got him up to 5,6,700 bucks of reloading equipment!? The Hand Press w/priming, a set of Lee dies and components will allow good, basic reloading. An quality reloads. The Lee Dippers work fine if you use them correctly. Sheesh.

Well, you are right. We are showing him his future. Maybe a year or so down the road.

OK, then. Back to basics and more focused on the original question. But I note that the O.P. did ask for advice and thoughts without specifying any limits. We have for the most part tried to stay economical.

For the present, getting started safely with versatility, a scale added to the Lee Loader is an essential in my opinion. Add $30

The one dipper with the Loader is limiting. Though, with a scale, one dipper and a teaspoon is workable. Without a scale, a full set of dippers opens up many options, even without a scale. Add $15.

So, $80 for the Loader ($40), a scale ($30) and a mallet ($10) plus stuff you can find laying around the house (teaspoon, dropcloth, etc) and your eye and ear protection will get you started. More stuff can be added as you find the need or desire for more speed, versatility, control, or convenience. Also things like bullet puller and calipers which some consider "must-haves".

For the advocates of presses over the Loader, adding $35 (subtract the $40 for Loader and add 75 for a cheap press and dies) to $75 (subtract $40 for the Loader and add $115) for a better press and dies) seems like a reasonable and fore-thinking move. In the larger scheme of things the difference between $80 now plus upgrading to a press later weighed against $155 now seems little enough.

And yes, the dippers work just fine for meting powder. I always use a scale to verify the load recipe. The dippers for production.

Lost Sheep

 

[Scooter22]

Heres what I'm looking at: (These are regular prices. They are on sale regularly for 10-20% less.)

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/650614/lee-breech-lock-hand-press-kit
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/418312/lee-carbide-3-die-set-38-special-357-magnum
Or
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/309802/lee-deluxe-carbide-4-die-set-38-special-357-magnum

You can load good standard cartridges with just this plus components. But you have to figure components with any loading system. The dippers will give a wider load/powder selection of safe loads.
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/943305/lee-improved-powder-measure-kit

I'm just giving a another, better, option to the 'Original Lee Loader" without going full bore. Lots of great advise but I see a lot of expensive loading equipment for sale from those who don't like it. I like my hand press and dippers for simple cast bullet loads instead of the bench and 3 presses and all that goes with it in the basement. KISS seems to be more my style these days.

 

[hdwhit]

Entropy said that the Lee Loader was the "gateway drug" for reloading and that's completely accurate.

I got started loading 30 Carbine with a Lee Loader. It worked quite well, but was tedious. It led me to getting an RCBS press and I never looked back.

If the OP knows all he is going to be doing is loading a box of cartridges at a time and that it's not going to increase from there, then the Lee Loader is the way to go.

On the other hand, if he may find the amount of his shooting growing or the number of cartridges expanding, then he would be best off to skip the Lee Loader and plow that money into a regular press, set of dies and accessories and fully immerse in the hobby.

 

[thomas15]

You have to really consider that given the amount of time and effort needed to make ammo with the wack-a-mole tool that most of those who might use this device would be better off just using factory ammo. Especially those who shoot handguns.

 

[AlfonsDeWolf]

Thank you ALL for your input. Lots of info here to get me thinking. @Lost Sheep, you were especially lengthy and thorough. Hope you find your lambs

 

[gwpercle]

A lot of us got started with them. They do work and are fun to use .
I started with a 38 special it was $9.99 then, powder , primers and bullets (cast lead were cheapest) and I was hooked. Now a full fledged card carrying bullet casting reloading junkie.
If you get tired of the pounding and noise , and decide to upgrade , the little Lee Hand Press is quite " handy " . I can reload in the house ( even at my office desk ) with it .
I got that first Lee basic kit in 1969 and still have it , and still think it's a neat little kit. I think it's a great way to learn the reloading basics.
Gary

 

[Buck13]

As others have said, if you are short on space and don't want a bench-mounted press, the Lee Hand Press is probably a WAY better idea than a Lee Loader. Even with the hand press, I kinda shudder after each magazine with an auto pistol over how much longer it takes to load them than to shoot them. Slightly less so with a revolver, since I usually shoot SA unless I'm doing timed fire, but even then, I can shoot a lot more in an hour than I can load in an hour.

The Lee Loader seems like it would be OK if you wanted to load ammo for nothing more than a couple of sighting trips to the range each year and some hunting. Call me lazy, but I would despair if I had to load all my ammo by that process.

With the hand press and the bare minimum in other cheap gear (scale, caliper, dies, kinetic puller, primers, powder, bullets*), you can set up to load a single caliber for maybe $250 dollars, and you can store everything in a single boot box. Shooting 9 mm it would take you a while to make that up, but in more expensive calibers the break-even point would come pretty quickly.

*assumes you already have some used brass, can make a powder dipper out of a brass case soldered to a wire handle and cut to the right length, make a loading block out of a scrap of 2x4, etc...

 

[Reloadron]

You load 50 rounds or so a month? The Whack A Mole as we call what you linked to will work fine. However, if I were you I would go with the Lee Breech Lock Hand Press Kitwhich will make things go much easier for a few bucks more. If you do not care for the kit I would just get the hand press only for a few bucks less. Find a suitable powder dipper for what you need and that's about it.

Ron

 

[Scooter22]

Couple things not mentioned. The cost of the components you buy is the same whether you have a 100.00 dollar press or a 1000.00 dollar one. The other is the quality or reliability of the reloads is the same. The slower single stage operations is more hands on and many times more consistent than fast produced progressives. But progressives make fine ammo. I'm just pointing out you don't need real expensive reloading tools to make good reloads.

 

[styles]

Definitely get the hand press for 50 or 100 rounds.

 

[Lost Sheep]

So, we have recommendations for a 50 to 100-round per session loader.

The mallet-driven tool is least expensive (just under $100 once you add a scale) and can deliver 50 rph (rounds per hour) once you get facile with it.

Hand press with dies and a scale for $120 or so and quieter than the mallet driven tool and a bit safer (and less unnerving to witnesses). Takes a bit more storage space than the mallet tool but is a bit more controllable.

Bench-mounted press (not necessarily requiring a bench, but a board and a drawer in a nightstand will do) for $150. About the same storage space required as the hand press, better leverage and much more upgradeable than either the Mallet tool or the hand press.

Bench-mounted compound leverage press (also not necessarily requiring a bench, but a board and a drawer in a nightstand will do) for $170. About the same storage space required as the cheaper bench press, a LOT better leverage and equally more upgradeable as either the cheaper bench press.

A Lee Classic Turret (or other turret press) is another step up. It might be beyond your need of the next two years or so. Only you can decide.

Consider that your shooting will likely increase when you discover how easy it is to reload, the greater investment will likely yield the greater satisfaction. But that is your decision and will be based on your self-knowledge and ability to predict your future. None of us here are likely qualified on those two counts. We can only project our own experiences and experiences of those we have mentored or known.

I gave you my experience in post 24. My advice is to buy for your near future, not for you present needs.

Good luck and God Bless

Lost Sheep

Here are the offerings of each type that I can deliver off the top of my head

Lee Mallet Tool or Lyman Tong Tool

Lee Loader Press. Simple leverage, aluminum "C" frame, not very strong, but adequate for any pistol cartridges.

Lee Challenger Press. Compound leverage, but not the highest leverage. Aluminum "O" frame. RCBS Jr and Pardner presses are comparable as I recall. A bit of overkill, but will make it so easy to load more that you will very probably shoot more. A classic case of your need expanding to fill your capacity to meet it. Remember high-school chemistry? "A gas will expand to fill the container it is in."

Lee's Turret Presses (Deluxe and the superior Classic Turret). Other makers' turret presses MAY be stronger, but no others offer auto-indexing. Overkill unless you really get into a multiple of your current shooting volume.

Lee's Classic SIngle-Stage, RCBS Summt and RockChucker and any Lyman, Hornady etc. single-stage press. Definitely overkill for your current needs.

Anybody's progressive press. WAY overkill for your needs, and now the option of mounting on a board wedged in a nightstand drawer is definitely out.