Deep dings in .308 cases??

Status
Not open for further replies.
forestswin

forestswin

Member
Joined
Aug 26, 2013
Messages
173
Location
Maryland
Deep dings in .308 cases?? Traces of brass found

I am getting these dings on the side of my cases.
Anyone have any idea what's happening?

closeup%20308ding_zps1bjtdrl8.jpg

cases_zps4neem0gm.jpg

70fb4e6d-86a6-4769-9732-71f4f9f19bb2_zpsopjkpkvx.jpg

They are being shot out of a Winchester Model 100, semi-auto in 308
There is a removable magazine that holds 4 rounds.

Some of these cases were factory new and some were reloaded and fired by me for their second firing.

I'm loading 44 to 46 grains of IMR 4064 and using a Speer 150 grain SP bullet.
The gun shoots and cycles fine.
But the ding is a little too deep for me to consider reloading them again.

Any help is appreciated
 
Last edited:
The easiest solution would be to visually check the chamber and make sure there are no irregularities there, then maybe using some dummy rounds check the feeding and extraction cycles to make sure the cases are not impacting some sharp edge inside the gun. It looks like the brass might be hitting a sharp edge at soe point during its rearward travel based on the direction of the indent.
 
I have a Model 100 and it used to ding cases (which I reloaded without any problems), but those look more like they've been gouged or cut.

I took my rifle to an older 'smith who was knowledgeable about M-100's and he stoned the extractor or ejector (maybe both?) and the problem went away.

Does yours tend to "double" when fired from a benchrest?
 
Cycling 4 dummy rounds by operating the slide by hand does not make these gouges. I've done it numerous times, so I'm guessing it's gouging under higher forces

The gun is old, but new to me. I've fired about 40 factory rounds and 6 reloads which cases were shot in a different rifle. I saw these gouges as I was prepping the brass that was fired from this rifle.

Thanks for the replies. I'll check out nulineguns

I've heard about doubles, but no, I haven't experience it.

I'll disassemble and see if anymore can be learned, before it's off to a gunsmith.

Because there really is a clear direction of the gouge , another thought I had was the case rim of the round being chambered was gouging the case underneath it as the bullet was angling up into the chamber.
 
Last edited:
If you take a sharpie pen and mark the brass then hand load the rifle with the mark pointing up. When you retrieve the brass, you should be able to narrow down the location on the rifle that is making the gouge.
 
You should be able to see brass tracks on the receiver at the location the brass it hitting it during ejection.

rc
 
If you haven't disassembled your M-100 before, do a search for some instructions before you do.

It's not difficult, but it's not particularly intuative either.
 
My M1 does something similar; empties smacking something (receiver, op rod, etc.) as it's ejected. Hand cycling will not reproduce this "problem" as it's way too slow, and I've noticed it varies with the load. I just make sure the integrity of the case isn't violated (howz dat fer gud englees? :p) and inspect all brass closely. No problems so far (roughly 1K reloads)...
 
My observation is that most semis will bugger up the brass somewhere on ejection. Some the neck, some the shoulder. I never have seen marks exactly like yours, but I'll bet it's from the ejection port. Should be leaving a brass trace.
 
I have a Win Model 100 and mine makes the same marks on brass. I just reload them and shoot. Doesn't cause me any problems. BTW OP has your Model 100 had the firing pin replaced. If it hasn't you need to google "model 100 firing pin recall" and contact Winchester to get a replacement sent to you.
 
Rule - I'll get the spring kit and replace all the springs.....as you say "will not hurt" and the kit is less than $40

judge - I tried that with hand cycling 4 dummies - I didn't see any marks - I think I'll disassemble and look some more and try shooting "live" ammo after I replace the springs

rc / judgedelta - I didn't see any trace of brass - but, cycling the dummies may have knocked it off (SCRATCH THIS LINE)

Sunray - relative to the case thickness, at the gouge location, the cases have more than 50% section loss. I plan on finding out more before I shoot another round in this gun even with new cases - I'm not saying I'm going to trash these cases - I just need to know more. Heck, cartridge cases are really only designed for one firing - so, as reloaders, its a good idea to know about the forces, strengths and weaknesses involved.

Swampman - Yes, I disassembled this gun before - there are quite a few good video's out there

mdi - no, you're right, it seems the hand cycling is getting me nowhere. I plan on cutting open a case to see more about the gouge

CarJunkie - have you noted any change to a gouge on subsequent firings? and are you now seeing multiple gouges ? yes, I got the new firing pin and installed it earlier

UPON FURTHER REVIEW AND A BETTER FLASHLIGHT - I DID FIND SOME TRACES OF BRASS
I'LL GET SOME PICTURES AND POST THEM IN A LITTLE WHILE
 
Last edited:
as some suggested - I should see some traces of brass resulting from these dings

I did not notice the yellow color until I took it outside under sun light
now its easy to see:banghead:

anyway
here are some pictures

I'd appreciate any advice

it appears that some filing has aleady been done to that corner

MODEL%20100%204_zpscycchfsv.jpg

m100%201_zpselmeqinh.jpg

MODEL%20100%203_zpstc35c3uh.jpg

MODEL%20100%204_zpscycchfsv.jpg
 
I can't be certain, but that looks like it is inside the locking lug recess in the receiver. Due to its close proximity to the chamber, and that brass doesn't bend enough (while ⅔ or more of it is in the chamber) to cause that marking depicted there, and that the recess is well out of line of the extraction path, I don't think that is the culprit, or cause of your brass hickeys.
 
Is pic #2 the same area as the other pics?

Put one of the fired cases in there does it line up and have the same coefficient of angle of ding?;)
 
They usually get dinged on the outer edges of the ejection port somewhere.

That brass mark is from the case being drug past it when ejecting. And, as posted, the brass can't get at the correct angle there to get dinged like that.
 
It probably is not the cause but look at the bolt face" or extractor area. It seems all chewed up on the edge.??

I agree the brass is being flung and hitting the ejection area somewhere which is why I guess a worn spring is allowing it to recoil to fast or violently.

I hope the folks at Nuline might have an answer or a direction to look for you.

Have you resized any of the brass, does it do anything to the dings? Can you feel the ding inside the case with a paper clip or dental tool or cut one open??
 
I think some disassembling is in order.

I'll be back with more pictures tomorrow!

Thanks for everyone's time so far!:)
 
My M1 does something similar; empties smacking something (receiver, op rod, etc.) as it's ejected.
Click to expand...
It's designed to do that -- look at the leading edge of the operating rod hump and you'll see brass marks.

When the cartridge extracts it's moving straight backward. The ejector pushes it sideways, and the op rod hump hits it as it is leaving the action and gives it a forward impulse. If it did not hit the op rod hump, it would come almost straight back -- which would be bad for a left-handed shooter.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

W
  • Locked
Case heads dinged/dented
Replies
6
Views
551
cfullgraf
cfullgraf
S
  • Locked
Is any size of case dent or ding acceptable when reloading 1x fired brass?
Replies
8
Views
1K
sauer1911
S
M
  • Locked
Once-Fired .223
Replies
10
Views
923
243winxb
243winxb
C
Split casings
Replies
22
Views
600
JCSC
JCSC
Tempus Tom
  • Locked
.308 vs .309 in Jacketed Bullets
Replies
6
Views
788
Charlie98
Charlie98
Back
Top