Getting to my children upstairs

[RiveraRa]

We just purchased a new house and the master bedroom is downstairs toward the back of the house. The staircase is near the front of the house and the children (3 years old and 1 year old) sleep upstairs.

If someone is trying to break into our house, what is the best way to "bunker down"? Grab the wife, a gun, and a phone and head to the kids room? Take the wife, gun, and phone to grab the kids and bring them back down to the master bedroom? Any other options? The only other I can think of is to meet the intruder with a shotgun as he comes in. What do you think is the best option? Have I missed other options? Advantages/disadvantages to those options? Thanks!

 

[skidmark]

Is there a way to turn the staircase into a chokepoint? What kind of cover can you use there? What kind of cover do you have getting there?

Is it possible to control the staiway and front entrance from the master bedroom, so you do not have to move towards the front of the house?

If you can control access to the stairway, you might be better served NOT moving towards your kids, or moving your kids. Being on the 2nd floor isolates them from many dangers posed by home invasion. I would be more concerned about their ability to escape from the 2nd floor in the case of a fire - especially if you and your wife are cut off from access to the stairway. Are they old enough to be trained in getting out of the house without using the stairs? Do you have escape routes built into the house design, or escape ladders installed? (BTW, those that hook over the windowsill and dangle are a bear to use even as an adult - they can be impossible for young kids.)

A note for all who are concerned about home defense. Sometimes leaving the home is a better move than staying put and defending in place. It all depends on how difficult you have made it for somebody to get in, and to get into individual rooms once they are inside (metal doors, deadbolts & hardened drames on exterior doors, hardened frames & various latches on interior doors, etc.).

stay safe.

skidmark

 

[Fred Fuller]

Is there another bedroom upstairs where you could sleep? Moving up there would solve your proximity problem in the most decisive fashion possible. And you'd already be up there in case the smoke alarms went off too, to help your kids get out of the house- a statistically more likely emergency than a home invasion. Kids as young as yours WILL need help in an evacuation.

The top of your stair case is by far the most advantageous position you have from which to defend your children upstairs- you should not yield it lightly.

No matter what, you need to harden the perimeter of your home as much as possible- doors, windows, any means of ingress/egress. That means upstairs as well as downstairs. Locks on windows, good solid doors with first class locks, reinforced hinges and strike plates on the doors, motion detector interior and exterior lighting, a good alarm system, cameras etc. No one should be able to get into your home without 1) making a LOT of noise, and 2) being significantly delayed in the attempt.

Get a dog.

Get a dog.

Get a dog. Got it? Your kids will love it. And a good dog is a self-mobile alarm and intruder deterrent.

Work on your emergency planning for fires, storms, power outages, as well as intruders. You should have a Plan A, a Plan B and an UhOh Plan in case the first two don't work out. You should actively drill your plans so every family member is familiar with them.

If it is too disruptive to family harmony to give up the master bedroom and move upstairs with the children, your plan IMHO should definitely be for you and your wife to stage a careful deliberate move to the upstairs. You should be fully prepared to encounter an intruder or intruders along the way, if indications are strong that entry has been accomplished- which is the only reason you should be on the move. Having a hardened perimeter, a dog and an alarm system activated at night will help you confirm that 'bump in the night' is really something to be concerned about.

In preparation you should set up a safe area upstairs. By arranging furniture you should provide an area that is safe from incoming fire for your wife and children to bunker down in. You should have both a landline phone AND a cell phone there, just in case. Intruders can cut a phone line before entry or disable your phones by taking a downstairs extension off the hook. A working cell phone is a necessary backup, even a working cell phone with no service can still call 911. Perhaps a remote control for the alarm panel can be located there too, as well as remote control for downstairs lighting (X-10 controllers or the like).

You will want to find a place that lets you cover the top of the stairs, preferably from a prone position and from behind cover.

You'll need a spare set of house keys, front door and back door keys clearly marked and attached to a chemical light stick, to activate and throw down to LEOs when they arrive. That way they can gain entry without having to break in.

I strongly suggest taking the NRA's Personal Protection In The Home class (PPITH), or at least get the manual and/or see the training video. I also like Louis Awerbuck's Safe At Home video. Here are the links:

PPITH class locator: http://www.nrahq.org/education/training/basictraining.asp

PPITH Manual- http://www.nrastore.com/nra/Product.aspx?productid=PB+01781

PPITH DVD- http://materials.nrahq.org/go/product.aspx?productid=ES 26840

Safe At Home video- http://www.paladin-press.com/detail.aspx?ID=1500

Hope this helps,

lpl/nc

 

[Eyesac]

I heard once that you should get a dog...

Yeah, I'd use that staircase for holding off the ninjas till the cops come.

 

[RiveraRa]

Thanks all!
A fire plan was going to be my next question

I do have a direct path to the front door and staircase from the master bedroom with some good cover as well, so it seems like my best option in that situation would be to stay put and control that area.

We plan on getting a dog. Were doing some research on that now actually. Our oldest has been asking for a while.

We have an alarm system. I havent thought about a remote for it though. Good idea.

I would like to get some x-10 lighting but cant afford that yet. Outside flood lights and cameras will come first.

As for the fire plan, what other options are there for escape ladders other than those hook over the side ones? Actually any ladder might be a little hard for our kids to climb out of on their own accord. Our 3 year old might but our 1 year old probably wouldn't. I've already started teaching my 3 year old gun and knife safety so I guess I need to start teaching him fire safety as well. Any other advice on topic of escape plans would be great! Thanks!

 

[bowl443]

What kind of dog are you thinking of getting??

Also, we had the same setup when I was a kid and living with my parents.. We actually had a laundry drop in the upstairs bathroom that went down to the landry room downstairs. This was perfect for me and my sister to go down for a quick escape and be with my parents..
This is probably not plausible for you to do, but it might be something for you to think about.

 

[Fred Fuller]

There's no way I could leave two kids that young alone upstairs when bad stuff was happening in the house. I'd have to be where I could be sure where they were and that they were OK, it's just my nature.

A doctor friend built an interesting house a couple years ago. His boys (3 and 5 right now) sleep upstairs too, while he and his wife are downstairs. But there are no front stairs in the house. The stairway upstairs is right outside the master bedroom door near the back door. He says when the boys get older, no one is sneaking upstairs without him knowing it . But it also gives the adults a quick access upstairs if it's needed. Their dog's an aging Australian shepherd, and no one will be sneaking into that house unannounced while she's around.

Failing a move to sleep upstairs, I'd have to be planning on going upstairs in case something happened. If the stairs are near the front door, there's no guarantee an intruder wouldn't head straight up the stairs after gaining entry- and maybe do it before you could get there. That would leave you essentially outflanked, with the intruder upstairs with your kids and you downstairs. Thinking about that makes me shiver, frankly. That's why I say i'd HAVE to get upstairs and get eyeballs on the kids before I could be comfortable.

I am the last person to suggest moving armed around in a house where you strongly suspect intruders have gained access. The ONLY way I'd suggest such a thing is the necessity of getting to minor children and getting them secured. Houseclearing is a dangerous business even for professionals, and is certainly nothing to be taken lightly. It's hairy. By yourself it is nigh suicidal. And stairs are about the most dangerous thing you can try to clear.

But I see no choice other than to get upstairs one way or another. If your downstairs closet is located under an upstairs closet, I'd even suggest thinking about installing a pull-down attic type ladder or the like, to get access to the upstairs without having to go up the front stairs. One more thing to think about...

As to X-10 controllers and modules, they aren't terribly expensive and install merely by plugging them into existing outlets. Look at the Remote Lighting Starter Kit at http://www.x10.com/products4/overture/home_automation_ps_nox.html ($19.99) as an example.

As to escape plans, you really do need to have an additional means of egress from the upstairs. Escape ladders of various types are one option. You may need to put a Snugli or the like in the little one's bedroom as part of the escape equipment. That way you can carry the child and still keep your hands free for climbing. The older child can climb down almost on top of you so you can provide security coming down, 'cupping' him/her between yourself and the ladder as you both come down. It's something that can be practiced if you decide to do something like that.

There are programs for that sort of thing too- search "Learn Not To Burn" on your favorite search engine for program materials. And talk to your local fire department about possible options and their specific reommendations.

hth,

lpl/nc

 

[spyder1911]

If there is only is only one staircase I would saw go upstairs. This means that you only have one way you would need to watch and could yell down for the intruder to get out. IMHO you should find a choke point like skidmark said, which the stairs would be perfect.

Some things to think of are:
How well would your wife/kids listen under stress?
How well can you see/function at 1am when awoken by a strange noise?
Do the kids sleep in 1 room or 2?
How many stairwells are there?
Can you get a good angle of fire w/o presenting yourself?
Is your wife a shooter? Does she have a weapon?
Where are your weapons? What if you are in a different room when you hear a noise?

 

[mekender]

if the kids are still young, get a couple of stair gates.. .one at the top and one at the bottom... get 2 different kinds... any one trying to get into the house will play hell trying to get through them... ive got 2 in my house that ive had for over a year and i still futz around every day trying to open em... someone that isnt super familiar with them will never get em open before they can be intercepted

 

[Blue Line]

escape ladder

I just bought an escape ladder from Home Depot for our upstairs. Its for evac if there's a fire. It would be useful in any home situation that you need to get off the 2nd floor, fire, bad guys etc. It hooks over the edge and just drop it. It has the First Alert brand on it the same as the fire extingusher/smoke alarm. I have shown my kids how to use it and and we all have duties in the event of an emergency, one of which is to get the ladder out the window.

 

[Jeff B.]

if the kids are still young, get a couple of stair gates.. .one at the top and one at the bottom... get 2 different kinds... any one trying to get into the house will play hell trying to get through them... ive got 2 in my house that ive had for over a year and i still futz around every day trying to open em... someone that isnt super familiar with them will never get em open before they can be intercepted

Darn if that is not true. I wiped one out when younger and less patient. Couldn't seem to open it, kid was howling (should have know it wasn't serious) and I attempted to hurdle it. Almost made it. We got a better one anyhow.

Jeff B.

 

[JoeLad]

I'm a firefighter. Interiors stairs are the best means of egress in a fire. If the fire is on the first floor blocking your egress, stay upstairs, close all upstairs doors, and move near a window. Solid wood interior doors can slow down the spread of fire.

If you're lucky the response time from the FD is good. I live and work in Philadelphia. 3-5 minute response times are our norm. We place ladders for ventilation and rescue, with one FF with a thermal imaging camera searching the interior for victims. His first egress route is the interior stairs, second is out a window to a waiting ladder.

Fold out ladders that hook over your windowsill are not recommended by us simply for the reason that not everyone in the house can use it. Try climbing down that thing while holding an infant or toddler. Not an easy thing to do. You risk both of you falling. We don't place faith in "tot finder" decals either.

If you live in an area where you rely on volunteers who have long response times, I recommend developing and practicing a home fire escape plan. And don't forget smoke detectors, lots of them. Buy the hybrid type that work with both smoke and heat.

The best defense against a dwelling fire is common sense.

 

[hso]

You can not expect a small child (under 8) to be able to use an escape ladder, in a fire, in the dark, having just been awakened from a sound sleep. You can not expect you or your wife to be able to get your small children out of the house using an escape ladder. Think about trying to carry either child down a ladder in the dark. Now think about doing that using the wobbly escape ladders available.

You can not expect that you will wake up before the BG is already on the stairs. It it entirely possible that you would not wake up in time and be coherent enough to get from your room to the stairs in time. You can take steps to reduce that possibility, though. Harden and secure the perimeter of your home to prevent break ins. Put up motion lights outside. Slow them down. Use a monitored alarm system so that break ins do not go undetected and so that fires/smoke do not go undetected. Keep them from getting in quietly. A dog helps with both of the previous.

Why can't you move upstairs?

 

[sloppyjoec]

+1... make that more than one on the baby gate being a barrier, it won't stop anyone, bit will slow anyone down, maybe putt bells on it, also the dog, my pit makes a bark or two for anyone at the front door, my brother has a Yorkie that starts ww3 as soon as we pull into his driveway, and the little dog does not make homeowners insurance nervous