RealGun
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The Bush administration's two top law enforcement officials on Tuesday urged Congress to renew every provision of the anti-terror Patriot Act.
Washington Post story
Washington Post story
Gonzales Proposes Patriot Act Renewal
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Senator Larry Craig wants to curb Patriot Act
If this is important to you - either for it or not - contact your Senators now.
source http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7388717/
The Patriot Act is the post-Sept. 11 law that expanded the government’s surveillance and prosecutorial powers against suspected terrorists, their associates and financiers. Most of the law is permanent, but 15 provisions will expire in December unless renewed by Congress.
On the same day Gonzales was speaking to the Senate committee, Sens. Larry Craig, R-Idaho, and Dick Durbin, D-Ill., planned to reintroduce legislation designed to curb major parts of the Patriot Act that they say went too far.
“Cooler heads can now see that the Patriot Act went too far, too fast and that it must be brought back in line with the Constitution,†said Gregory Nojeim, associate director of the American Civil Liberties Union’s Washington legislative office.
The ACLU is part of an unusual coalition of liberal and conservative groups, including the American Conservative Union, that have come together in a joint effort to lobby Congress to repeal key provisions of the Patriot Act.
'Library provision' is controversial
Among the controversial provisions is a section permitting secret warrants for “books, records, papers, documents and other items†from businesses, hospitals and other organizations.
That section is known as the “library provision†by its critics. While it does not specifically mention bookstores or libraries, critics say the government could use it to subpoena library and bookstore records and snoop into the reading habits of innocent Americans.
Gonzales told lawmakers Tuesday the provision has been used 35 times, but never to obtain library, bookstore, medical or gun sale records.
But the criticism has led five states and 375 communities in 43 states to pass anti-Patriot Act resolutions, the ACLU says.
Even some Republicans are concerned. Senate Judiciary Chairman Arlen Specter, R-Pa., has suggested it should be tougher for federal officials to use that provision.
Gonzales already has agreed to two minor changes to the provision, and was expected to support giving someone who receives a secret warrant under the provision the right to consult a lawyer and challenge the warrant in court. He was expected to also back slightly tightening the standard for issuing subpoenas.
Bigger concerns
Neither change addresses the central concern of opponents, which is that it allows the government to seize records of people who are not suspected terrorists or spies.
Critics say the law allows the government to target certain groups, but the Justice Department counters that no Patriot Act-related civil rights abuses have been proven.
Just in case, Craig and Durbin want Congress to curb both expiring and nonexpiring parts of the Patriot Act, including the expiring “library†provision and “sneak and peek†or delayed notification warrants. Those warrants — which will not expire in December — allow federal officials to search suspects’ homes without telling them until later.
The Justice Department said federal prosecutors have asked for 155 such warrants since 2001.
That's just two-tenths of one percent of all search warrants, but their use is growing. The warrants were sought 47 times between the time the law was passed and April of 2003. Since then, it's been invoked 108 times.
If this is important to you - either for it or not - contact your Senators now.
source http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7388717/
The Patriot Act is the post-Sept. 11 law that expanded the government’s surveillance and prosecutorial powers against suspected terrorists, their associates and financiers. Most of the law is permanent, but 15 provisions will expire in December unless renewed by Congress.
On the same day Gonzales was speaking to the Senate committee, Sens. Larry Craig, R-Idaho, and Dick Durbin, D-Ill., planned to reintroduce legislation designed to curb major parts of the Patriot Act that they say went too far.
“Cooler heads can now see that the Patriot Act went too far, too fast and that it must be brought back in line with the Constitution,†said Gregory Nojeim, associate director of the American Civil Liberties Union’s Washington legislative office.
The ACLU is part of an unusual coalition of liberal and conservative groups, including the American Conservative Union, that have come together in a joint effort to lobby Congress to repeal key provisions of the Patriot Act.
'Library provision' is controversial
Among the controversial provisions is a section permitting secret warrants for “books, records, papers, documents and other items†from businesses, hospitals and other organizations.
That section is known as the “library provision†by its critics. While it does not specifically mention bookstores or libraries, critics say the government could use it to subpoena library and bookstore records and snoop into the reading habits of innocent Americans.
Gonzales told lawmakers Tuesday the provision has been used 35 times, but never to obtain library, bookstore, medical or gun sale records.
But the criticism has led five states and 375 communities in 43 states to pass anti-Patriot Act resolutions, the ACLU says.
Even some Republicans are concerned. Senate Judiciary Chairman Arlen Specter, R-Pa., has suggested it should be tougher for federal officials to use that provision.
Gonzales already has agreed to two minor changes to the provision, and was expected to support giving someone who receives a secret warrant under the provision the right to consult a lawyer and challenge the warrant in court. He was expected to also back slightly tightening the standard for issuing subpoenas.
Bigger concerns
Neither change addresses the central concern of opponents, which is that it allows the government to seize records of people who are not suspected terrorists or spies.
Critics say the law allows the government to target certain groups, but the Justice Department counters that no Patriot Act-related civil rights abuses have been proven.
Just in case, Craig and Durbin want Congress to curb both expiring and nonexpiring parts of the Patriot Act, including the expiring “library†provision and “sneak and peek†or delayed notification warrants. Those warrants — which will not expire in December — allow federal officials to search suspects’ homes without telling them until later.
The Justice Department said federal prosecutors have asked for 155 such warrants since 2001.
That's just two-tenths of one percent of all search warrants, but their use is growing. The warrants were sought 47 times between the time the law was passed and April of 2003. Since then, it's been invoked 108 times.
Vernal45
member
The patriot act needs to be flushed, and fast. That "sneak and peek" sh*t scares the hell out of me. Makes me have dreams of goose stepping people with warrant disks in their hands.
What terrorists have they caught and what attacks have been thwarted by use of this act?
It is an empirical question. If you say, it is all secret and we wouldn't know - I don't believe that - Busn would be screaming from the roof tops if they stopped a major plot.
Stupidity let 9/11 happen. Does the bill stop that?
It is an empirical question. If you say, it is all secret and we wouldn't know - I don't believe that - Busn would be screaming from the roof tops if they stopped a major plot.
Stupidity let 9/11 happen. Does the bill stop that?
Standing Wolf
Member in memoriam
That's a Big Secret—"B.S." for short.
Gonzales has admitted that they used some of the provisions that would sunset to accuse and imprison the Washington State attorney who was accused of being involved in the Madrid train bombing and later cleared and released....
Jeff
Jeff
OP
OP
RealGun
Member
There are similarities between Pearl Harbor and 9/11. Both occurred because of too many channels of communication, uncoordinated efforts among bureaucratic fiefdoms, and a belief that bad things happening was unlikely. There are also similarities re civil rights in how the nation reacted to the events.
As far as I know, civil rights oversight lies entirely with the Executive branch, i.e. they can do anything they want as long as it's funded. A revised Patriot Act should provide for Congressional Committee oversight of civil rights. I think I am correct that such a provision was dropped in conference committee from The Homeland Security Act at the end of the last session. That was a Senate provision, so if it is going to make it with the Patriot Act renewal, the provision would have to be included in the House bill, passing through readily in the Senate. The President won't like it, so Democrats will need to back it strongly. The struggle will come in settling which committee has such oversight. If they get petty, it could get dropped again.
As far as I know, civil rights oversight lies entirely with the Executive branch, i.e. they can do anything they want as long as it's funded. A revised Patriot Act should provide for Congressional Committee oversight of civil rights. I think I am correct that such a provision was dropped in conference committee from The Homeland Security Act at the end of the last session. That was a Senate provision, so if it is going to make it with the Patriot Act renewal, the provision would have to be included in the House bill, passing through readily in the Senate. The President won't like it, so Democrats will need to back it strongly. The struggle will come in settling which committee has such oversight. If they get petty, it could get dropped again.
Joejojoba111
Member
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Another similarity between Pearl Harbor and 9/11 is that in each case America taught their enemy how to hurt them.
The Pearl Harbor attack was performed, down to the last detail, by American forces in an exercise years earlier.
The Pearl Harbor attack was performed, down to the last detail, by American forces in an exercise years earlier.
i routinely write my senators/congressmen about this stuff, but i'm wondering... have any of you ever written the Democrats and received a positive response? (i mean, for those of you who live in blue states)
e.g. something along the lines of
hmm... on second thought...
e.g. something along the lines of
hmm... on second thought...
Flyboy
Member
Bits and Bobs...
...from the FOXNews story
...from the FOXNews story
Lovely..."Security for Liberty! Now with even less oversight!"
Hrmm...weren't we assured that USA PATRIOT would only be used for terrorism-related investigations?
What he didn't mention is that these "national security investigations" are conducted without a warrant; rather, they require only a "National Security Letter," a letter drafted by an FBI agent (or other relevant investigator) stating that "yeah, this is about terrorism," and suddenly, the Constitution doesn't apply. Oh, and challenging it in court? Yeah, sure--if you know about it. Remember, this is the same Department of "Justice" that has seen fit to censor quotations from Supreme Court opinions. As if to make it even more frightening, here's the quote:
The law needs to die. Not on 2006 when it sunsets, right bloody now.
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