How effective is a bright light in a defensive situation?

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Weimadog

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I am wondering how well a bright light works against an attacker in a low light situation.
There are new handheld lights made by Sure-Fire and others which all but blind a person when shone in their eyes in darkness. If Mr Bad Guy is looking in the direction of Mr Good Guy With the Tactical Light, Mr Bad Guy cannot see anything except the light's element and reflector.

My question is, what do criminals typically do? Do they charge the light source, swinging wildly? Stand there with a deer in the headlights look (I wish)?



Any experience with this?

I think this is firearms related, because so many of us carry a light with a gun, and the light probably be used if the gun is drawn at night.

Weimadog
 
I have used a light in a coupla 'defensive' situations. I end up getting alot of $*!^ talked at me but they have kept their distance and eventually left entirely.

While a carry a pistol 98% of the time I've only ever had to use light and pepper (which I carry 90% of the time).

Bright light is GOOOOOOOD...

:D
 
Effective.

Try this, under low light have someone flash you in the eyes with a surefire/streamlight (at anywhere from 5-15 yards distance) and then move. Try to figure out where they went. If you both had guns or knives, who would have the advantage?

It will take seconds for you to get most of your vision back and up to 1/2 hour for you to get ALL of it back.

BTW, you do not need to keep the light on. Just a good flash, turn off and move, and you will have outmaneuvered the blinded BG. My friend used this once to kick someone between the legs and then walk away.
 
Whether or not a bright light will 'blind' an attacker should not be the reason you use it. Why? Because you can't count on the use of the light to effectively blind somebody sufficiently to prevent them from harming you.

At Thunder Ranch, Clint Smith enjoys telling how during simmunition training that Pete (the guy who mostly does range maintenance at TR and who is NOT an instructor) gets to play a bad guy in the Terminator (shoot house). Apparently Pete wins pretty often, even at night. The officer shines a bright light in his face and Pete either shoots to the light or shields his eyes from the light, thereby allowed the person with the light to be clearly visible by all the reflected light, and then Pete shoots'em.

You have to figure that a person's light is going to be NO more than an arm's length away from the person holding the light (FBI method) and quite likely will be directly in line between the bad guy and the person holding the light. You may have the advantage of having the light, but that doesn't mean he can't shoot you or that somehow the light has provided you with any sort of protective shield.

If you use a light and manage to temporarily blind somebody with it, great. That said, consider such an event as a bonus and NOT something you should count on happening.

As for how bad guys react to the light in the eyes, they are going to react in every possible manner just like bad guys react with guns held on them, when tazered, or pepper sprayed. Many do NOT give up just because they are at a disadvantage and many cops have learned this the hard way.
 
Use the light and either keep moving out of the way, or use the appropriarte means to defend yourself. One just cannot stand there and hope that the light shuts the other person down- the light must be followed up immediately by an action against the aggressor, again, being retreating to a safe location or a use of force.
 
I think my Surefire helped prevent a bad situation once: I was standing in the parking lot of a diner late at night, near my car, talking to a girlfriend. I noticed a guy approaching us from a strange direction (not the diner) and had a bad feeling about the situation. As he came over I turned to look right at him and he said, "Hey, got a light?". He had no cigarettes in his hands.

"Sure!" I said and out comes the Surefire, shined in his face.

He stood there blinking with a confused look on his face.

"Oh! You meant you wanted *fire*? I've got that too..." as I reached into my purse.

He stammered out "Uh, nevermind." and took off. ;)

I don't know what he wanted, but I'm pretty sure it wasn't a light.
 
My question is, what do criminals typically do?
Click to expand...


Oh, generally, whatever you don't expect. :uhoh:




Catsync, :D

Good 'un! Situational awareness, quick thinking, and taking command of the situation.

"Oh! You meant you wanted *fire*? I've got that too..." as I reached into my purse.
Click to expand...

:D I love it!
attachment.php
 
What a criminal will or will not do should not affect your actions to the point that you do anything that would be strategically or tactically unsound.

Always try to get the upper hand. Seek cover. Never assume anything except that the criminal can and will hurt you regardless of his condition.

Just a hypothetical. If I were a criminal and unconcerned about the repurcussions of my actions, any potential victim that shines a flashlight at me gets shot at in the direct vacinity of the light source. Several times. Now apply that thought as the good guy with the flashlight. Do you feel secure in the thought that your powerful flashlight can somehow prevent that criminal from killing you?
 
Weimadog,

There is much wisdom in what Double Naught Spy wrote.

I like most of the posters here feel that a tactical light is an essential tool for concealed carry, but like any other tool to utilize the tool in the most effective manner possible requires training. I cannot understate the importance in taking a class in the utilization of a tactical light.

Night combat is not what I expected, I learned a lot.:D

1. Things never work out like expected.:banghead:

2. The light stops working when you need it most.:cuss:

3. Night sights are almost as essential as the light itself.:what:

The night combat class I attended was probably one of the most fun things I have ever done. :D

I discussed the class in a little more depth in this THR Thread started by skunkability. There are some interesting notes in that threat also.

Charles
 
Mute,

Good thoughts, thanks. A bad guy might shoot at the source of light. If he draws, at least he is well illuminated, :) and I can see what he is doing.

I am almost sure that the "light in the eyes" technique once saved me from a mugging. It was night time, and two lowlifes cornered me so I could not walk away from them. After I twice clearly told them not to approach me, I took out the SureFire when one was ten feet away . I shined it in the closest one's eyes. That, the few icy steps they would have to walk up to get to me, and some other factors convinced them they should just walk away. Without the light, it would have been a closer confrontation.

/armchair commando mode on/
Lighting them up with the SureFire was a lot better than lighting them up with the Glock
/armchair commando mode off/


Thanks for all the ideas! More are certainly welcome.

Weimadog
 
I guess I have to clarify my original post, the one where I talked about shining the light in BGs eyes.

They weren't overtly armed. Just verbally threatening me from the edge of a parkinglot/backyard about 20 ft away. The light let me see clearly what they were doing while hiding my actions from them (that'd be getting a grip on my pistola :) ).

They continued their threats to kick my *** and I suggested that they would be entering unknown territory best left uncharted. After a few more colorful epithets, they left.

I had the light on the entire time (20 secs?), they never separated or moved closer once the light hit 'em. There was no use of force justified beyond light, but I was ready to up the ante if necessary.

I've also had a coupla situations similar to Catsync's, tho not nearly as glibly handled :) .

So, while light may not always be the best solution, neither is a gun or a baseball bat.

:D
 
Good thread, one thing to add. If the guy you point your light at is an idiot that is on PCP, just watch as he goes totally animal and trys to kill you when the light hits his eyes. Nothing sets off someone who is dusted better than the ol light in the eyes trick. No one thing works in every situation. Bright light is helpful in most, but not all confrontations. All you can do is rely on your training and smarts.
 
Never actually tried this but I guess you could try to blind him with the light from a 4-5 d-cell maglight. If the idiot still charges then hose him down with pepper spray or BETTER YET.....BASH his HEAD in with the maglight.

The importance of dual use equipment........:cool:
 
"What a criminal will or will not do should not affect your actions to the point that you do anything that would be strategically or tactically unsound."

This of course makes the most sense. It would seem to be (and my uneducated opinion) that if you shined a light in someone's eyes during a life or death situation and they shot at the light and hit you immediately, you were doing something tactically unsound. Such as not using cover; you were standing out in the open and gave away your position. This is certainly something that you would try not to do in the daylight, and the fact that it is dark doesn't change anything. If the guy fired at the light and you were off to the side, then you could immediately return fire. If you were behind cover and he fires at the light you can immediately return fire. Obviously none of this provides a guuarenteed successfuly outcome, but a little thought and training goes a long way towards tilting the odds in your favor. There are exceptions to every possible training senario. We can't hope to have every base covered. But, we can train as best we can for the majority of senarios.

Where light really comes in to it's own is when you are working with a partner or partners. If one guy is behind cover and blinds the guy with his light, then the other persons can manuver onto the blinded person.
 
Diesle,

Its always so refreshing to get input from someone who has obviously been well trained in the utilization of a light in a combat situation, its quite obvious that lights don't work, no one who really knows what they are doing utilize them.

I guess your idea of an ideal gunfight is one at contact distance with an unidentified target where any skill you posses is negated, hey anyone can hit the target when the gun is in contact with it.

Personally I will choose to utilize cover and deceptive techniques to maximize the distance at which I can engage the target and optimize the difference in skill between myself and the average gremlin.

Charles
 
Catsync,

I saw the Tactical Impact Device at the Tulsa gun show. I guess it would be OK as a final backup, I think that there would be some serious implications if you utilized it in a defensive situation in which you did not "fear for your life." That being said there are better tools for that situation. One might also incur some legal problems in a civil setting after it was all said and done.

My single biggest turn off was that is would really negate pocket carry:what: I thought it was kind of expensive to, but it was really well made.

Charles
 
I dunno but this new Pelican I bought sure would blind someone in a hurry. I am still seeing spots from an accidental shot in the eyes.

GT
 
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