Hunting Bullet AR15

[BrocLuno]

Thing about hogs is they're tough. Cartilage under the hide messes with a lot of bullets. Either they expand early or they don't at all. You really need hog specific rounds. A few have been mentioned. Get something that everyone knows will work, then have him do some range time with that round so he knows how it flies. THEN go back out for those piggies

 

[illinoisburt]

Taking your friend to the range is certainly a good start. I suggest you ask him to bring along his hunting ammo so you see what it is and how it shoots for him.

Honestly the 223 is okay for hogs and deer within proper limitations. #1 is good shot placement. #2 is definitely using the correct type of bullet.

Generally speaking you don't want to use any fmj. Also in factory loaded ammo the vast majority of hollow points of all weights and soft points under 60 grains for 223/556 is constructed very lightly for target or varmint use such as in gophers and prairie dogs. (The one exception is the Barnes monolithic hollow points.)

Thankfully we do have factory loaded medium game hunting rounds available today. A good rule of thumb is stick with soft points of 60 to 70 grains. Many of them specifically say they are made for deer and hogs right on the box (hog hammers are a great example and good choice). I would caution that the low cost steel cased soft points tend to be inconsistent and should probably be avoided. The jacket material is usually too hard for reliable expansion so they tend to perform more like an fmj than a traditional hunting bullet.

Hunting ammo does cost more than bulk plinking ammo, however it isn't often hunters end up firing more than a couple rounds into an animal. A box or two of 20 rounds should last for many seasons.

 

[MtnCreek]

A 55 gr FMJ, which I assume he is using is not a hunting bullet. They would be illegal to hunt with here in GA and not a good idea anywhere. MOST 55 gr and lighter soft point bullets are designed for varmint hunting, the only exception that I know of is the Barnes solid copper bullets. If your friend will buy bullets designed for large game he'll see much better results. Most all of the bullets 60 gr or heavier that are designed to expand should work. Some better than others. I'd go on the heavy end close to if not over 70 gr. The Nosler Partition is always an excellent choice.

FMJ is legal in GA for pigs.

 

[Llama Bob]

FMJ is legal in GA for pigs.

That's great. There's probably somewhere where you can legally burn them out of their dens with a flame thrower. Doesn't make it an ethical way to hunt...

 

[Morrey]

Here is my read on the situation: My friend is actually an experienced hunter, but I note that he usually takes the safe mid-section shot on deer and we usually end up trailing for a hundred yards give or take. Hogs have a totally different kill zone which is much more compact and more forward on the animal. He usually shoots a .270 during deer season so that bullet has some heft. Granted we have a feral hog problem here in SC and DNR is encouraging the harvest of these pigs as they are getting out of control. This is where I find personal ethics come into play....do you gut shoot them and let them wander off and die a slow, agonizing death? Unfortunately, some feel this way. I, on the other extreme, believe in humane shots and will only shoot what I plan to utilize for table fare. Call me conservative, but I only take what I plan to use.

So my buddy has fallen prey to the AR mentality that if a large sounder of hogs shows up, he can blister off a magazine of rounds and take out multiple pigs. Like it or not, agree with this or not, the mindset is there. So all I can do is encourage him to be ethical and responsible. Along with that good marksmanship skills should be practiced, and of course shooting the best ammo we can find for the .223. And for what its worth, I personally wouldn't choose a .223 to hunt hogs with when the .308 Win is built on basically the same platform. I located some 70 gr Nosler Partitions at our LGS, so all he needs to do is to buy them. I am trying here guys...just the messenger asking for help.

 

[mavracer]

A heavier caliber can sometimes give you a stop on a non-vital hit, but certainly not reliably.

A heavier caliber can also start turning vital hits into non vital hits as the flinch factor starts to rise.

 

[Llama Bob]

A heavier caliber can also start turning vital hits into non vital hits as the flinch factor starts to rise.

Depends on the rifle & shooter obviously. The calibers I suggested (.30-30 or .243) are unlikely to produce a flinch in most shooters even with fairly light guns.

Weight and recoil pads can render even dangerous game stopping rifles relatively tame.

 

[MachIVshooter]

He usually shoots a .270 during deer season so that bullet has some heft. Granted we have a feral hog problem here in SC and DNR is encouraging the harvest of these pigs as they are getting out of control. This is where I find personal ethics come into play....do you gut shoot them and let them wander off and die a slow, agonizing death? Unfortunately, some feel this way. I, on the other extreme, believe in humane shots and will only shoot what I plan to utilize for table fare. Call me conservative, but I only take what I plan to use.

So my buddy has fallen prey to the AR mentality that if a large sounder of hogs shows up, he can blister off a magazine of rounds and take out multiple pigs. Like it or not, agree with this or not, the mindset is there.

If he is a farmer and the hogs are destroying his crops, then you defend your livelihood by any means necessary, and making clean kills is a secondary concern to stopping the destruction as quickly as possible. That's the game with destructive or dangerous pest animals. But that is not the impression I got from the OP.

 

[MtnCreek]

That's great. There's probably somewhere where you can legally burn them out of their dens with a flame thrower. Doesn't make it an ethical way to hunt...

Unfortunately not legal here on pigs, but it is legal for yotes and armadillos. Thanks for the suggestion; now I feel the need to get a flamethrower.

 

[Saddlebag Preacher]

Gorillia Ammo 77 grain works great in my 1/7 twist barrel.

 

[Double Naught Spy]

Your friend may be killing every one of those hogs and doing so in an ethical manner. He may just suck at tracking and finding. A hog with a blown out heart and broken front leg can run at least 70 yards (6.5 Grendel). A hog with a nicked first lung and blown second lung can run nearly 400 yards (308). A 100 lb boar with two broken shoulders and a probable double lung shot can get well over 60 yards (.308). A liver shot hog may get anywhere from 25 yards to 200 (.308, 6.5 Grendel, .45/70). I have seen all of these first hand.

If he isn't doing significant damage to the CNS with the shot, then it will be prone to run. If he hits the hog high and does not hit the spine or otherwise damage the spinal cord significantly enough, then the hog will likely run and not produce a lot of blood trail. On top of that, when shooting through the shoulder of fat hogs or boars, they often tend to seal up after the shot, making tracking that much more difficult.

Lots of guys hunt successfully with .223. I would not suggest it as a great caliber for the job, however. Selecting a good hunting bullet that expands and stays together would probably be in his best interest. A heavier bullet will be more forgiving than a lighter bullet. Personally, I prefer bullets that overpenetrate. Exit holes are often much better bleeders than entry holes and so if you have to track, it is better if there is an exit hole.

Mid section shots on hogs is a POOR choice for shot placement regardless of caliber.

 

[LoonWulf]

Ive not shot any really big pigs with my 223, but ive shot a good deal of 100-150lbs. I use the 65grn sgk for shoulder or just behind. All have gone down pretty quickly, but the only blood i find is the puddle they are lying in.

Ive got some 80grn soft points i figgured id try, but my 1-9 wont stabilize them properly. If you do end up loading for him your welcome to them to try out.

 

[MachIVshooter]

Mid section shots on hogs is a POOR choice for shot placement regardless of caliber.

Assuming a broadside shot, I agree. Another matter entirely if they're angling away, of course, as was the last large sow I anchored with a .350 mag. Bullet entered just forward of her hip, was lodged under the skin of her front shoulder on the off side. Not much left of the vitals, and she was DRT.

Any experienced hunter should know how to guesstimate trajectory inside the critter based on its position relative to you, though.

On top of that, when shooting through the shoulder of fat hogs or boars, they often tend to seal up after the shot, making tracking that much more difficult.

Also true. My sister nailed one with a .308. It went down, then got back up and took off as she approached. We tracked the blood trail for a couple hundred yards, then it just stopped. We were able to follow hoof prints a little further, but they disappeared into the brush.

They're a hearty critter, for sure. But I maintain that proper bullet placement will still produce clean, quick kills. Some of the guys in our group used .223 and .22-250, they were lease partners on the ranch and liked head shots. As a non-resident and guest who had limited opportunity and wanted meat, I always used a .308 AR or my 673 guide gun in .350 Rem Mag. Always through the shoulders or boiler room, never had to chase one.

 

[Double Naught Spy]

Assuming a broadside shot, I agree. Another matter entirely if they're angling away, of course, ...

Absolutely. Sadly, too many hunters do not understand the aspect of anatomy being 3 dimensional.

Also true. My sister nailed one with a .308. It went down, then got back up and took off as she approached. We tracked the blood trail for a couple hundred yards, then it just stopped. We were able to follow hoof prints a little further, but they disappeared into the brush.

I have shot more than one hog where I would get spray from a through and through shot and there be no blood away from the point of impact. It can be frustrating.

 

[dieselscout80]

Does anyone have any experience with the Hornady GMX 55gr in.223?

Is it a good hunting round?

 

[Browning]

That's great. There's probably somewhere where you can legally burn them out of their dens with a flame thrower. Doesn't make it an ethical way to hunt...

While most refer to killing hogs as 'hunting' (I've even been known to refer to it as such and sometimes when you're harvesting the meat rather than just killing them and dumping them because they're a pest it resembles it a great deal), there's a very large difference between killing them and hunting deer.

Doing your best to eliminate a non-native invasive species that destroys both crops by the acre and wrecks havoc on the native plant and animal life to the degree where they'd best be described as a plague is a by any means proposition sometimes.

Trapping, shooting them with rifles, pistols or shotguns, bows, crossbows, and then hunting with with dogs and knife and spears are all legal methods of eradicating them year round. Any way you kill them is pretty much good with Texas. I always do my best to give them a clean kill, but most of the people who live out there and who's lives are negatively affected by these pests are going to do their best to get rid of them however they can. I don't think that being torn apart by coyotes, shot full of arrows or having a catch dog latch onto their face and then stabbed repeatedly with a knife is a much easier death than getting gut shot with .223 FMJ and then getting riddled with bullets an hour later on follow-up.

Should the OP's friend practice a bit on his marksmanship and would it be better if he used a better bullet? Undoubtedly. However I've seen a great number of kills with FMJ just because it was cheap and available at the local Walmart and they have 110 hogs to kill over the next several months. Aim better.

 

[dranrab]

The best readily available off the shelf 223 medium game hunting bullet is the Fusion 62 grain. Anyone who says that bullet is inadequate for medium game has never seen the wound channel the bullet leaves. I honestly can't tell the difference between the wound channel from a Fusion or Partition in 223 and a 257 Roberts Partition wound channel. While a 55 FMJ can get the job done, a Fusion WILL get the job done. The friend needs to practice and use a medium game bullet.

 

[Morrey]

I will support BrocLuno's comment that a 200 lb wild hog is an exceptionally tough animal. Our state law allows us to shoot feral hogs at night with artificial lights (in certain seasons), and while this may sound easy, "thread the needle" shot placement is pretty tough using hunting lights. I have an AR10 with a green led Wicked Light side mounted on a picatinny rail, and I find it more difficult to make perfect shots using lights. Ideally, I aim right behind the ear and the .308 is very effective for instant kills. But the last hog I shot was with the light, and I drove directly into the front shoulder broadside with.308 Win 150gr pro hunters at 2800 fps. The hog ran at least 50 yards into some tough briars, and interestingly, I did not find one spot of blood anywhere except where he lay. The bullet went all the way thru both shoulders and almost made it out the other side where I saw the bullet was pushing out on the hide. When I skinned the hog, both front shoulders were destroyed and the chest cavity looked like a milkshake. How in the world did this hog make it 50 yards before expiring? In response to the comment that hogs are tough....you ain't just a whistling Dixie...they SURE are TOUGH!

 

[Double Naught Spy]

Morrey, I learned a long time ago that for most hunters a smart animal is any animal that doesn't stand broadside at 25 yards and wait to be shot and a tough animal is any animal that doesn't fall over dead upon being shot. Animals doing some very simple things that don't make the hunter's life easier get put on a pedestal.

How did your hog make it 50 yards? You failed to make an incapacitating shot even if the shot was not survivable. It is that simple. Like I said above, if you don't do significant damage to the CNS, expect the hog to run. With no heart and no lungs, a hog still has several seconds of oxygen. With no lungs, it may have 20-30 seconds of life left. He can travel a long ways in that amount of time. Keep in mind that those "tough briars" that the hog ran into were only tough on you. Hogs have thick skin and are streamlined such that they can go through that stuff readily compared to you or I. Mine like to run into it as well. Briar patches offer safety and protection.

If you need the hog to not run, don't shoot shoot through the "boilerroom" unless you KNOW you can hit the spine there. Expect to track'em.

Here is one of my favorite behind the ear shots. This boar has survived a great behind the ear shot. You know why? The bullet failed to do significant damage to the CNS, missing the spine all together, missing the back of the skull all together, but it blew through soft tissue and even clipped the right ear on exit. I didn't get a pic of the entry wound scar, but it was just circular, lighter colored skin with a dimple.

The wound was completely healed on the entry side and was weepy on the exit side. Note the scarring on the ear. Basically, it was a too high behind the ear.

Here is the video if you want to see the kill shot that was in the neck...