Hunting With Lead Bullets

[Urza2005]

I have reloaded for a few years now, and one of my favortie rifles to reload for is my Marlin 444. I have developed some good hunting loads with modern jackted bullets, but I have several good "plinking loads" with plain old lead bullets.

So my question comes down to Hunting with lead bullets. Does any one still do this? Do they work well? What kind of hardness should I be looking for? If it turns up that lead bullets are still good for hunting, I will be using them for hogs and deer under 100 yards.

 

[HGUNHNTR]

They kill critters just fine, I just don't like pieces of lead in my food.

 

[MCgunner]

They were great for deer 100 years ago, but deer started wearing kevlar now.

I have killed deer and hog with a 165 grain Lee Keith style gas checked SWC from a .357 magnum carbine. Why wouldn't it work for a .444? If it's big enough with a flat point, it doesn't need to expand.

 

[rcmodel]

Lead SWC bullets will drill full caliber holes through most any medium game animal.

Hardness needs to be matched to the velocity you plan to load them at.
The faster, the harder they need to be.

I just don't like pieces of lead in my food.

It would be far less likely for a lead cast bullet to come apart and leave lead in an animal then would be the case with jacketed bullets that blow apart on bone & such.

rc

 

[Arkansas Paul]

I'm gonna be giving the ol .45 Colt Blackhawk a whirl at deer hunting this year. I think I'm going to use a 255 Keith style SWC. I think at about 1,000 fps, they'll do just fine.
As far as the hardness you want, that all depends on the velocity you're going to be pushing them. I bought mine from Missouri Bullets and emailed them with a similar question. They recommended me use a 18 BHN hardness since I would be pushing them in excess of 1k fps. Look on their website and there's a formula for coming up with what you need.

www.missouribullet.com

 

[Urza2005]

I actually use missouribullet exclusively. My plinking load is there .44caliber 240gr LSWC Keith Style, also 18BHN. So I'll just try and work up a "maximum" load.

 

[Cosmoline]

One nice thing about the hardcast slugs in a big bore is you don't have to hyper-accelerate them to get excellent penetration. With a .45-70 you could absolutely hunt with trailboss loads. The only real reason to amp it up is to flatten your trajectory for longer range shots.

 

[Robert]

http://mtbaldybullets.com/asp/products.asp#Smokeless
I am using their 405gr bullets in my 45-70 for Elk this fall. My hunting load is 52grs of H322 under that bullet in a Starline case. Starline brass must be used with this load. That should make 1950fps with the 405gr bullet.

 

[flipajig]

Ive been useing cast WC for quite awhile on deer and pigs works great in a SBH 44mag and TC contender.

 

[Kurt S.]

Hi, Urza2005. I have killed pigs and a good sized east Texas whitetail (175 lbs) with 405 gr lead "cowboy" loads in a Marlin 95. The shots were pretty close, 25-50 yards. All of them dropped like they got hit by lightning. I am pretty slow about picking my shots, tried to get them quartering-on in the front shoulder-chest area. When I used to hunt with .25-06 out in west Texas, I went for the neck shot. Point is, no matter what caliber, shot placement is paramount.

The stories I've heard is that the 45-70 was chosen partly because of the ability to penetrate completely through a horse at 200 yards. Supposedly because the opponent Indians would seek cover behind their horses. Whatever, I everything I've ever shot had through and through penetration with a lot of damage inside.

 

[TehK1w1]

Ranch Dog Molds sells bullet molds specifically designed for 444 marlins at up to 405gr. bullet weight.
You might look at the 444 Marlin subforum over at marlinowners.com, it has a lot of info about loads for these rifles.

 

[S&Wfan]

Hi,

After less than satisfactory results using premium hollow points in .44 Magnum, I switched to the Federal Premium Hunting load (300gn. Castcore) that uses the good old, hard-cast flat nose lead bullet in my S&W M29 revolver about ten years ago . . . and have never looked back.

It truly plants the deer right where you shoot 'em almost every time and . . . if they run at all, they don't go far. The flat nose plows through 'em and leaves an awesome blood trail, and doesn't destroy as much meat either. I'm convinced it is a superior way to go . . . and a 300-400 gn. bullet in .444, pushed from a rifle would be awesome indeed!!!

Elmer knew a thing or two about hunting loads . . . and this style bullet is also VERY accurate!

Typical 50 yard accuracy via the 6" barreled Model 29:

A recent 8-point . . . felled last year with a shot through the heart . . .

 

[Ridgerunner665]

End to end penetration through any critter in North America...with no lead left behind.

Beartooth 405 LFN/GC over 50 grains of H322 (1,886 fps muzzle velocity)...and can be pushed on up to 2,000 fps, if one wanted to do it.

 

[hiro]

I stumbled on to this while looking for recipes

It was from a guy's blog who liked shooting starlings and cooking them.

http://www.dnr.state.mn.us/hunting/lead/index.html


Its a state sponsored study regarding lead fragmentation. I'm new to guns and hunting, and thought it was interesting as I thought bullets wouldn't fragment to far off places inside the animal.



online slide presentation:

http://files.dnr.state.mn.us/fish_wildlife/lead/index.htm


Download The Short Research Summary

http://files.dnr.state.mn.us/fish_wildlife/lead/bulletstudy/resources/shortsummary.pdf


Download The Complete Research Summary

http://files.dnr.state.mn.us/fish_wildlife/lead/bulletstudy/resources/publicsummary.pdf


Tips For Hunters The DNR has assembled nine tips that provide hunters with helpful and useful information.

http://files.dnr.state.mn.us/fish_wildlife/lead/bulletstudy/resources/huntertips.pdf

 

[44-henry]

I think modern gunwriters and the firearms industry have done a lot to make many sportsman think that it is no possible to kill game unless you are carrying the latest and greatest gizmo that modern technology has allowed. Plain lead bullets were killling game long before jacketed bullets made their debut and still continue to work fine today. I've had more failures to stop with modern jacketed bullets than I have ever had with plain lead and that is all that I plan on using in the future.

 

[RangerHAAF]

Of course they do, it's how they get paid. Doctors have done the same thing with child births. They have turned a simple biological function into an insanely costly racket aided by the hospitals. All of my children were born at home with a midwife in attendance and I'm told there are unattended births with women catching their own babies.

The same principle goes with lead bullets. They are as deadly as their more advertised and sleeker looking counterparts that are sold over the counter but I only reload the larger 45-70 loads to experiment with different hollowpoint shapes and cavities.

 

[Scrapperz]

I use lead 360 gn pills in my 460 S&W Magnum. I think there are quite a few people who use lead for big game. Things haven't changed in hunting, it's still the shot to the vitals that do the clean kill. Never rely on the bullet to do the whole job.

 

[greywolf444]

I use the lee 310gr bullet and the ranch dog 300 in the 444 marlin. works very well. they WILL go completely thru any deer regardless how they are standing. you have to punch vitals for good results. any bone you hit will blow into shards and GREATLY increase the damage. they work very well, are cheap( I mold my own),but, not magic. I use cast in all my rifles and handguns now for everything. on soft tissue you will get penetration but you don't get the crushing blow of a expanding bullet.

 

[MCgunner]

My "thumpers" shoot this, it's .50 caliber wide and 385 grains. If this don't gitter dun, nothing will. Haven't shot anything with it, yet, but I just got this new inline that is much more convenient to use than my old Hawken, so maybe I'll leave the contender and the .308 at home this year. That's the plan, anyway. I load this over 80 grains of 777. It SOUNDS like it'll work when it hits the target board, at least. Cuts a nice, pretty wadcutter like hole, too, that ain't hard to see from 100 yards.

 

[Navy_Guns]

MCGunner - what bullet is that?

 

[Navy_Guns]

OK, the pic is linked from Cabelas - it's a Hornady Great Plains, isn't it?

 

[greywolf444]

I have used these for years. they work great on deer. they open up pretty good too. I have used them in .45, .50, and .54 cal and all worked very well. never got a shot with the .58 but they grouped well.