Is my Ruger legal for IPSC?

[John Wesley]

After my first experience at IPSC I am excited about getting involved in the Production class. I thought of another question or two that you guys might be able to help me with though.

I have made 2 changes to my Ruger 345.

1. I changed out the hammer spring from a 22lb to a 20 lb spring. That gives me a lighter pull (It's not THAT light).

Is that a legal change?

2. If you are familiar with the Ruger 345 you know that there is a problem with the mag disconnect. I removed mine. My Ruger has no magazine disconnect now.

Is is still legal to use in IPSC with the factory mag disconnect removed?


Also, when I had finished shooting, the RO instructed me to remove the mag, unchamber the round, then pull the trigger (pointing downrange of course). I wanted to use the decocker but the RO say "NO" that I had to pull the trigger to decock the gun. Ruger says that dry-firing without the mag will damage the gun. - If I put the mag disconnect back in I will damage the gun.

What should I do??? Am I illegal???

 

[Jim Watson]

There is nothing against changing springs to improve the trigger pull.

You must prove the gun is empty by dryfiring, decocking doesn't count.

The Ruger instructions say it can be dryfired only with a magazine in place.

OK, carry an extra EMPTY magazine for the purpose of dropping the hammer.

You need a "Barney" magazine to load the chamber with over a full magazine to save fumbling around. So take an extra magazine, put one round in it. At the Load and Make Ready, insert that magazine, chamber the one round, put it in your pocket empty. Insert a loaded magazine and wait for the fire signal. Shoot the stage. When told to Unload and Show Clear, take out the last magazine, eject the last round from the chamber and show the RO it is empty. When he says "Gun is safe, hammer down, holster." show him the empty magazine, put it in, dryfire the hammer down, take out the empty magazine, holster the gun.

You had just as well put the magazine disconnector back in, I do not know what you mean "If I put the mag disconnect back in I will damage the gun."
They built it that way, how will returning it hurt? All I know about the model is what I read in advertising. Is the magazine disconnector defective? What is "the problem?"

 

[Waywatcher]

Dry firing wont hurt a Ruger. If it does, Ruger will fix it. But it wont happen.

Your gun will be perfectly legal (albeit outclassed) as all the modifications listed are internal.

I personally prefer the slight speed emphasis that IPSC places for defensive scenarios. It's more fun, and in my opinion Alpha/Charlie in 1.1 seconds sure beats two Alphas in 1.5 seconds in a defensive situation. IDPA would say the 2 alphas but slower is better.

Have fun, IPSC is great!

 

[John Wesley]

Thanks for the responses guys!

Jim, I had not thought about inserting an empty mag. :banghead: I guess I was expecting the RO to tell me I couldn't do that.

Waywatcher, I was hoping the missing mag disconnect was legal!

I'll try to explain the mag disconnect problem briefly but it is a widely know problem. (Well, maybe widely know to Ruger users.)

The magazine disconnect is made to stop the firing pin from moving forward if the magazine is missing. The problem is that many users (sooner or later) report that their gun goes "click-no bang" randomly. Mine did this. I discovered not even a scratch on the primer. (This was even before I changed out my hammer spring.)

I suppose the tolerance is too close. If the mag isn't "just right" it may not push the block out of the way. If you dry fire the gun without a magazine, this supposedly peens the front of the block which makes it even MORE likely to catch the firing pin and stop it when it shouldn't.

I didn't want the mag disconnect but the Ruger 345 is about the only .45 that I can shoot well and that fits my hand. Since I am wanting to make this a carry gun (it has been very reliable except for the "click-no bang" that doesn't happen anymore since I removed it) I wanted to use it in production class. - I wasn't sure if that would break any rules.

If I put it back in, I risk a failure to fire at IPSC - or worse - on the street. That's too big a risk for me to take.

 

[Jim Watson]

In that case, I would leave the magazine disconnector out for reliable shooting, and use an EMPTY magazine to get the hammer down without beating the gun up. Kind of tedious, but if that is what it takes to manage a gun you otherwise like...

 

[John Wesley]

You almost have it Jim, but as long as I leave the mag disconnect out then it doesn't matter if I pull the trigger without a mag since there is no mag disconnect to peen.

That's why I wanted to leave the mag disconnector out. - No damage to it if I pull trigger with mag out... no chance of mag disconnect blocking firing pin when it shouldn't.

As long as the mag disconnect is removed it will be hard to damage the gun as Ruger says because there is nothing there to damage!

I don't have to worry about a "click-no bang" being caused by a poorly designed (in my opinion) mag disconnect because it doesn't exist anymore!

I just wanted to be sure that I was "legal" for IPSC without it. The alternative was to put it back in, risk FTFs, and be forced to use an empty mag (which WAS a good idea I didn't think of) when pulling the trigger to "decock" the gun. I know it's really no big deal but I don't want to break the rules simply out of principle.

Thanks again!

 

[Jim Watson]

Ok, pardon my ignorance. I don't think I have ever seen a P345 ever being shot. So leave the magazine disconnector out so you can dryfire the hammer down, and keep quiet about it. I do not know of an IPSC rule against defanging the stupid thing although there is one in IDPA. The RO probably doesn't know any more about them than I do.

 

[John Wesley]

You wouldn't know unless you owned one or looked carefully at the exploded diagram.

There is no way to tell that the mag disconnect is missing without removing the rear sight and looking for it.

(I suppose you could dump the mag with one in the pipe, then pull the trigger to insure that it would not fire - mine would of course since mine has been removed.)

I gain absolutely no competitive advantage in having it gone other than better reliability. (I am assuming my fellow competitors might even appreciate better reliability so I don't slow things down unnecessarily.)

If anyone asks, I will of course tell the truth about it. I don't think it is worth worrying about anymore. Thanks for all the help!

Shoot straight!

P.S. If anyone is curious, here is a link to a page with the 345 manual on it. I have the decocker version but the mag disconnect is the same on them all. You should be able to see it under the rear sight (item 6). The trigger disconnect is right next to it on the other side. Both "blocks" have to be pushed up out of the way of the firing pin to keep from blocking it when firing. The trigger block seems to be no problem. I am leaving it in since I DO consider that a safety feature.

http://ruger.com/Firearms/PS-InstructionManuals-PI.html

 

[hexidismal]

I've put about 2000 rounds thru my P-345 D, never once had a failure. I dont see what everyones gripe is about the mag disconnect.

 

[1911user]

There is no USPSA rule against removing it. I wouldn't make a big deal out of it, just shoot and have fun. People commonly tape or deactive 1911 grip safeties for USPSA.

IDPA is different; from what I've read, someone made a formal request for clarification about removing mag disconnects and IDPA HQ essentially had to respond. The lawyers won so now it's officially not legal or proper to deactivate any pistol safety feature for IDPA use. Before that it was pretty much don't ask, don't tell, and no one worried about it. Browning Hi-power pistols were the common example. Even with a deactivated mag disconnect, just use an empty mag to clear the pistol for an IDPA match.

If the mag disconnect is a reliability concern, it has to go IMO. In general, I dislike mag disconnects (they aren't a safety).