Katrina: after-action lessons learned

[AStone]

rest stop theft & petroleum addiction

A female friend just reported having to drive (from Illinois) to the Biloxi area to get her mother after the storm. One of the things she reported was that in the rest stops, there were people sleeping in their cars, and other people siphoning their gas while they slept. As tired as she was, she didn't dare stop and rest.

Relative to the 'America' i grew up in, i'd call that a fairly 'heavy' story.

I want to propose a thought experiment.
I'm not saying this is truth; just a thought experiment.

Imagine for a moment, fictional or mythical if you wish, that Katrina was just the first of a new breed of ocean-born tropical storm that could frequent southern shores, driven as they are by heated seas, like those in the Gulf of Mexico.

Given the story that Malamute offers,
where is the least desirable place on Norte Amerciana to visit, let alone live?

<muffled question from audience>
What's that? What was the question, again?
Should New Orleans be rebuilt?

Hmmm. That's a tough one.
Could even be politically motivated.

Here's my answer:
Sure, if you want to.
But don't send me the bill.

And I'll never drive there.

 

[bogie]

Uh... That wasn't a "super storm." It was just a big one. And it hit the right place. Remember the big hurricanes down in Florida a few years ago? Tornados in the midwest? Not all that different.

My biggest takeaway from this, and other incidents, is "get to know your neighbors."

Now that I live in the outer burbs, I'm not the only fellow with a boomstick. And I'm not the only one on my cul-de-sac with a generator either.

Don't panic. Assess the situation, and make the best of things. If things are gonna be snafu'd for a day, fine. Run the generator. If they're gonna be fubar'd for a few days, well, then it's time to have a BBQ. If it's gonna be over a week, well... You gotta think about moving elsewhere.

Also, be self-reliant. Do not be a refugee. Being a victim is okay. The reason the Superdome got trashed was that they put thousands of people in it who had little regard for their own personal cleanliness. Rather than figure a way to unplug/flush toilets, or rig other facilities, they crapped on the floor. That's just wrong.

In rural areas they had shell-shocked folks out with chainsaws the next day, helping themselves. In the city, they waited for help.

 

[Waitone]

Preacherman, I hope your thread stays open for 6 months. I'm predicting problems with the resettlement camps FEMA, et al are establishing. You might want to keep an eye peeled problems.

One line I drew in my personal sand was I will not go into a shelter, period.

 

[VaughnT]

Great thread, gents. I'm being educated here, and I appreciate it.

Anyone see that video clip of the CHP officers gang-tackling the 82yo grandma that refused to leave her dry, well-stocked home? Five big guys on one little old lady, and boy, was she screaming. They didn't care. She very clearly stated that she didn't want to leave, had plenty of food and water, didn't want them in her house....all to no avail.

Makes you think that seven loaded mags for the AR isn't such a bad idea!

 

[jpthegeek]

Thanks for getting me thinking along these lines guy! You scored again!

 

[Malamute]

Not all reports from the area are doom and gloom, as seems the case when hearing about NO. There is hope that not all turn into savages in times of crisis.
Look here,

http://leverguns.sixgunner.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11220

 

[AStone]

Just read (most of) the letter from MS that Malamute recommended. Interesting.

I'm postulating that some of the difference is city v. rural, of course. It's not clear if the writer is including larger urban areas (e.g., Biloxi) in his assessment or not. And, the folks in MS didn't have to deal with flooding to the extent that NO did.

I'm not knocking the positive, mind you: glad they're working it out so well, but just trying to keep perspective.

My only cynicism crept in with this paragraph: "Pulpwood haulers (lumberjacks to you Yankees) who showed up at Interstates and main feeder hi-ways heading south. Started cutting up the downed trees with their own chainsaws, and loading them up with their hydraulic boom hauling trucks. Opening the way south for our relief effort...nobody called them....they just showed up and started doing what had to be done."

Now, I'm not knocking the integrity of haulers and jacks. Far from it. I've known a few in my day, and they can be just as kind and helpful as the next guy.

But I also know that those trees they're hauling off are probably getting sold to mills for a nice profit. That's a lot of downwood that would otherwise go to waste. One large oak for example, may bring them a thousand or two, last I checked.

Again, I'm NOT knocking the positive things people are doing, or implying that they're only doing it for the money. It's cool that they're able to help out AND cover their costs. I'm just keeping perspective about human nature.

 

[shermacman]

Then what is your point Nematocyst-870?
A downed oak is a road obstacle. It will get ground to mulch by the highway crew or burned on site. The very human condition that worries you is what got us out of the caves thousands of years ago: enlightened self-interest.

If we weren't motivated to do something that benefitted ourselves, our families, our communities, then we all would have sat on our lazy butts like, well, like the wards of the State in New Orleans....

 

[CAPTAIN MIKE]

Wow -- Very Thought-Provoking Preacherman

Your post is one of the most well thought out entries I have seen. Very thought-provoking and timely. Thank you for sharing with us all a look-see from a real-world point of view based on experience and perspective.

I am taking your lessons to heart as my area recently put out severa public sevice announcement urging families and individuals to put together emergency preparedness kits for bioterrorism events. Thank you again.

 

[AStone]

Then what is your point Nematocyst-870?

Not a big point, Shermacman, just a subtle distinction that's in line with what you wrote.

A less discerning reader could have interpretted the original article to imply that the haulers "just showed up and started doing what had to be done" without any regard to monetary reimbursement, totally out of the goodness of their heart. Indeed, there was clearly a spirit of helping there - of that I have no doubt. Please don't misunderstand that.

But me thinks it's easier for people to act to do good things when there's a way for them to recoop their investments in said help; the original article made no mention of that point, implying - again to a less discerning reader - that they might have been losing money on the deal.

I'm not faulting the writer for that omission, and certainly not faulting the haulers for gaining financial reimbursement. Not at all. I'm just making an observation that i think is grounded in the reality of experience about what drives humans. I like to acknowledge the complexity of human existence, as you did. That's my point.

 

[shermacman]

Nemo,
Got it!

 

[Sewerman]

Ya'll have got to read this!

http://www.catfish.blog-city.com/

 

[javafiend]

Excellent thread.

As Rita veered towards Houston, my dad decided that the he could not tolerate the proespect of two weeks without power, so we bugged out to say with family in Waco. We left Houston at 5 am Thursday and arrived in Waco 14 hour later, a trip that normally takes about 3.5 hours. The media was full of talk about sticking to only the major roads, but fortunately we ignored their advice. My dad's car is equipped with a GPS, so as one of us drove, the other would look for little side roads. Using this navigational tool undoubtedly cut our drive time.

One time we got stuck on a road in the hot afternoon with many other cars. As the temperature rose, so did tempers. At one point I could sense that we were approaching a real breakdown in usual civilized conduct. Fortunately we were armed. We never had to use the firearm, but we enjoyed peace of mind just knowing that we had it.

Next time we will stay in Houston and simply ride it out. Already we are looking to buy a generator.

Some lessons learned.
1) As the storm or other crisis approaches, top off your gas tank frequently.
2) Keep plenty of cash on hand.
3) If you find yourself running out of critical supplies as you enter a small town on your route, find the local cafe (not a national chain) and have lunch. When we found ourselves running out of a critical item, we stopped at a local diner in the middle of a small town for lunch. We started talking to the waitresses, explained our situation, and one of them made phone calls to a friend of a friend, and sure enough we managed to replenish our supply of this critical item. The local diner in a small town is the nerve center, and the waitresses or regulars there know everybody in town.

Check out this article by Clare Wolfe.

 

[Bartholomew Roberts]

On the subject of a nice, quiet power generator that doesn't attract the attention of undesirables, look at this 1600w solar generator sold by OKsolar.

Not enough to power a household; but 60lbs with a wheeled cart and flexible solar panel and sufficient to run a small DC-power cooler, a laptop and some cellphones.

 

[Malone LaVeigh]

Preacherman, I'm wondering how sure you are of your sources. One of the biggest lessons I took away from my experience was that we can't always trust the news we get in these situations. I evacuated about 300 miles north and wasn't able to get back to the coast for almost a week. During that time I caught network coverage (mostly of NO) and had intermittent contact with a business partner who rode it out in Long Beach. He was hearing all sorts of horrible rumors, but most turned out to be exaggerated at least. He kept hearing that they were going to force him from his home, but it never happened.

Likewise, we have since learned that many of the reports from NO were not true, probably including the one about rescue workers being fired at. It appears that in total, most New Orleaneanswho didn't evacuate behaved very well, in the face of horrible conditions and neglect and abuse by the local authorities. It turned out, according to some local coverage I've seen down here, that many of the false reports came from NO police officers themselves.

I had a small encounter with the unconstitutional authority you wrote about. My other partner and I had to camp for a few nights in what was left of our business. Of course, we were both armed. Every night we had a police patrol come by and check to see if we were looters. None ever asked for papers or anything, but one officer who seemed to be from out of state asked if I had a permit for the revolver on my belt.

I started to get flustered and explain that I didn't need one in my business, but my partner kept her cool. She just said, "You don't want to ask that," and changed the subject. None of the MS police ever even commented.

 

[UnintendedConsequences]

My take of this

Following on from this thread1. People who were prepared were frequently mobbed/threatened by those who weren't.
2. When help gets there, you may get it whether you like it or not.
3. There seems to be a cumulative psychological effect upon survivors.
4. There is widespread frustration over the lack of communication and empathy by rescuers and local/State government.
5. Expect rescuers (including law enforcement) to enforce a distinctly un-Constitutional authority in a disaster situation.
6. Don't believe that rescuers are all knights in shining armor who will respect your property.
That's all for now, but I expect other points will emerge over time. Hope these updates are helpful to you, and stimulate your own thinking.

1) What I seem to be getting is, if you look like you are prepared, expect others to try to beg or steal from you. If you give any away, expect to be mobbed even more. Seems best to look like you have nothing and let those who didn't prepare die for their stupidity.

2) If they choice is JBT LEO/FEMA/State help or suviving with significant preparations, tell them to leave. If threatened explain that their help is unwanted and continued aggressiveness will be met with defensive measures.

3) I would rather be tramatized where I live rather than in strange surroundings. I know in my rural area that nature does a fine clean up job with time. Our gene pool, however, is protected against nature's bleaching.

4) I don't feel afraid about the aftermath due to my rural surroundings. I expect to receive no help so news about any help coming is not important. If help comes, so be it.

5) If the Constitution is out the door, then natural law of survival begins. If threatened, defend. It doesn't matter if it is a criminal or a LEO (though I repeat myself), threats of harm result in use of deadly force with me. They don't show up or even take a report when I did need them in the past, why would I tolerate their actions now when I didn't ask for them?

6) I already know that the county LEOs are criminals with badges. There is a long memory here where I live. If the local LEOs come to "help" you better believe they are there to steal from you in some manner.

My survival views are harsh, but they are tempered with the reality that no one helped me when I needed help, and I live in a very rural area near a small town. I wouldn't help others when they were in need. Yes, I sound cruel, but I am a realist knowing that what I have will keep me and my livestock alive before, during and after the disaster for at least a year. To budget for a horde of hungry, unprepared people would be insane. I don't have the funds for it and I make preparations to defend what I have from those same looters.

 

[UnintendedConsequences]

My LEO/Gov comments are limited to my personal experiences

It just dawned on me that perhaps my comments about my local LEOs might have seemed like bashing. I can only speak from what I have seen and heard from others in my county. The deputies act like they are the law incarnate, but most of the town police actually understand the Constitution and the spirit of the law. I don't speak for other areas, just mine. I have lived here pretty much my entire life so I have years of experience with these people in my area. Were it a single or couple of random incidents, I would say otherwise, but it is a regular pattern that makes me say what I do.

I appologize if I have offended anyone.