Kentucky Rifle sight question

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Diggers

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Hi all! I've sight question.

First the background:

I bought a .50 cal Kentucky rifle from Cabelas (Pedersoli) a couple months ago and have been out to the range twice. The first time I shot at only 25 yards using 60 grains of FFF and had a great time. I made a nice 5 shot two inch group but I was low about 5 inches and noticed I had to aim high while I was shooting to hit where I was hitting.

Today I shot at the 100 yard range using 60 grains of FFF and had to aim OVER the target by about a foot (rough guess of where the top of the front sight was) to hit on the bottom quarter of the 15 inch paper target. Ill try to post a picture I took with my phone.

What I'm wondering about is this I know the gun is shooting low BUT what is the drop of a 180 grain 50 cal ball at 100 yards using 60 grains of FFF out of a 36 inch barrel?

Also, before I file down the front sight should I use a hotter load? Could that lift the point of impact? From what the manual says, using FF, the range is 55 to 100 grains. So I think 85 grains of FFF is about the max I should use. Thats quite a bit more than the 60 grains I was using (it kicked plenty with 60) BUT then again even at 25 yards the rifle was shooting low....:(

Does Pedersoli make a taller replacement back sight for their rifles?? The front sight is tapered toward the top, If I file it down I will have a kinda wide front sight that will pretty much cover the target at 100 yards.

Thanks for any info. :) OH BTW I shot 9 shots I think 4 missed low.....

photo.jpg
 
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a few things

You could probably put about 15 more grains of powder in there and still be very comfortable shooting it. I use 85 grains in my .54.

That said. Why not switch to 2FG powder and not 3F? 3F burns a tad faster than 2F, which I think allows you to take advantage of a longer barrel.

Go up in powder weight by increments of 5 grains.

Also, you did not say what size ball or patch you used. That can also make a difference if the ball and patch do not fit snugly in the bore.

Finally, I have found that one of the best places for BP information is the Muzzleloadingforum.com

Try there with this question (and more facts about patch and ball)

The Doc is out now. :cool:
 
OK well first, Pedersoli is notorious for using something visually akin to a "2 x 4" for front sight posts. If you want real accuracy from your Kentucky rifle or Blue Ridge Hunter, you need to (imho) swap out the front sight post for a thin, silver, front sight from Track of The Wolf or other supplier. It will make a huge difference on the windage.

Now as to up or down, You need to get a much better group before you worry about that..., so get something like an adhesive backed target circle, post it high over your target, so you don't have to guesstimate where to hold, and check the group. Once the group is tight, then adjust the windage, and then work on elevating it. Slowly, carefully, file down the silver, front sight post. Test fire with a clean barrel each time you take a little off (remember unlike steel, you will take off more silver with each pass of the file as it's softer) until you get near to where you want it.., like say 2" low.., then up the charge to 70 and see what you get, then try 80. Then wih the file and the load you can "balance" the load to go where you want.


You are correct, a bit more muzzle velocity will give you a higher impact, but I use 70 grains of 3Fg in my 38" barrel rifle, and have no problems out to 100 yards on targets nor deer. So I don't think the load is really something to adjust yet. It would be better for you to try 2Fg as the Dr mentioned, with your regular 60 grain load, and see if the groups improve, first, before upping the powder.

Lastly, Pedersoli rifles are also known to cut patches on the sharp rifling. Inspect your patches and make sure if you have a tight fit you're not slicing little holes in the patches as you load. It makes a huge difference that often won't become obvious until you reach out beyond 50 yards. You mentioned you had a good time at 60 yards, but at 100 you have problems.

If you are cutting patches, you can polish the interior of the barrel using several small pieces of "green scrubbie" normally used to scrub iron frypans.

LD
 
Thanks for the in put.

Yeah I noticed the front sight of my rifle covered about 60 percent of the 15 inch wide target at 100 yards. That and having to line up on the target and then raise the sights up over the top of of the target makes shooting small groups pretty tough. Honestly I was happy just hitting the paper that way.

About the ball and patch I use what Pedersoli puts in their manual. .49 round ball with a .01 patch. It goes in snug but not so snug that I feel I'm really having to use a lot of force.

I didn't check the patches to see if they were cut, I'll do that next time I'm out.

I like the idea of a new thinner front sight, the stock site really is too wide.
 
It shouldn't be too difficult to thin down the factory front sight.
It's not always possible to get one sight setting to zero in at both 50 yards and 100 yards. Using some Kentucky windage may be necessary.
And sometimes one load will work best at 50 yards while another increased load is better for shooting out to 100 yards.
 
yeah I was thinking I could file it thinner as well as shorter too. Its an option anyhow....then again a new sight looks like its about 5 bucks. ;) Just have to figure out the dove tail size if I buy one.

I don't expect it to be right on bullseye at 50 and 100 yards. I just want it to be on at ONE of those distances so I can adjustimate for the other.

Right now its obviously shooting very low. I understand the concept of shooting a group before adjusting BUT because I'm aiming over the target to hit the bottom of it I think I can fix that now, then fine tune it for tighter groups.
 
I think the drop from 50 yds to 100 yds in my 50 was about 4-5 inches.
This with 70 grs FFF Black powder. .495 ball and .017 thick patch.
 
Thanks kwhi43, that is good to know. I'll have to mess around with the load a bit to see what the gun likes. 60 grains of FFF is a very medium load, probably kinda light for 100 yard range, 70 sound better. I have to order some FF also and see how that does.
 
This is how 5 shots at 100 yds open sights, round ball, Flintlock fired from
a rest looks like when everything is working right.

PhilonFathersDay.jpg
 
It's really quite simple. The hard part is getting the deer to hold the target up like Phil is doing. Lots of training required.
 
i will be trying out a flintlock rifle soon, and i need that kind of accuracy for deer hunting. any real tricks to it?
Click to expand...

Four, actually that I have found...,

First, make sure the lock is working right. The "normal" shot for your rifle should have no real "break" between when the pan flashes and the rifle goes off. If it is slow like in a Hollywood production, the lock may need cleaning or tuning.

Second, practice good steady shooting positions. Standing Off-hand is very tough to be steady, which is why it is often used in target shooting competitions, but seated, kneeling, or one of my favorites, Standing with support from a tree trunk are much better ideas. Shoot from these positions a lot. Simulate the tree trunk at the range by using a post that supports the roof on a covered range. If you are out on the prairie, think about using crossed sticks.

Third, follow-through. Concentrate on the sight picture and a specific location on the target or the animal, and bringing the sights back to that position after recoil. The old line from The Patriot of Aim Small; Miss Small was taught to Mel Gibson by the guy who taught him flintlocks, Mark Baker, and it's an actual flintlock motto. So the center of a target bullseye, or a specific spot on the deer, is the point of aim. It does make a difference for although the lock time sounds quick, it's just slow enough for this to influence the shot. Practice this a lot as well.

Fourth, practice in low light, shoot early morning and shoot at sundown or dusk. Different weather too, overcast, sunny, drizzling rain. Getting to know the rifle and how it works, what can and cannot do for you is the key.

LD
 
i will be practicing as much as possible, i want to be able to kill on the very first shot witch is how hunting always should be. i want to be able to put my bullet or ball exactly where i aim. i will be practicing a lot too. i am going to try some long shots and see how i do. as for training the deer to hold up the target like that i don't think that is going to be easy. besides, i don't think i could find "deer treats" at my local hardware store.
 
One of the other guys mentioned it but I would absolutely start with using thicker patches, you will get more velocity, and spin, should raise impact and tighten groups, if your at .010, go .015, or even .020. I would do that before I changed charges or balls or anything on the gun. :cool:
 
Do yourself a favor. Do a Search for Dutch Schoultz's "Black Powder Rifle Accuracy". You can try load recommendations from every shooter on this forum and you might eventually luck onto the right powder/ball/patch combination. But there's a system to be learned to achieve accuracy for each individual rifle. Virtually no two shoot to the same POI, even with exactly the same components. Dutch's experience will be the best $20 you'll ever spend to get you on target and/or to get precise hunting accuracy out of your rifle. And I can guarantee that it'll save you money better spent on powder, lead, and practice.

I don't work for him, don't know him or anything about him except his work with Black powder acuracy. I bought his sytem a few months back. I learned things that, even after 30+ years of black powder shooting, finally brought solid answers to alot of questions. Now on the rare occasion that I have a flyer on a target I know why.
 
That's Revolutionary War quality rifle shooting. You can hit an orange every time with a group like that - just like our guys did back then.
 
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