long range revolver VS. carbine

[s&w 24]

After shooting at the range the other day it got me to thinking my 44 mag revolver groups were just as good as alot of the 223/7.62x39 carbine groups I see my fellow shooters tacking up. Other than capsity what am I loosing compared to the typical carbine? If I use 200 gr loads my shot to shot recovery is just fine and there is little differance in noise/flash compared to a carbine indoors so how is ones long range "deer revolver" lacking compared to an AR/AK/mini XYZ for home defence,plinking, and the ussual assault rifle jobs?


P.S. I'm not setting this up to be anti-assualt rifle piece just a discution of the pro's and con's.

 

[bouis]

I guess .223 carbines are there for those of us who can't make the follow up shots as quite fast with a .44 mag

 

[sacp81170a]

After shooting at the range the other day it got me to thinking my 44 mag revolver groups were just as good as alot of the 223/7.62x39 carbine groups I see my fellow shooters tacking up.

????? No offense, but anyone who can't get a better group with a long gun at the same distance as someone armed with a handgun needs to work on some basic marksmanship skills. The exception would be quick reaction point shooting drills. In those kinds of up close "in your face" drills with carbines, if your groups don't look like shotgun groups, then you're not shooting fast enough. You should be able to point shoot with a carbine and put rounds on a man size sillhouette out to 50 meters. That's a fairly long shot with a handgun.

Other than capsity what am I loosing compared to the typical carbine?

At home defense ranges, not much, and you're actually gaining maneuverability. For anything else, well, to paraphrase Clint Smith, handguns are handguns and rifles are rifles.

 

[hksw]

What distance was this? Were you shooting in the same position as the rifle shooters?

Taking the post as is, a pistol will also lose out on distance, despite the .44 mag being set up for 'longer distances', as compared to the rifle cartridges mentioned.

IMO, I would not definitively assume that your hangun's accuracy/precision exceeds that of ther other guys' rifles. It could probably be more due to the shooters' capabilities.

The last time I was at the range a couple Sundays ago, I was shooting a MN M44 standing off hand (using crappy Ecuadoran corrosive ammo). I was able to keep then inside the 5" Shoot-N-C and the black of B-19 targets despite having to aim about 6" below the target (rear sight was bottomed out) at 50 yds. I was using both weak hand on forearm and UIT type holds. The guy on the next bench on the left of me was shooting what appeard to be a SW Model 29 off of the bench. He was able to shoot slightly tighter groups but he was using a rest and a scope. (IMO, I think he could have done much better with handloads.)

 

[M2 Carbine]

Some handguns do quite well at "carbine range". For instance the Kel Tec PLR is more accurate at 100 yards than many carbines/rifles, as are many long barrel revolvers.

Even many/most of what's considered belly guns will hit a man size target most of the time at 100 yards.

As hksw said, "It could probably be more due to the shooters' capabilities".


Of course the one disadvantage the handgun length barrel has, shooting the same ammo as the carbine, is the loss in velocity.

 

[.38 Special]

My experience at the range (Los Angeles area) has been that the huge majority of "assault rifles" are manned by teenagers and inner-city jackasses, and firing whatever steel cased blasting ammo was on sale at Big 5. Few of these people even know how to use the sights, let alone adjust them correctly, not that it really matters because they tend to have their eyes closed anyway.

Yes, it is easy to outshoot these people with handguns. Or rocks, for that matter.

There is often, however, at least one high-power guy there with his mousegun. He cannot be beaten with a revolver.

All of which is a long way of saying, like several other folks already have, that it ain't about the gun.

Oh, and whoever cast aspersions about revolvers at 50 meters really needs to go to a PPC match!

 

[bogie]

A while back, went to the range with a buddy. He'd just mounted a new scope on his SKS...

I was shooting a 6" Dan Wesson .357.

My groups were better at 75 yards.

I think this was a function more of equipment than of skill tho...

 

[.38 Special]

Yeah, the SKS with blasting ammo...

In my younger days, I once made fun of a casual aquaintance for this poor shooting with a 7.62x39 Ruger Ranch Rifle. He finally got fed up with me, handed the gun over and said "Here."

Well, I moved my light bench gun out of the rest, settled the ranch rifle in firmly, checked my wind flags, and promptly laid down an 8" group at 100 yards.

So yeah, it isn't ALWAYS the shooters fault.

 

[rangerruck]

Also, some bullets, such as a 223 and a lot of other jacketed, cored, partitioned type bullets , need the extra speed, for their prescribed terminal ballistics to act properly. I dont think this matters with a 44 mag bullet however.
And so the rifle bullets in a longer tube, will do what they are designed to do , out to a much longer distance.

 

[Skofnung]

Other than capsity what am I loosing compared to the typical carbine?

If you are talking about a .44 mag pistol vs a .44 mag carbine, you are losing a bunch of velocity. I'm to understand that a .44 magnum carbine using modern ammo has more muzzle energy than the old .45-70 Trapdoor loadings.

As to accuracy, a given marksman with a rifle/carbine of good quality will generally outshoot a marksman with a quality handgun of equal or lesser skill at any given range.

It seems that you are a better marksman than the other fellows shooting the carbines. That, or they have problems with the gun/ammo they are using such as a dinged muzzle crown or crappy ammo.