military .308 ball in a bolt rifle question

Status
Not open for further replies.

geo57

Member
Joined
Jan 18, 2003
Messages
610
Location
South Central Nebraska
do any of you have 1st hand experiences using portuguese or south african military surplus 7.62 nato in your commercial .308 bolt action rifles ? i shoot a savage 111 and for casual plinking the price of this stuff is attractive but if you've had any problems using surplus, i would like to know about it. thanks for your feedback.
 
Tried some Portuguese surplus out in my new Savage.

Every shot went bang, but I couldn't milk any more than 6" @ 150 yards out of it. Federal Gold-Metal Match got me 1.75" groups (edge to edge) at 150. I gave the rest of the battle pack away. Great plinking ammo for shortish range or getting near the paper, but not such a great idea for any sort of long-range work.
 
I'll have to add confusion to the issue.... ;)

I too have tried the Port surplus in my (relatively) new Savage .308. While it is by no means match grade ammo, I have been able to get consistant 3-4" groups out of it at 200 yds. For the price, I would have to say that is more than acceptable. Also, given the price difference I am much more inclined to spend a lot more time practicing with my .308 than I would otherwise.

I would not be surprised if some batches are better than others, thus the difference in experience between cordex and myself. However, for the price I don't think you can go too far wrong.
 
Becareful with Mil Surplus .308 in bolts. Tried this in a Savage once the bolt was really really really hard to open afterwords.

See what works for you and shoot it.
 
I use the surplus in a remington adl and find it acceptable for what I want. I am still learning to shoot a bolt action well and now that I stuck a scope on it I have found I need to work hard to adjust mentally for changing distances and scope settings. Portugese surplus works fine for this.

I always have surplus around for my other rifles, so using it in the bolt action was a good reason to get the bolt action.

The premium ammo groups better and I shoot it as well. But I feel the surplus 308 has let me shoot the gun a whole lot more than I would have if I just had premium stuff.
 
I agree with No.4Mk1. The Port .308 is good practice and plinking ammo. I, also, got 3-4" groups with it out to 200 yards. I like the sub-MOA groups I get with FGMM but for inexpensive "fun" shooting, the Port is good. 45R, I am surprised that you had that kind of problem with this ammo. From what I've learned, .308 military ammo is loaded to lesser pressures than commercial ammo so there should not be a problem in a bolt action. Now, .223 is a different story as the pressures are reversed. However, I have often read comments by Art and others that they shoot .223 milsurp in bolts and have no problems. Anyway, each firearm is different and your mileage might vary! :)
 
the only mil-surp I have had trouble with is the CAVIM stuff in the OD green boxes wth the yellow print from Centeral/South America somewheres. Hard to eject.
 
Here are my experiences with South African and Portuguese .308 surplus in my Remington 700 Ti.

I have experienced about 3 slightly harder bolt lifts with SA surplus out of about 40 fired, 2 while the rifle was almost brand new. I have chronographed 6 rounds over 2 different range sessions and came up with an average of 2640 fps, with an extreme spread of 57.5 fps, which appears to be a rather normal to low end velocity for 150 grain rounds. Primers look OK to my unsophisticated eye. The problem is that I am getting some scraping on the rear of the cases that is being caused by either the ejector and the extractor. It does not appear to be an indentation like the classic pressure sign pictures. I do not get this with any other rounds I have used, whether Portuguese surplus, Federal High Energy 180's at 2636 fps, or handloads with Barnes 165 gr XLCs at 2600. I have not had a chance to post pictures to this forum to get comments from the gurus. For now, I have suspended use of these. It's a shame, too, because I have gotten some great 3-shot 200 yard groups. And whenever I can get 2 rounds touching dead center in the target at 200, I get pretty excited, because I'm not that good.

The Portuguese feels hotter, and 3 rounds averaged 2751.3 with an extreme spread of 34.9 fps. This chrono group was shot the same day as one string with the SA. No bolt lift problems, no marks on the case, primers look OK to me. Go figure. It doesn't seem to be as accurate for me as any of the other factory or handloaded rounds I have been using, so I haven't shot much of it.

I will post pictures when I get some free time.

I can load better than factory quality ammo for about 40 cents a round using standard bullets ($1 for the most expensive premiums), using new brass for each round. The surplus is costing about 17-20 cents a round. Considering that I may only fire 25 rounds during a range session, the cost difference isn't significant to me.
 
I've put hundreds of rounds of South African milsurp through my Ruger M77 International. Works fine, no problems at all, and pretty accurate, too. I recently tried the Portuguese and it's also good. Works just fine.
 
I use British Radway-Green ammo with no trouble, very accurate for surplus stuff. Use in different guns will vary but mine will do 1" at 100yds with it.:)
 
guys i really appreciate the feedback of the experiences you've had in your bolts with the mil surp i mentioned. i notice most of the SA & Port i see advertised was made in the 70's. i know ammo kept in proper conditions will last a long time, but any concerns among you on this stuff which could be 30 years old?. if you have sources that has fresher SA or Portugese than this, i'd appreciate the tip. thanks again...
 
That is a valid concern about older, especially older military, ammo. However, the Port I have is that old and I haven't had one misfire, etc. I have a feeling that most of the milsurp on the market has been stored in warehouses and hasn't undergone the rigors of excessive heat or cold. Anyway, all the South African, Portuguese and British milsurp I've ever used has been very reliable.
 
Best (i.e. most accurate) milsurp 7.62mm. NATO ammo I've ever used was the Hirtenberger stuff from Austria. I stocked up on it a couple of years ago. Very nice indeed - sub-1" groups sometimes from my Steyr Scout, which is absolutely the best accuracy I've ever had from any caliber of milsurp ammo. I still have over 1,000 rounds socked away in my ammo stash...

:D
 
ok, thanks again. this helps me decide. as far as the age issue, i think stuff will ususally go bang, but with some ammo in certain circumstances, tests have shown some ammo will degrade a bit and reflect this in lower velocities..
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top